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Team Speed at W.R. Positions?

Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by MaliCali:
When have you ever seen Jason Hill run a go route, or have the ball with room in front of him?

No way Morgan should be starting over Jason. Jason does nothing but make plays, Morgan does nothing but make you hold your breath when the ball is thrown in his direction.

Morgan is starting over Hill because of his blocking
If you want to see Niner wideouts running free then we have to get an oline that can block for 5-6 seconds while they can execute double moves. It's very difficult for the WR's to get any separation after 2-3 seconds.
  • crzy
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 39,280
Speed is overrated.
Originally posted by crzy:
Speed is overrated.

Not in Madden....
Originally posted by backontop:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by MaliCali:
When have you ever seen Jason Hill run a go route, or have the ball with room in front of him?

No way Morgan should be starting over Jason. Jason does nothing but make plays, Morgan does nothing but make you hold your breath when the ball is thrown in his direction.

Morgan is starting over Hill because of his blocking

Yes he is. Hopefully we get to see more of the WRs as the 2nd half of season moves along.
Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:
It's not a problem, and WR speed is immensely overrated.

It's what caused Jerry Rice to fall in the draft. Fitz, Boldin, TO, Roddy White, Brandon Marshall, Vincent Jackson, Ochocinco, none of them are burners.

The obsession with speed is also a reason why the Raiders have fielded a squad of burners who don't make a competitive football team for the past decade. Look at their best player, Nnamdi, arguably the best defensive player in the NFL. The knock on him coming out is that he wasn't fast enough to play CB and would be best in a tampa 2.

Of course there's some great players who are fast (chris johnson, patrick willis) but there's no shortage of really fast players who suck or aren't that great (tatum bell, manny lawson). We learned this lesson with Lelie already. You really think Vernon is finally having a great (if still not top 10 pick) season because he got faster?

The reason you're not seeing long pass plays is because a) shaun hill could not throw the deep ball and b) alex smith has the arm strength but not the deep accuracy that allows a receiver to catch a 20 yard pass in stride.

Most importantly, no time to throw deep or look downfield
Originally posted by Ronnie49Lott:
If you want to see Niner wideouts running free then we have to get an oline that can block for 5-6 seconds while they can execute double moves. It's very difficult for the WR's to get any separation after 2-3 seconds.
I agree that our O-Line needs to pass block better, but our receivers should bot be caught from behind.
Jason Hill 4.32 40 yard dash.
  • jcs
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 8,342
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Personally I was very disappointed in the Bears game that on both deep ball attempts to Crabtree the CB was right there with him stride for stride.

It didn't help that the passes were underthrown and late...
Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Jason Hill 4.32 40 yard dash.

Doesn't mean squat if you don't play that fast, and he doesn't. Still, he;s faster than Morgan, Battle and Bruce. Don't know about Crabtree and jones though.
Originally posted by 4evrfan:
Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Jason Hill 4.32 40 yard dash.

Doesn't mean squat if you don't play that fast, and he doesn't. Still, he;s faster than Morgan, Battle and Bruce. Don't know about Crabtree and jones though.

He's faster than all those guys on track speed and game speed. He's better than Morgan but singFRAUD has a thing for Morgan. Why I don't know? Morgan pops the ball up in the air for interceptions, gets caught from behind and has long periods where he disappears. All Jason Hill does is make plays and score touchdowns.
Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Originally posted by 4evrfan:
Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Jason Hill 4.32 40 yard dash.

Doesn't mean squat if you don't play that fast, and he doesn't. Still, he;s faster than Morgan, Battle and Bruce. Don't know about Crabtree and jones though.

He's faster than all those guys on track speed and game speed. He's better than Morgan but singFRAUD has a thing for Morgan. Why I don't know? Morgan pops the ball up in the air for interceptions, gets caught from behind and has long periods where he disappears. All J.ason Hill does is make plays and score touchdowns



He may indeed be faster than all of them, but we really haven't seen Crabtree and Jones get an opportunity to showcase their speed yet. And Hill definitely doesn't play as fast as his track speed would suggest. As for Morgan, I totally agree with you and have a hunch it's because he's a Sing guy, in that he's "tough" and blocks well. It ignores the fact he has been average at best (and that's being generous) and has come up far short of his "potential". It's as if Sing chooses to ignore the facts and that is very perplexing and disturbing.
Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:
Originally posted by WeAreLegend:
Yes its terrible. We have the slowest receivers in the league. None of them will have a 100 yard game. The team is no good. We are going nowhere. The team should be sold. Its Singletary's fault, Nolan's fault, Smith's fault, Martz's fault, and Denise Debartolo's fault.



For what it's worth, Arizona probably has the slowest receiving corps in the league.

Both Boldin and Breaston are burners. Fitzgerald has average speed for a WR.
Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:
It's not a problem, and WR speed is immensely overrated.

It's what caused Jerry Rice to fall in the draft. Fitz, Boldin, TO, Roddy White, Brandon Marshall, Vincent Jackson, Ochocinco, none of them are burners.

The obsession with speed is also a reason why the Raiders have fielded a squad of burners who don't make a competitive football team for the past decade. Look at their best player, Nnamdi, arguably the best defensive player in the NFL. The knock on him coming out is that he wasn't fast enough to play CB and would be best in a tampa 2.

Of course there's some great players who are fast (chris johnson, patrick willis) but there's no shortage of really fast players who suck or aren't that great (tatum bell, manny lawson). We learned this lesson with Lelie already. You really think Vernon is finally having a great (if still not top 10 pick) season because he got faster?

The reason you're not seeing long pass plays is because a) shaun hill could not throw the deep ball and b) alex smith has the arm strength but not the deep accuracy that allows a receiver to catch a 20 yard pass in stride.
I realize that Rice MIGHT have had a slow clock time, BUT I don't remember him getting caught from behind much if ever. Our WR's seem to caught from behind a lot after the catch. There is difference between a possession receiver and a true deep threat. So far it seems we have all possession receivers and no burners who demand double coverage. IF we had such a receiver, it would really open up the passing game to V. Davis.
Originally posted by KknighthawkK_9er:
Originally posted by PopeyeJonesing:
Originally posted by WeAreLegend:
Yes its terrible. We have the slowest receivers in the league. None of them will have a 100 yard game. The team is no good. We are going nowhere. The team should be sold. Its Singletary's fault, Nolan's fault, Smith's fault, Martz's fault, and Denise Debartolo's fault.



For what it's worth, Arizona probably has the slowest receiving corps in the league.

Both Boldin and Breaston are burners. Fitzgerald has average speed for a WR.

Dude, seriously, are you just making things up as you go along?

Boldin fell to Zona in the draft because he ran a 4.71 40 yard dash at the combine. A 4.71

Fitz ran a 4.63

Breaston ran about a 4.5 as I recall.

Given that scouts think of 4.6 as the cutoff point for being too slow to be a pro WR, Zona almost definitely has the slowest starting pair of WRs (both over the 4.6 mark), and probably has the slowest corp overall also.