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Team Speed at W.R. Positions?

Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:
Originally posted by KknighthawkK_9er:
Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:
Originally posted by WeAreLegend:
Yes its terrible. We have the slowest receivers in the league. None of them will have a 100 yard game. The team is no good. We are going nowhere. The team should be sold. Its Singletary's fault, Nolan's fault, Smith's fault, Martz's fault, and Denise Debartolo's fault.



For what it's worth, Arizona probably has the slowest receiving corps in the league.

Both Boldin and Breaston are burners. Fitzgerald has average speed for a WR.

Dude, seriously, are you just making things up as you go along?

Boldin fell to Zona in the draft because he ran a 4.71 40 yard dash at the combine. A 4.71

Fitz ran a 4.63

Breaston ran about a 4.5 as I recall.

Given that scouts think of 4.6 as the cutoff point for being too slow to be a pro WR, Zona almost definitely has the slowest starting pair of WRs (both over the 4.6 mark), and probably has the slowest corp overall also.

The discussion of track speed is virtually meaningless. Alot of track guys look slow as molasses on the football field, and alot of guys with slow track times have exceptional game speed and are rarely caught on the field; our own Jerry is a prime example. So, bringing up 40 times is pointless except to illustrate how little it means when actually playing the game.
  • BobS
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 7,710
Wasn't Jerry Rice a 4.65? I do think he was a 4.3 when someone was chasing him, once he broke into the open field he was gone most of the time. So I would say speed at the WR position is over rated. Anyone remember Renaldo Nehemiah?
Originally posted by stevenking57:
If this has been posted already-Sorry.
Is it me or do our wide receivers seem to be caught from behind a lot? Crabtree, I think, will be a solid receiver, but he so far has not shown break away speed. Hill and Morgan also look to be good young receivers too, but again no break away speed. I've noticed that the games we've played so far, our W.R.'s get single coverage. Is there a speed burner in the draft that we could get that would demand double coverage? Could Jones be that that guy?

Hill ran I believe a 4.32 in the 40 so he's got the speed we just haven't seen him use it yet but I hope we do soon.
you can't throw deep if you have no time to let the recievers get deep. Not the qb's fault.
Originally posted by Super5:
Originally posted by stevenking57:
If this has been posted already-Sorry.
Is it me or do our wide receivers seem to be caught from behind a lot? Crabtree, I think, will be a solid receiver, but he so far has not shown break away speed. Hill and Morgan also look to be good young receivers too, but again no break away speed. I've noticed that the games we've played so far, our W.R.'s get single coverage. Is there a speed burner in the draft that we could get that would demand double coverage? Could Jones be that that guy?

Hill ran I believe a 4.32 in the 40 so he's got the speed we just haven't seen him use it yet but I hope we do soon.

Hill has the speed, but most people that watched him play before the draft were quick to point out that hes does not play at 4.32 speed.
Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:
Originally posted by KknighthawkK_9er:
Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:
Originally posted by WeAreLegend:
Yes its terrible. We have the slowest receivers in the league. None of them will have a 100 yard game. The team is no good. We are going nowhere. The team should be sold. Its Singletary's fault, Nolan's fault, Smith's fault, Martz's fault, and Denise Debartolo's fault.



For what it's worth, Arizona probably has the slowest receiving corps in the league.

Both Boldin and Breaston are burners. Fitzgerald has average speed for a WR.

Dude, seriously, are you just making things up as you go along?

Boldin fell to Zona in the draft because he ran a 4.71 40 yard dash at the combine. A 4.71

Fitz ran a 4.63

Breaston ran about a 4.5 as I recall.

Given that scouts think of 4.6 as the cutoff point for being too slow to be a pro WR, Zona almost definitely has the slowest starting pair of WRs (both over the 4.6 mark), and probably has the slowest corp overall also.

Boldin never ran a 4.71 at the combine.

Not only is he NOT slow, he is one of the fastest receivers in the game.

You are obviously new to football. You must be one of those "combine" folks that bets the farm based on how a player performs in irrelevant drills, without pads.

You actually have to WATCH football to figure some of this stuff out. Good luck
Originally posted by KknighthawkK_9er:
Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:
Originally posted by KknighthawkK_9er:
Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:
Originally posted by WeAreLegend:
Yes its terrible. We have the slowest receivers in the league. None of them will have a 100 yard game. The team is no good. We are going nowhere. The team should be sold. Its Singletary's fault, Nolan's fault, Smith's fault, Martz's fault, and Denise Debartolo's fault.



For what it's worth, Arizona probably has the slowest receiving corps in the league.

Both Boldin and Breaston are burners. Fitzgerald has average speed for a WR.

Dude, seriously, are you just making things up as you go along?

Boldin fell to Zona in the draft because he ran a 4.71 40 yard dash at the combine. A 4.71

Fitz ran a 4.63

Breaston ran about a 4.5 as I recall.

Given that scouts think of 4.6 as the cutoff point for being too slow to be a pro WR, Zona almost definitely has the slowest starting pair of WRs (both over the 4.6 mark), and probably has the slowest corp overall also.

Boldin never ran a 4.71 at the combine.

Not only is he NOT slow, he is one of the fastest receivers in the game.

You are obviously new to football. You must be one of those "combine" folks that bets the farm based on how a player performs in irrelevant drills, without pads.

You actually have to WATCH football to figure some of this stuff out. Good luck

Boldin ran a 4.71 at the combine, fact.

If you are trying to say he plays faster than a 4.71 in pads, fine. But at Indy, before the draft he did run a 4.71

http://www.draftstock.com/site_main/content/view/185/26/
[ Edited by jta854 on Nov 20, 2009 at 9:41 AM ]
Originally posted by jta854:
Originally posted by Super5:
Originally posted by stevenking57:
If this has been posted already-Sorry.
Is it me or do our wide receivers seem to be caught from behind a lot? Crabtree, I think, will be a solid receiver, but he so far has not shown break away speed. Hill and Morgan also look to be good young receivers too, but again no break away speed. I've noticed that the games we've played so far, our W.R.'s get single coverage. Is there a speed burner in the draft that we could get that would demand double coverage? Could Jones be that that guy?

Hill ran I believe a 4.32 in the 40 so he's got the speed we just haven't seen him use it yet but I hope we do soon.

Hill has the speed, but most people that watched him play before the draft were quick to point out that hes does not play at 4.32 speed.

I'm astounded that people still quote Hill's combine time, since it seems to be well-known (by most anyway) that he doesn't play anywhere close to that on the field. Is he still fast? I guess so, but haven't really seen it yet. but, i'd still rather see him get a shot over the underachieving Morgan.
There is 40 speed times and there is football speed. I think that every one gets that fact. By whatever measure we use to talk about speed on the football field, our W.R's don't seem to have the speed to out run the defense when they get a step or two on the defenders. We need a W.R. that puts the fear of God into D.B.'s so that they need double coverage help from the safeties. A burner would increase the production from the other W.R.'s and the T.E. position. It would also take one more guy OUT of the box which would help our running game. Are there any prospects on this years draft?
  • KID9R
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 1,965
Originally posted by KknighthawkK_9er:
Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:
Originally posted by KknighthawkK_9er:
Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:
Originally posted by WeAreLegend:
Yes its terrible. We have the slowest receivers in the league. None of them will have a 100 yard game. The team is no good. We are going nowhere. The team should be sold. Its Singletary's fault, Nolan's fault, Smith's fault, Martz's fault, and Denise Debartolo's fault.



For what it's worth, Arizona probably has the slowest receiving corps in the league.

Both Boldin and Breaston are burners. Fitzgerald has average speed for a WR.

Dude, seriously, are you just making things up as you go along?

Boldin fell to Zona in the draft because he ran a 4.71 40 yard dash at the combine. A 4.71

Fitz ran a 4.63

Breaston ran about a 4.5 as I recall.

Given that scouts think of 4.6 as the cutoff point for being too slow to be a pro WR, Zona almost definitely has the slowest starting pair of WRs (both over the 4.6 mark), and probably has the slowest corp overall also.

Boldin never ran a 4.71 at the combine.

Not only is he NOT slow, he is one of the fastest receivers in the game.

You are obviously new to football. You must be one of those "combine" folks that bets the farm based on how a player performs in irrelevant drills, without pads.

You actually have to WATCH football to figure some of this stuff out. Good luck

Your on glue! I bet if you took all the WR's in the league he'd probably be in the bottom third for speed.
  • soao
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 59
We have two receivers in Jones and Smith that have good speed but Sing has hardly put either one on the field yet. You can say track speed, football speed all you want, but if you run a 4.32, you are fast. All these players train specifically for the combine 40 because they know millions are riding on their timed speed. Smith might not play like 4.32 on the field, but there's plenty of room for him to be fast. How would we know when Sing has an 80 year old man averaging 20 yards a game as the #1?
Originally posted by 4evrfan:
Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:
Originally posted by KknighthawkK_9er:
Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:
Originally posted by WeAreLegend:
Yes its terrible. We have the slowest receivers in the league. None of them will have a 100 yard game. The team is no good. We are going nowhere. The team should be sold. Its Singletary's fault, Nolan's fault, Smith's fault, Martz's fault, and Denise Debartolo's fault.



For what it's worth, Arizona probably has the slowest receiving corps in the league.

Both Boldin and Breaston are burners. Fitzgerald has average speed for a WR.

Dude, seriously, are you just making things up as you go along?

Boldin fell to Zona in the draft because he ran a 4.71 40 yard dash at the combine. A 4.71

Fitz ran a 4.63

Breaston ran about a 4.5 as I recall.

Given that scouts think of 4.6 as the cutoff point for being too slow to be a pro WR, Zona almost definitely has the slowest starting pair of WRs (both over the 4.6 mark), and probably has the slowest corp overall also.

The discussion of track speed is virtually meaningless. Alot of track guys look slow as molasses on the football field, and alot of guys with slow track times have exceptional game speed and are rarely caught on the field; our own Jerry is a prime example. So, bringing up 40 times is pointless except to illustrate how little it means when actually playing the game.

We're on the same page, and I couldn't agree more. The problem is that the only universal standard we have is 40 time. If we want to talk about the speed of our receivers and we don't talk about that, we're left with meaningless hyperbole about who is fast and who isn't. For the amount of money invested in draft prospects, I have NO IDEA why the combine doesn't have players on the field, in pads, running timed routes around poles. It's actually kind of preposterous. I'd disagree with the assertion that there isn't some correlation between being fast on the track outside of pads and fast on the field in pads, but it's certainly imprecise to the say the least, and leads to a lot of nonsense (the obsession with Kory Sheets as a recent case).

As for speed, though, I still think people are wildly undervaluing two much more important factors:

a) taking good angles, something Jerry, TO, Fitz, Boldin and plenty of non-burners are very good at.

b) quarterbacks who can hit their receivers in stride allowing them to catch the ball at full speed (Jerry Rice having "breakaway speed" is also largely a function of Montana and Young throwing the ball to him his entire career).


Also, KknighthawkK_9er is a clown. That's all.
Originally posted by 4evrfan:
Originally posted by jta854:
Originally posted by Super5:
Originally posted by stevenking57:
If this has been posted already-Sorry.
Is it me or do our wide receivers seem to be caught from behind a lot? Crabtree, I think, will be a solid receiver, but he so far has not shown break away speed. Hill and Morgan also look to be good young receivers too, but again no break away speed. I've noticed that the games we've played so far, our W.R.'s get single coverage. Is there a speed burner in the draft that we could get that would demand double coverage? Could Jones be that that guy?

Hill ran I believe a 4.32 in the 40 so he's got the speed we just haven't seen him use it yet but I hope we do soon.

Hill has the speed, but most people that watched him play before the draft were quick to point out that hes does not play at 4.32 speed.

I'm astounded that people still quote Hill's combine time, since it seems to be well-known (by most anyway) that he doesn't play anywhere close to that on the field. Is he still fast? I guess so, but haven't really seen it yet. but, i'd still rather see him get a shot over the underachieving Morgan.

I dunno. Hill has always looked very quick in and out of his cuts, and seems to get good separation pretty consistently as well. He's had hammy issues, which could be part of it also. From the limited amount he's played (which admittedly hasn't been much), I think he's as fast as advertised. I don't recall any long passes really being thrown his way, to be honest.
Originally posted by stevenking57:
There is 40 speed times and there is football speed. I think that every one gets that fact. By whatever measure we use to talk about speed on the football field, our W.R's don't seem to have the speed to out run the defense when they get a step or two on the defenders. We need a W.R. that puts the fear of God into D.B.'s so that they need double coverage help from the safeties. A burner would increase the production from the other W.R.'s and the T.E. position. It would also take one more guy OUT of the box which would help our running game. Are there any prospects on this years draft?

This is the same argument people made when we signed Lelie. It doesn't hold water. DBs are afraid of good wide receivers, not fast ones. Defensive coordinators shade coverages and double team good wide receivers, not fast ones.