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Players are turning against Sing... and they should

Originally posted by fropwns:
Originally posted by dj43:
I'm not sure if Singletary has "lost" the team or not but he has certainly lost the offense.

At this point in their careers, players, even rookies, are capable of recognizing when the coaches are bringing in new things or game plans that allow players to be in position to make plays. It is clear from the comments the last two weeks that the players are questioning whether or not the coaches are helping.

From Singletary we hear that the main problem is the offensive line, and that certainly appears to be a portion of it. However, as I look at both the play DESIGNS and the play SELECTION, I see no scheme or plan that shows any forethought. I have seen D-2 HIGH SCHOOL teams with more creative game plans than the 49ers. I just do not believe that this entire line is not capable of better play than we have seen. There is so much that eludes a superficial vision of what is wrong with the team, and most of it relates to OL play. The current play selection demands each player win a one-on-one battle each play instead of schemes where they take advantage of traps and misdirection and angles. Until this changes, Gore will not be able to run. Martz, the alleged pass crazed maniac, had a much better running game than Sing/Raye and it was because he set up plays in sequences that allowed the offense to fool the defense.

What we are seeing with Singletary is the classic problem that virtually ALL former star players have when they attempt to coach or manage the game. Because of their own superior athletic ability and ability to focus, they achieve incredible levels of success. Singletary didn't need a scheme in order to succeed. He had an incredible work ethic that combined with athletic ability and instinct for the game, that he could just WILL himself to overcome the opponent. As a result, he is now drawing on his own experience to try to direct this team, and it isn't working. Bill Russell had the same problem with basketball, Pete Rose in baseball, etc., all have had the same problem - they just don't realize how critical schemes are in allowing the "average" player the opportunity to utilize what they do well.

I like Singletary as a person and a motivator but these final games will tell whether he has the ability to understand the average player well enough to be a successful coach. Raye, is not THE problem, he is a PART of the problem. The problem is that Singletary MUST recognize you cannot WILL a team to victory. You must scheme, plan, deceive, misdirect, balance, blend, etc., etc., etc.

The SPREAD per se, is not the answer. Even though the spread has been more successful, even there the routes are overly simplistic and the runs are so predictable any HS player can read them. Until the staff recognizes the importance of fooling the opponent instead of just "imposing your will' (over-powering) on them, this offense will contineu to fail.

The defensive issues are related to an offense with no direction. Sunday the DBs played so far off the receivers it took a $20 taxi ride to get in the same zip code with them...but that is another thread with the same conclusion- the current version of Mike Singletary is not going to be a .500 team.

You have just restored my faith in Ninertalk.

Thank You

Great post!
Originally posted by Ceadderman:
Originally posted by djfullshred:
Originally posted by Ceadderman:
Originally posted by djfullshred:
It's amusing to me that a rookie has the balls to speak up, but the QB does not. Weak sauce from the QB in all this mess.

Hold up now. 3 years ago Alex got ROASTED by fans because he spoke up when he was hit with a tough question about his shoulder and whether or not he let Nolan in on the problem. Now you want it 180 degrees the other direction?

Just stop. Please just stop.

Alex ain't the powers that be. He does what he is SUPPOSED to do and that is to listen to the boss and put his best foot forward from there. Now you basically want him to have a moment reminiscent of Steve v. George on the sideline.

Newsflash, Alex shouldn't have to say anything more than what his play on the field dictates. And that is that this team should be running a BALANCE of spread with other things thrown in for good measure.

Imagine how this team could shock the league if they actually put two halves of solid Offense on the field in the same game. Not in two losing halves. That Offense would make the '99 Rams look like... well it would make them look like they were plodding oafs more than they were a scoring machine. And to me it's SCARY how much they've been held back. It's the job of the Coaching staff to identify and adjust accordingly. Not Alex's to "speak up". Kid shouldn't have too.

~Ceadder

Kid is the operative word. Hopefully he acts more like a man if they are going to keep him around as starter.

Kid cause I'm 40 and meant as a term of respect. Nothing more and nothing less.

~Ceadder

Different philosophies on syntax between us. I am 44, and only call someone in their 20's a kid if I don't respect them. It is a condescending term in the professional world imo.
Originally posted by dj43:
I'm not sure if Singletary has "lost" the team or not but he has certainly lost the offense.

At this point in their careers, players, even rookies, are capable of recognizing when the coaches are bringing in new things or game plans that allow players to be in position to make plays. It is clear from the comments the last two weeks that the players are questioning whether or not the coaches are helping.

From Singletary we hear that the main problem is the offensive line, and that certainly appears to be a portion of it. However, as I look at both the play DESIGNS and the play SELECTION, I see no scheme or plan that shows any forethought. I have seen D-2 HIGH SCHOOL teams with more creative game plans than the 49ers. I just do not believe that this entire line is not capable of better play than we have seen. There is so much that eludes a superficial vision of what is wrong with the team, and most of it relates to OL play. The current play selection demands each player win a one-on-one battle each play instead of schemes where they take advantage of traps and misdirection and angles. Until this changes, Gore will not be able to run. Martz, the alleged pass crazed maniac, had a much better running game than Sing/Raye and it was because he set up plays in sequences that allowed the offense to fool the defense.

What we are seeing with Singletary is the classic problem that virtually ALL former star players have when they attempt to coach or manage the game. Because of their own superior athletic ability and ability to focus, they achieve incredible levels of success. Singletary didn't need a scheme in order to succeed. He had an incredible work ethic that combined with athletic ability and instinct for the game, that he could just WILL himself to overcome the opponent. As a result, he is now drawing on his own experience to try to direct this team, and it isn't working. Bill Russell had the same problem with basketball, Pete Rose in baseball, etc., all have had the same problem - they just don't realize how critical schemes are in allowing the "average" player the opportunity to utilize what they do well.

I like Singletary as a person and a motivator but these final games will tell whether he has the ability to understand the average player well enough to be a successful coach. Raye, is not THE problem, he is a PART of the problem. The problem is that Singletary MUST recognize you cannot WILL a team to victory. You must scheme, plan, deceive, misdirect, balance, blend, etc., etc., etc.

The SPREAD per se, is not the answer. Even though the spread has been more successful, even there the routes are overly simplistic and the runs are so predictable any HS player can read them. Until the staff recognizes the importance of fooling the opponent instead of just "imposing your will' (over-powering) on them, this offense will contineu to fail.

The defensive issues are related to an offense with no direction. Sunday the DBs played so far off the receivers it took a $20 taxi ride to get in the same zip code with them...but that is another thread with the same conclusion- the current version of Mike Singletary is not going to be a .500 team.

And this, my friends, is why dj43 is one of the best, and most respected posters on the board. Well-done!
I think Willis or Jennings can beat up Sing, what do you guys think?
  • Nes49
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 5,345
Originally posted by djfullshred:
Originally posted by Ceadderman:
Originally posted by djfullshred:
Originally posted by Ceadderman:
Originally posted by djfullshred:
It's amusing to me that a rookie has the balls to speak up, but the QB does not. Weak sauce from the QB in all this mess.

Hold up now. 3 years ago Alex got ROASTED by fans because he spoke up when he was hit with a tough question about his shoulder and whether or not he let Nolan in on the problem. Now you want it 180 degrees the other direction?

Just stop. Please just stop.

Alex ain't the powers that be. He does what he is SUPPOSED to do and that is to listen to the boss and put his best foot forward from there. Now you basically want him to have a moment reminiscent of Steve v. George on the sideline.

Newsflash, Alex shouldn't have to say anything more than what his play on the field dictates. And that is that this team should be running a BALANCE of spread with other things thrown in for good measure.

Imagine how this team could shock the league if they actually put two halves of solid Offense on the field in the same game. Not in two losing halves. That Offense would make the '99 Rams look like... well it would make them look like they were plodding oafs more than they were a scoring machine. And to me it's SCARY how much they've been held back. It's the job of the Coaching staff to identify and adjust accordingly. Not Alex's to "speak up". Kid shouldn't have too.

~Ceadder

Kid is the operative word. Hopefully he acts more like a man if they are going to keep him around as starter.

Kid cause I'm 40 and meant as a term of respect. Nothing more and nothing less.

~Ceadder

Different philosophies on syntax between us. I am 44, and only call someone in their 20's a kid if I don't respect them. It is a condescending term in the professional world imo.

Wow DJ...Your old....
Agree...and well they should. They feel the offense surge when they're in the spread...it's what Alex did so well under Meyer at Utah. The key difference is he won't be running it much, but the idea is to spread the defense so they have to cover the entire field. It works. If you're a smart coach, you go with what works. Singletary's stubborn...in his mind, he still thinks we can be a smash-mouth offense. That's one of the hazards of having a defensive-minded coach running the show. It can work, but only if you have a TOP OC, and Jimmy Raye's clearly not close to that. My solution? If Singletary can't or won't see the light, then Jed needs to grow a pair and end this before it drags on any longer. Bring in a Holmgren or Shanahan...someone who knows offense and how to get it to a high level. Someone who understands how to build an effective OL...I'm sick and tired of being a team in transition. Enough!! Coach needs to either poop or get off the pot. He walked into a much better situation than Nolan did. He should've benefitted from the 3 1/2 years he was his asst. Fire & brimstone works to motivate your players...to an extent. Smart coaching will propel them even farther. Coach...are you up to it???
  • Mex49
  • Member
  • Posts: 2,979
Originally posted by znk916:
I think Willis or Jennings can beat up Sing, what do you guys think?

The recess bell just rang, so I will have to tell you after kick ball
[ Edited by Mex49 on Nov 24, 2009 at 12:56 PM ]
Originally posted by fropwns:
Originally posted by dj43:
I'm not sure if Singletary has "lost" the team or not but he has certainly lost the offense.

At this point in their careers, players, even rookies, are capable of recognizing when the coaches are bringing in new things or game plans that allow players to be in position to make plays. It is clear from the comments the last two weeks that the players are questioning whether or not the coaches are helping.

From Singletary we hear that the main problem is the offensive line, and that certainly appears to be a portion of it. However, as I look at both the play DESIGNS and the play SELECTION, I see no scheme or plan that shows any forethought. I have seen D-2 HIGH SCHOOL teams with more creative game plans than the 49ers. I just do not believe that this entire line is not capable of better play than we have seen. There is so much that eludes a superficial vision of what is wrong with the team, and most of it relates to OL play. The current play selection demands each player win a one-on-one battle each play instead of schemes where they take advantage of traps and misdirection and angles. Until this changes, Gore will not be able to run. Martz, the alleged pass crazed maniac, had a much better running game than Sing/Raye and it was because he set up plays in sequences that allowed the offense to fool the defense.

What we are seeing with Singletary is the classic problem that virtually ALL former star players have when they attempt to coach or manage the game. Because of their own superior athletic ability and ability to focus, they achieve incredible levels of success. Singletary didn't need a scheme in order to succeed. He had an incredible work ethic that combined with athletic ability and instinct for the game, that he could just WILL himself to overcome the opponent. As a result, he is now drawing on his own experience to try to direct this team, and it isn't working. Bill Russell had the same problem with basketball, Pete Rose in baseball, etc., all have had the same problem - they just don't realize how critical schemes are in allowing the "average" player the opportunity to utilize what they do well.

I like Singletary as a person and a motivator but these final games will tell whether he has the ability to understand the average player well enough to be a successful coach. Raye, is not THE problem, he is a PART of the problem. The problem is that Singletary MUST recognize you cannot WILL a team to victory. You must scheme, plan, deceive, misdirect, balance, blend, etc., etc., etc.

The SPREAD per se, is not the answer. Even though the spread has been more successful, even there the routes are overly simplistic and the runs are so predictable any HS player can read them. Until the staff recognizes the importance of fooling the opponent instead of just "imposing your will' (over-powering) on them, this offense will contineu to fail.

The defensive issues are related to an offense with no direction. Sunday the DBs played so far off the receivers it took a $20 taxi ride to get in the same zip code with them...but that is another thread with the same conclusion- the current version of Mike Singletary is not going to be a .500 team.

You have just restored my faith in Ninertalk.

Thank You
You are welcome.