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Did Shaun Hill do/say something wrong?

Shaun seems like a good enough guy and teammate. Probably pays his taxes and helps old ladies across the street. He just has no arm whatsoever, which is like forcing he entire offense to play with one arm tied behind their back.

I am not saying Alex is the answer, but I know that Shaun isn't.
stupid thread
Originally posted by DaveWilcox:
Shaun seems like a good enough guy and teammate. Probably pays his taxes and helps old ladies across the street. He just has no arm whatsoever, which is like forcing he entire offense to play with one arm tied behind their back.

I am not saying Alex is the answer, but I know that Shaun isn't.

True. It's a bad situation that will become worse if Smith doesn't get it together by the end of the year.
Originally posted by Method:
What Hill did was go home instead of staying here to pass with Crabtree. If you tell me this didn't make a difference in Singletary's head when comparing the two Quarterbacks, you're being delusional.

I don't know if you can tell Method...but it was always meant for Alex to eventually get one last chance to start or what ever....even if it meant our season...and that is what it seems like is happening...

before Sing was retained as HC...it was reported about how they (front office) wanted a coach who could still salvage Alex's career.....Sing told them that he felt had a bad deal in his first few years and believed in him....I'm sure that helped out alittle bit in the decision....

So I'm sure every little thing was considered when looking for a reason to start Alex again....... they gave him every opportunity in OTAs,Training Camp, PreSeason to "win" the starting role....but Alex couldn't do it convincingly, just like Alex couldn't beat out Rattay even though the starting Job was basically given to him, in his rookie year..... then after a few games where Rattay played fine...had 5tds in 3 games...but was still pulled after struggling in the first half against the Cards......3.5 games into the Season that we were TOLD we were going to play to win the WEST...but the keys were given to Alex........so again...after a few set of games....the keys are given to him again.....when were TOLD that we were going to play to win the WEST...

like a said a while ago....although I hope and expect Alex to pick up his game....Singletary is taking a very dangerous risk with putting all chips on Alex, like Nolan did......Sing has been here this whole time...he should know first hand about depending solely on Alex......

but, as I have said before....maybe this was part of the deal, as far as getting the gig....playing Alex if the opportunity was there.... I mean, when other players on our team were making mistakes....Sing was telling them off....no nonsense.....but with Alex...it was kind of pathetic seeing Singletary on that podium making excuses for all those turnovers.....one or two maybe....haha.....man it looked like he was reaching.....the Great Mike Singletary....did not look like the Singletary I have watched or heard these past year.
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Originally posted by Afrikan:
Originally posted by Method:
What Hill did was go home instead of staying here to pass with Crabtree. If you tell me this didn't make a difference in Singletary's head when comparing the two Quarterbacks, you're being delusional.

I don't know if you can tell Method...but it was always meant for Alex to eventually get one last chance to start or what ever....even if it meant our season...and that is what it seems like is happening...

before Sing was retained as HC...it was reported about how they (front office) wanted a coach who could still salvage Alex's career.....Sing told them that he felt had a bad deal in his first few years and believed in him....I'm sure that helped out alittle bit in the decision....

So I'm sure every little thing was considered when looking for a reason to start Alex again....... they gave him every opportunity in OTAs,Training Camp, PreSeason to "win" the starting role....but Alex couldn't do it convincingly, just like Alex couldn't beat out Rattay even though the starting Job was basically given to him, in his rookie year..... then after a few games where Rattay played fine...had 5tds in 3 games...but was still pulled after struggling in the first half against the Cards......3.5 games into the Season that we were TOLD we were going to play to win the WEST...but the keys were given to Alex........so again...after a few set of games....the keys are given to him again.....when were TOLD that we were going to play to win the WEST...

like a said a while ago....although I hope and expect Alex to pick up his game....Singletary is taking a very dangerous risk with putting all chips on Alex, like Nolan did......Sing has been here this whole time...he should know first hand about depending solely on Alex......

but, as I have said before....maybe this was part of the deal, as far as getting the gig....playing Alex if the opportunity was there.... I mean, when other players on our team were making mistakes....Sing was telling them off....no nonsense.....but with Alex...it was kind of pathetic seeing Singletary on that podium making excuses for all those turnovers.....one or two maybe....haha.....man it looked like he was reaching.....the Great Mike Singletary....did not look like the Singletary I have watched or heard these past year.

I don't think it's dangerous for Singletary to do that. That wasn't Singletary's hand-chosen QB. Just like a new GM, the previous GM/HC is responsible for acquiring a bust in the draft - if the new GM can get production, cool, if not, time to find someone else.

That's where Singletary lands in this situation.
Originally posted by Method:
What Hill did was go home instead of staying here to pass with Crabtree. If you tell me this didn't make a difference in Singletary's head when comparing the two Quarterbacks, you're being delusional.

Interesting take.

We know Alex stayed behind. We also know that 1) alex continued on with meetings last year even after being out all year and he DID NOT have to (at least under the NFLPA collective bargaining agreement -- if you are hurt and out you don't have to attend team meetings); 2) take a pay cut to stay with the team and he felt he had unfinished business here; 3) alex swore for the first time this training camp (that we know of); 4) was patient and bided his time but support his good friend (Hill) during this season

Yet, they STILL call him Alex Leaf

The guy has been Nolanized, thrown under the bus, thrown on his shoulder by Rocky Bernard (courtesy of Larry Allen and Heitmann), questioned in the media and on this fora, called a prima donna, given a new word in the dictionary (Alexcuses), hated, loved, loathed, ridiculed.

All by the ripe age of 25.

Me, I don't know if Alex is the answer. I know what I saw against the Titans. I know that Gore ran pretty darn good out of the shotgun (4 times in a row). In fact, it was Gore's 2nd 100 yard game of the season. We know the other one where he ran for 2 80 plus runs, that doesn't really count now does it.

Alex has a report with VD, Crabs, and Gore.

I like Hill. I think he has a place on this team. He can come in and be effective for 3 or 4 games. Beyond that, his limitations shine through.

Alex will either take this team to a playoff record (9-7) or die trying.

I'm rooting for the kid because he wants to be here, to be a 49er.

The offense has a lot of youth. Only Gore has been to a Pro Bowl. This is VD's coming out year. Crabs and Morgan, both immature WRs. In 1988 (our 3rd Super Bowl) we had JR and JT, they were veterans by that time.

Instead of all of the negativity, how about some positive energy for Alex. If he tanks, and the season goes to hell, then YES, I would love to see Nate play. From what I saw in preseason, the kid looked good. But, not until the playoffs are totally out of reach.

This team needs to make the playoffs. Badly. Just like it did with Garcia and Giants in 02. Garcia will always be one of my favorite 49ers.
Originally posted by Afrikan:
Originally posted by Method:
What Hill did was go home instead of staying here to pass with Crabtree. If you tell me this didn't make a difference in Singletary's head when comparing the two Quarterbacks, you're being delusional.

I don't know if you can tell Method...but it was always meant for Alex to eventually get one last chance to start or what ever....even if it meant our season...and that is what it seems like is happening...

before Sing was retained as HC...it was reported about how they (front office) wanted a coach who could still salvage Alex's career.....Sing told them that he felt had a bad deal in his first few years and believed in him....I'm sure that helped out alittle bit in the decision....

So I'm sure every little thing was considered when looking for a reason to start Alex again....... they gave him every opportunity in OTAs,Training Camp, PreSeason to "win" the starting role....but Alex couldn't do it convincingly, just like Alex couldn't beat out Rattay even though the starting Job was basically given to him, in his rookie year..... then after a few games where Rattay played fine...had 5tds in 3 games...but was still pulled after struggling in the first half against the Cards......3.5 games into the Season that we were TOLD we were going to play to win the WEST...but the keys were given to Alex........so again...after a few set of games....the keys are given to him again.....when were TOLD that we were going to play to win the WEST...

like a said a while ago....although I hope and expect Alex to pick up his game....Singletary is taking a very dangerous risk with putting all chips on Alex, like Nolan did......Sing has been here this whole time...he should know first hand about depending solely on Alex......

but, as I have said before....maybe this was part of the deal, as far as getting the gig....playing Alex if the opportunity was there.... I mean, when other players on our team were making mistakes....Sing was telling them off....no nonsense.....but with Alex...it was kind of pathetic seeing Singletary on that podium making excuses for all those turnovers.....one or two maybe....haha.....man it looked like he was reaching.....the Great Mike Singletary....did not look like the Singletary I have watched or heard these past year.

Care to share any evidence to support these suppositions?
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Originally posted by billbird2111:
Now -- before you get excited -- hear me out kids. Yes, indeed, I am sober this morning and thinking somewhat rational thoughts. This is not another "bash Alex" thread nor is it a "I love Shaun's jockstrap" thread.

Call it an "I wonder" thread.

Just got done reading the Barrows report on Coach Singletary's assessment after the game. The line of, "I thought Alex did a good job," caught me off guard. I mean, even the most fervent Alex supporters will admit the dude simply has not performed the way they think he can. They keep waiting for the light to snap on.

But when I see that line of "I think Alex did a good job," man I'm wondering if Singletary is watching the same game I am. To me -- it's akin to Singletary uttering the line of "Hill has the strongest arm in all of NFL football." Many of you would sit up and say, "what?" Is he watching the same QB I'm watching?

There is absolutely NO MENTION of inserting Hill back into the lineup, which leads me to believe that it's probably not going to happen. It's like the man has fallen off the charts or something. Singletary has made it clear that he's going with Alex -- come He** or high water.

Now -- I understand that Hill is not going to lead us to the promised land. But the man still delivered three wins. He won an open QB competition in camp and was installed as the clear #1 to start the season.

In the space of less than eight games -- he went from clear #1 to not even so much as a mention. To me? That's seems strange. It just doesn't smell right.

Which makes me wonder.... What -- if anything -- did he do wrong? He's been awfully quiet lately. No Hill quotes that I've seen.

Am I dreaming? Or is there smoke there?[/quote

No he hasnt done anything productive!!!!!
Originally posted by Afrikan:
Originally posted by Method:
What Hill did was go home instead of staying here to pass with Crabtree. If you tell me this didn't make a difference in Singletary's head when comparing the two Quarterbacks, you're being delusional.

I don't know if you can tell Method...but it was always meant for Alex to eventually get one last chance to start or what ever....even if it meant our season...and that is what it seems like is happening...

before Sing was retained as HC...it was reported about how they (front office) wanted a coach who could still salvage Alex's career.....Sing told them that he felt had a bad deal in his first few years and believed in him....I'm sure that helped out alittle bit in the decision....

So I'm sure every little thing was considered when looking for a reason to start Alex again....... they gave him every opportunity in OTAs,Training Camp, PreSeason to "win" the starting role....but Alex couldn't do it convincingly, just like Alex couldn't beat out Rattay even though the starting Job was basically given to him, in his rookie year..... then after a few games where Rattay played fine...had 5tds in 3 games...but was still pulled after struggling in the first half against the Cards......3.5 games into the Season that we were TOLD we were going to play to win the WEST...but the keys were given to Alex........so again...after a few set of games....the keys are given to him again.....when were TOLD that we were going to play to win the WEST...

like a said a while ago....although I hope and expect Alex to pick up his game....Singletary is taking a very dangerous risk with putting all chips on Alex, like Nolan did......Sing has been here this whole time...he should know first hand about depending solely on Alex......

but, as I have said before....maybe this was part of the deal, as far as getting the gig....playing Alex if the opportunity was there.... I mean, when other players on our team were making mistakes....Sing was telling them off....no nonsense.....but with Alex...it was kind of pathetic seeing Singletary on that podium making excuses for all those turnovers.....one or two maybe....haha.....man it looked like he was reaching.....the Great Mike Singletary....did not look like the Singletary I have watched or heard these past year.

Dont forget when we won some games, and Hill didnt produce, he made excuses for HIll's horrible play. ON the blowout, he made excuses for HIll, after the Bye, when all thought Smith should get in, he stood by Hill and let him start against the Texans, and then what, he still bombed. The only games we won behind center were within our division with Hill behind center, and to be real, you may not like it, but i bet we wouldnt have beat them if they were playing like they are now.

But enough about should of or would of. Dont lose sight brotha AFrik, that Sing, and i quote said, Hill started the beginning of the season because at that time, he gave us the best chance to win. Key words, at that time. Now, with a new WR starting core, new OC plays being called, new o-lineman. With all these changes, Smith gives us the best chance to win. And stop pointin out INT's im watchin every week and almost every damn qb this week threw for 1 or 2 int's. The point is, and the upside is that Smith has scored more Td's in his short span than in HIll's 6 games. So i mean it comes down to would u rather have a QB, that can ONLY manage a game, but no turnovers (oh besides sacks), or a QB who so far, has looked better with his feet, can utilize the entire field and all of our WR's, and not too mention that Gore has had his best yardage avg's once Smith is behind center.

So i mean lets stop b***hin. He didnt do anything wrong. He was just being Hill, and when the smoke cleared and it caught up to him, he was pulled. Just that simple.
Originally posted by Jersey9er:
Originally posted by Afrikan:
Originally posted by Method:
What Hill did was go home instead of staying here to pass with Crabtree. If you tell me this didn't make a difference in Singletary's head when comparing the two Quarterbacks, you're being delusional.

I don't know if you can tell Method...but it was always meant for Alex to eventually get one last chance to start or what ever....even if it meant our season...and that is what it seems like is happening...

before Sing was retained as HC...it was reported about how they (front office) wanted a coach who could still salvage Alex's career.....Sing told them that he felt had a bad deal in his first few years and believed in him....I'm sure that helped out alittle bit in the decision....

So I'm sure every little thing was considered when looking for a reason to start Alex again....... they gave him every opportunity in OTAs,Training Camp, PreSeason to "win" the starting role....but Alex couldn't do it convincingly, just like Alex couldn't beat out Rattay even though the starting Job was basically given to him, in his rookie year..... then after a few games where Rattay played fine...had 5tds in 3 games...but was still pulled after struggling in the first half against the Cards......3.5 games into the Season that we were TOLD we were going to play to win the WEST...but the keys were given to Alex........so again...after a few set of games....the keys are given to him again.....when were TOLD that we were going to play to win the WEST...

like a said a while ago....although I hope and expect Alex to pick up his game....Singletary is taking a very dangerous risk with putting all chips on Alex, like Nolan did......Sing has been here this whole time...he should know first hand about depending solely on Alex......

but, as I have said before....maybe this was part of the deal, as far as getting the gig....playing Alex if the opportunity was there.... I mean, when other players on our team were making mistakes....Sing was telling them off....no nonsense.....but with Alex...it was kind of pathetic seeing Singletary on that podium making excuses for all those turnovers.....one or two maybe....haha.....man it looked like he was reaching.....the Great Mike Singletary....did not look like the Singletary I have watched or heard these past year.

Dont forget when we won some games, and Hill didnt produce, he made excuses for HIll's horrible play. ON the blowout, he made excuses for HIll, after the Bye, when all thought Smith should get in, he stood by Hill and let him start against the Texans, and then what, he still bombed. The only games we won behind center were within our division with Hill behind center, and to be real, you may not like it, but i bet we wouldnt have beat them if they were playing like they are now.

But enough about should of or would of. Dont lose sight brotha AFrik, that Sing, and i quote said, Hill started the beginning of the season because at that time, he gave us the best chance to win. Key words, at that time.

Now, with a new WR starting core, new OC plays being called, new o-lineman. With all these changes, Smith gives us the best chance to win. And stop pointin out INT's im watchin every week and almost every damn qb this week threw for 1 or 2 int's. The point is, and the upside is that Smith has scored more Td's in his short span than in HIll's 6 games. So i mean it comes down to would u rather have a QB, that can ONLY manage a game, but no turnovers (oh besides sacks), or a QB who so far, has looked better with his feet, can utilize the entire field and all of our WR's,

and not too mention that Gore has had his best yardage avg's once Smith is behind center.

So i mean lets stop b***hin. He didnt do anything wrong. He was just being Hill, and when the smoke cleared and it caught up to him, he was pulled. Just that simple.

this is the problem.... I have no problem if Alex did all these things...or should I say, is allowed to do all these things....... when he has been allowed to pass like crazy...play in a spread...turnovers have happened....in a 5 day span Alex had 4INTs 2fumbles..

Raye opened up the offense for him in that Titans game...and there were alot of turnovers......then 5 days later...we came out in a spread type offense against the Bears (and I loved what Alex was doing...a couple of missed passes but, I still like it)....but what happened after that one INT.......right after that INT, Sing pulled EVERYTHING back.....and we started to try to run out the clock in the beginning of the 3rd qtr. ....with a 4pt lead .....

so this is the thing....if Alex is going to be used, then I want him to have more than one chance to redeem himself...or atleast let him get into rhythm and built more confidence....and just be aggressive as an offense.... (it doesn't have to be deep passes or what ever....just more spread type passes on 1st and 2nd down)

and if he struggles and throws INTs and fumbles...then get his arse out of there.....but if he plays like how some of yall Alex fans feel he can play... THEN GREAT and we have a great chance at the playoffs and maybe more....because we have alot of weapons on offense..and a great defense to get it done week in and week out against any team.

but....if we are going to change the whole offensive gameplan, midgame, just because of one INT...and play it close with Alex as our QB...then that is when I have a HUGE problem..... Alex just hasn't proved to be realible in these close type games.....yes he chokes.....in the Titans game late in the 4th qtr when he could have drove us down field to win the game...he threw an INT....our defense then held them to 3pts and we got another chance to tie the game....THIS IS RARE... Alex got a RARE opportunity to redeem himself...and drive us downfield to tie the game....he didn't have to do too much...it wasn't 4th and long or what ever...there was alot of time on the clock...but what did he do.....threw another pick ....

so if we ARE going to play these close types of games....then I'm more comfortable with Shaun, because he as PROVED that he can drive us down field in the 4th qtr when we needed him...on 3 occasions......

so Jersey.....if we are going to call plays like how we did against the Bears in the first half.... I have no problem with Alex or Shaun back there.....BUT if we are going to play these close, not to lose, type games then HELL NO I don't feel comfortable with Alex back there....and would rather have Shaun Hill back there.......does that sound like a bias point of view...or a point of view of someone who wants the best for the team to win games and make the playoffs...

does that answer your question though?

[ Edited by Afrikan on Nov 15, 2009 at 18:43:18 ]
no response Jersey????
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Originally posted by Afrikan:
Originally posted by Jersey9er:
Originally posted by Afrikan:
Originally posted by Method:
What Hill did was go home instead of staying here to pass with Crabtree. If you tell me this didn't make a difference in Singletary's head when comparing the two Quarterbacks, you're being delusional.

I don't know if you can tell Method...but it was always meant for Alex to eventually get one last chance to start or what ever....even if it meant our season...and that is what it seems like is happening...

before Sing was retained as HC...it was reported about how they (front office) wanted a coach who could still salvage Alex's career.....Sing told them that he felt had a bad deal in his first few years and believed in him....I'm sure that helped out alittle bit in the decision....

So I'm sure every little thing was considered when looking for a reason to start Alex again....... they gave him every opportunity in OTAs,Training Camp, PreSeason to "win" the starting role....but Alex couldn't do it convincingly, just like Alex couldn't beat out Rattay even though the starting Job was basically given to him, in his rookie year..... then after a few games where Rattay played fine...had 5tds in 3 games...but was still pulled after struggling in the first half against the Cards......3.5 games into the Season that we were TOLD we were going to play to win the WEST...but the keys were given to Alex........so again...after a few set of games....the keys are given to him again.....when were TOLD that we were going to play to win the WEST...

like a said a while ago....although I hope and expect Alex to pick up his game....Singletary is taking a very dangerous risk with putting all chips on Alex, like Nolan did......Sing has been here this whole time...he should know first hand about depending solely on Alex......

but, as I have said before....maybe this was part of the deal, as far as getting the gig....playing Alex if the opportunity was there.... I mean, when other players on our team were making mistakes....Sing was telling them off....no nonsense.....but with Alex...it was kind of pathetic seeing Singletary on that podium making excuses for all those turnovers.....one or two maybe....haha.....man it looked like he was reaching.....the Great Mike Singletary....did not look like the Singletary I have watched or heard these past year.

Dont forget when we won some games, and Hill didnt produce, he made excuses for HIll's horrible play. ON the blowout, he made excuses for HIll, after the Bye, when all thought Smith should get in, he stood by Hill and let him start against the Texans, and then what, he still bombed. The only games we won behind center were within our division with Hill behind center, and to be real, you may not like it, but i bet we wouldnt have beat them if they were playing like they are now.

But enough about should of or would of. Dont lose sight brotha AFrik, that Sing, and i quote said, Hill started the beginning of the season because at that time, he gave us the best chance to win. Key words, at that time.

Now, with a new WR starting core, new OC plays being called, new o-lineman. With all these changes, Smith gives us the best chance to win. And stop pointin out INT's im watchin every week and almost every damn qb this week threw for 1 or 2 int's. The point is, and the upside is that Smith has scored more Td's in his short span than in HIll's 6 games. So i mean it comes down to would u rather have a QB, that can ONLY manage a game, but no turnovers (oh besides sacks), or a QB who so far, has looked better with his feet, can utilize the entire field and all of our WR's,

and not too mention that Gore has had his best yardage avg's once Smith is behind center.

So i mean lets stop b***hin. He didnt do anything wrong. He was just being Hill, and when the smoke cleared and it caught up to him, he was pulled. Just that simple.

this is the problem.... I have no problem if Alex did all these things...or should I say, is allowed to do all these things....... when he has been allowed to pass like crazy...play in a spread...turnovers have happened....in a 5 day span Alex had 4INTs 2fumbles..

Raye opened up the offense for him in that Titans game...and there were alot of turnovers......then 5 days later...we came out in a spread type offense against the Bears (and I loved what Alex was doing...a couple of missed passes but, I still like it)....but what happened after that one INT.......right after that INT, Sing pulled EVERYTHING back.....and we started to try to run out the clock in the beginning of the 3rd qtr. ....with a 4pt lead .....

so this is the thing....if Alex is going to be used, then I want him to have more than one chance to redeem himself...or atleast let him get into rhythm and built more confidence....and just be aggressive as an offense.... (it doesn't have to be deep passes or what ever....just more spread type passes on 1st and 2nd down)

and if he struggles and throws INTs and fumbles...then get his arse out of there.....but if he plays like how some of yall Alex fans feel he can play... THEN GREAT and we have a great chance at the playoffs and maybe more....because we have alot of weapons on offense..and a great defense to get it done week in and week out against any team.

but....if we are going to change the whole offensive gameplan, midgame, just because of one INT...and play it close with Alex as our QB...then that is when I have a HUGE problem..... Alex just hasn't proved to be realible in these close type games.....yes he chokes.....in the Titans game late in the 4th qtr when he could have drove us down field to win the game...he threw an INT....our defense then held them to 3pts and we got another chance to tie the game....THIS IS RARE... Alex got a RARE opportunity to redeem himself...and drive us downfield to tie the game....he didn't have to do too much...it wasn't 4th and long or what ever...there was alot of time on the clock...but what did he do.....threw another pick ....

so if we ARE going to play these close types of games....then I'm more comfortable with Shaun, because he as PROVED that he can drive us down field in the 4th qtr when we needed him...on 3 occasions......

so Jersey.....if we are going to call plays like how we did against the Bears in the first half.... I have no problem with Alex or Shaun back there.....BUT if we are going to play these close, not to lose, type games then HELL NO I don't feel comfortable with Alex back there....and would rather have Shaun Hill back there.......does that sound like a bias point of view...or a point of view of someone who wants the best for the team to win games and make the playoffs...

does that answer your question though?

So Hill drove us down the field in the 4th quarter on 3 occasions...when was this? Are you counting preseason? All I remember is the Arizona game. That's one time. He did it against Minnesota, but that was very early in the 4th and we LOST. We lost because we got conservative, and that's because we had Shaun Hill in at QB. So yes, he drove us down there, but the coaches got conservative because they don't trust him.

It's the same with Alex. He comes out firing, and then in the 2nd half the coaches get conservative again and have him hand the ball off to Gore for 2-yard gains.

Maybe the QB isn't the problem. Maybe it's the coaches.
Originally posted by Afrikan:
Originally posted by Jersey9er:
Originally posted by Afrikan:
Originally posted by Method:
What Hill did was go home instead of staying here to pass with Crabtree. If you tell me this didn't make a difference in Singletary's head when comparing the two Quarterbacks, you're being delusional.

I don't know if you can tell Method...but it was always meant for Alex to eventually get one last chance to start or what ever....even if it meant our season...and that is what it seems like is happening...

before Sing was retained as HC...it was reported about how they (front office) wanted a coach who could still salvage Alex's career.....Sing told them that he felt had a bad deal in his first few years and believed in him....I'm sure that helped out alittle bit in the decision....

So I'm sure every little thing was considered when looking for a reason to start Alex again....... they gave him every opportunity in OTAs,Training Camp, PreSeason to "win" the starting role....but Alex couldn't do it convincingly, just like Alex couldn't beat out Rattay even though the starting Job was basically given to him, in his rookie year..... then after a few games where Rattay played fine...had 5tds in 3 games...but was still pulled after struggling in the first half against the Cards......3.5 games into the Season that we were TOLD we were going to play to win the WEST...but the keys were given to Alex........so again...after a few set of games....the keys are given to him again.....when were TOLD that we were going to play to win the WEST...

like a said a while ago....although I hope and expect Alex to pick up his game....Singletary is taking a very dangerous risk with putting all chips on Alex, like Nolan did......Sing has been here this whole time...he should know first hand about depending solely on Alex......

but, as I have said before....maybe this was part of the deal, as far as getting the gig....playing Alex if the opportunity was there.... I mean, when other players on our team were making mistakes....Sing was telling them off....no nonsense.....but with Alex...it was kind of pathetic seeing Singletary on that podium making excuses for all those turnovers.....one or two maybe....haha.....man it looked like he was reaching.....the Great Mike Singletary....did not look like the Singletary I have watched or heard these past year.

Dont forget when we won some games, and Hill didnt produce, he made excuses for HIll's horrible play. ON the blowout, he made excuses for HIll, after the Bye, when all thought Smith should get in, he stood by Hill and let him start against the Texans, and then what, he still bombed. The only games we won behind center were within our division with Hill behind center, and to be real, you may not like it, but i bet we wouldnt have beat them if they were playing like they are now.

But enough about should of or would of. Dont lose sight brotha AFrik, that Sing, and i quote said, Hill started the beginning of the season because at that time, he gave us the best chance to win. Key words, at that time.

Now, with a new WR starting core, new OC plays being called, new o-lineman. With all these changes, Smith gives us the best chance to win. And stop pointin out INT's im watchin every week and almost every damn qb this week threw for 1 or 2 int's. The point is, and the upside is that Smith has scored more Td's in his short span than in HIll's 6 games. So i mean it comes down to would u rather have a QB, that can ONLY manage a game, but no turnovers (oh besides sacks), or a QB who so far, has looked better with his feet, can utilize the entire field and all of our WR's,

and not too mention that Gore has had his best yardage avg's once Smith is behind center.

So i mean lets stop b***hin. He didnt do anything wrong. He was just being Hill, and when the smoke cleared and it caught up to him, he was pulled. Just that simple.

this is the problem.... I have no problem if Alex did all these things...or should I say, is allowed to do all these things....... when he has been allowed to pass like crazy...play in a spread...turnovers have happened....in a 5 day span Alex had 4INTs 2fumbles..

Raye opened up the offense for him in that Titans game...and there were alot of turnovers......then 5 days later...we came out in a spread type offense against the Bears (and I loved what Alex was doing...a couple of missed passes but, I still like it)....but what happened after that one INT.......right after that INT, Sing pulled EVERYTHING back.....and we started to try to run out the clock in the beginning of the 3rd qtr. ....with a 4pt lead .....

so this is the thing....if Alex is going to be used, then I want him to have more than one chance to redeem himself...or atleast let him get into rhythm and built more confidence....and just be aggressive as an offense.... (it doesn't have to be deep passes or what ever....just more spread type passes on 1st and 2nd down)

and if he struggles and throws INTs and fumbles...then get his arse out of there.....but if he plays like how some of yall Alex fans feel he can play... THEN GREAT and we have a great chance at the playoffs and maybe more....because we have alot of weapons on offense..and a great defense to get it done week in and week out against any team.

but....if we are going to change the whole offensive gameplan, midgame, just because of one INT...and play it close with Alex as our QB...then that is when I have a HUGE problem..... Alex just hasn't proved to be realible in these close type games.....yes he chokes.....in the Titans game late in the 4th qtr when he could have drove us down field to win the game...he threw an INT....our defense then held them to 3pts and we got another chance to tie the game....THIS IS RARE... Alex got a RARE opportunity to redeem himself...and drive us downfield to tie the game....he didn't have to do too much...it wasn't 4th and long or what ever...there was alot of time on the clock...but what did he do.....threw another pick ....

so if we ARE going to play these close types of games....then I'm more comfortable with Shaun, because he as PROVED that he can drive us down field in the 4th qtr when we needed him...on 3 occasions......

so Jersey.....if we are going to call plays like how we did against the Bears in the first half.... I have no problem with Alex or Shaun back there.....BUT if we are going to play these close, not to lose, type games then HELL NO I don't feel comfortable with Alex back there....and would rather have Shaun Hill back there.......does that sound like a bias point of view...or a point of view of someone who wants the best for the team to win games and make the playoffs...

does that answer your question though?

He also proved that he could no longer move the chains at all. I think the coaches know more about who is better for the team than we do man. I know you do not like Smith, but Hill is likely done here now, there is very little chance barring injury that Hill ever sees the field again as the starting QB of the 49ers. Obviously the coaches think Shaun Hill is not a starting quality NFL quarterback, Smith might not become one either, but we are going to find out. I almost guarantee you that we work on offensive line before we draft a new quarterback, I do not see the team standing pat with what we have. Also we have to address the safety position we are too slow in the secondary. Even if we do draft a QB it probably won't be until later in the draft, so you might as well get used to seeing Smith back there.
  • B650
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 4,205
Originally posted by Memphis9er:
Originally posted by Afrikan:
Originally posted by Jersey9er:
Originally posted by Afrikan:
Originally posted by Method:
What Hill did was go home instead of staying here to pass with Crabtree. If you tell me this didn't make a difference in Singletary's head when comparing the two Quarterbacks, you're being delusional.

I don't know if you can tell Method...but it was always meant for Alex to eventually get one last chance to start or what ever....even if it meant our season...and that is what it seems like is happening...

before Sing was retained as HC...it was reported about how they (front office) wanted a coach who could still salvage Alex's career.....Sing told them that he felt had a bad deal in his first few years and believed in him....I'm sure that helped out alittle bit in the decision....

So I'm sure every little thing was considered when looking for a reason to start Alex again....... they gave him every opportunity in OTAs,Training Camp, PreSeason to "win" the starting role....but Alex couldn't do it convincingly, just like Alex couldn't beat out Rattay even though the starting Job was basically given to him, in his rookie year..... then after a few games where Rattay played fine...had 5tds in 3 games...but was still pulled after struggling in the first half against the Cards......3.5 games into the Season that we were TOLD we were going to play to win the WEST...but the keys were given to Alex........so again...after a few set of games....the keys are given to him again.....when were TOLD that we were going to play to win the WEST...

like a said a while ago....although I hope and expect Alex to pick up his game....Singletary is taking a very dangerous risk with putting all chips on Alex, like Nolan did......Sing has been here this whole time...he should know first hand about depending solely on Alex......

but, as I have said before....maybe this was part of the deal, as far as getting the gig....playing Alex if the opportunity was there.... I mean, when other players on our team were making mistakes....Sing was telling them off....no nonsense.....but with Alex...it was kind of pathetic seeing Singletary on that podium making excuses for all those turnovers.....one or two maybe....haha.....man it looked like he was reaching.....the Great Mike Singletary....did not look like the Singletary I have watched or heard these past year.

Dont forget when we won some games, and Hill didnt produce, he made excuses for HIll's horrible play. ON the blowout, he made excuses for HIll, after the Bye, when all thought Smith should get in, he stood by Hill and let him start against the Texans, and then what, he still bombed. The only games we won behind center were within our division with Hill behind center, and to be real, you may not like it, but i bet we wouldnt have beat them if they were playing like they are now.

But enough about should of or would of. Dont lose sight brotha AFrik, that Sing, and i quote said, Hill started the beginning of the season because at that time, he gave us the best chance to win. Key words, at that time.

Now, with a new WR starting core, new OC plays being called, new o-lineman. With all these changes, Smith gives us the best chance to win. And stop pointin out INT's im watchin every week and almost every damn qb this week threw for 1 or 2 int's. The point is, and the upside is that Smith has scored more Td's in his short span than in HIll's 6 games. So i mean it comes down to would u rather have a QB, that can ONLY manage a game, but no turnovers (oh besides sacks), or a QB who so far, has looked better with his feet, can utilize the entire field and all of our WR's,

and not too mention that Gore has had his best yardage avg's once Smith is behind center.

So i mean lets stop b***hin. He didnt do anything wrong. He was just being Hill, and when the smoke cleared and it caught up to him, he was pulled. Just that simple.

this is the problem.... I have no problem if Alex did all these things...or should I say, is allowed to do all these things....... when he has been allowed to pass like crazy...play in a spread...turnovers have happened....in a 5 day span Alex had 4INTs 2fumbles..

Raye opened up the offense for him in that Titans game...and there were alot of turnovers......then 5 days later...we came out in a spread type offense against the Bears (and I loved what Alex was doing...a couple of missed passes but, I still like it)....but what happened after that one INT.......right after that INT, Sing pulled EVERYTHING back.....and we started to try to run out the clock in the beginning of the 3rd qtr. ....with a 4pt lead .....

so this is the thing....if Alex is going to be used, then I want him to have more than one chance to redeem himself...or atleast let him get into rhythm and built more confidence....and just be aggressive as an offense.... (it doesn't have to be deep passes or what ever....just more spread type passes on 1st and 2nd down)

and if he struggles and throws INTs and fumbles...then get his arse out of there.....but if he plays like how some of yall Alex fans feel he can play... THEN GREAT and we have a great chance at the playoffs and maybe more....because we have alot of weapons on offense..and a great defense to get it done week in and week out against any team.

but....if we are going to change the whole offensive gameplan, midgame, just because of one INT...and play it close with Alex as our QB...then that is when I have a HUGE problem..... Alex just hasn't proved to be realible in these close type games.....yes he chokes.....in the Titans game late in the 4th qtr when he could have drove us down field to win the game...he threw an INT....our defense then held them to 3pts and we got another chance to tie the game....THIS IS RARE... Alex got a RARE opportunity to redeem himself...and drive us downfield to tie the game....he didn't have to do too much...it wasn't 4th and long or what ever...there was alot of time on the clock...but what did he do.....threw another pick ....

so if we ARE going to play these close types of games....then I'm more comfortable with Shaun, because he as PROVED that he can drive us down field in the 4th qtr when we needed him...on 3 occasions......

so Jersey.....if we are going to call plays like how we did against the Bears in the first half.... I have no problem with Alex or Shaun back there.....BUT if we are going to play these close, not to lose, type games then HELL NO I don't feel comfortable with Alex back there....and would rather have Shaun Hill back there.......does that sound like a bias point of view...or a point of view of someone who wants the best for the team to win games and make the playoffs...

does that answer your question though?

He also proved that he could no longer move the chains at all. I think the coaches know more about who is better for the team than we do man. I know you do not like Smith, but Hill is likely done here now, there is very little chance barring injury that Hill ever sees the field again as the starting QB of the 49ers. Obviously the coaches think Shaun Hill is not a starting quality NFL quarterback, Smith might not become one either, but we are going to find out. I almost guarantee you that we work on offensive line before we draft a new quarterback, I do not see the team standing pat with what we have. Also we have to address the safety position we are too slow in the secondary. Even if we do draft a QB it probably won't be until later in the draft, so you might as well get used to seeing Smith back there.

I agree. I don't think ownership or the coaches really want to go through the process of drafting another QB and waiting 3 to 4 years. I think they feel that Smith is probably a good QB if you surround him with the right cast. Most likely, Smith will remain on our roster along with Davis next season, and our biggest priority is going to be to fix the OL. There's no point in drafting a QB anyway if you're going to have this type of OL.

I bet we'll sign a veteran backup QB from another team, or draft a young one in the later rounds.
[ Edited by B650 on Nov 16, 2009 at 2:36 PM ]
Originally posted by B650:
Originally posted by Afrikan:
Originally posted by Jersey9er:
Originally posted by Afrikan:
Originally posted by Method:
What Hill did was go home instead of staying here to pass with Crabtree. If you tell me this didn't make a difference in Singletary's head when comparing the two Quarterbacks, you're being delusional.

I don't know if you can tell Method...but it was always meant for Alex to eventually get one last chance to start or what ever....even if it meant our season...and that is what it seems like is happening...

before Sing was retained as HC...it was reported about how they (front office) wanted a coach who could still salvage Alex's career.....Sing told them that he felt had a bad deal in his first few years and believed in him....I'm sure that helped out alittle bit in the decision....

So I'm sure every little thing was considered when looking for a reason to start Alex again....... they gave him every opportunity in OTAs,Training Camp, PreSeason to "win" the starting role....but Alex couldn't do it convincingly, just like Alex couldn't beat out Rattay even though the starting Job was basically given to him, in his rookie year..... then after a few games where Rattay played fine...had 5tds in 3 games...but was still pulled after struggling in the first half against the Cards......3.5 games into the Season that we were TOLD we were going to play to win the WEST...but the keys were given to Alex........so again...after a few set of games....the keys are given to him again.....when were TOLD that we were going to play to win the WEST...

like a said a while ago....although I hope and expect Alex to pick up his game....Singletary is taking a very dangerous risk with putting all chips on Alex, like Nolan did......Sing has been here this whole time...he should know first hand about depending solely on Alex......

but, as I have said before....maybe this was part of the deal, as far as getting the gig....playing Alex if the opportunity was there.... I mean, when other players on our team were making mistakes....Sing was telling them off....no nonsense.....but with Alex...it was kind of pathetic seeing Singletary on that podium making excuses for all those turnovers.....one or two maybe....haha.....man it looked like he was reaching.....the Great Mike Singletary....did not look like the Singletary I have watched or heard these past year.

Dont forget when we won some games, and Hill didnt produce, he made excuses for HIll's horrible play. ON the blowout, he made excuses for HIll, after the Bye, when all thought Smith should get in, he stood by Hill and let him start against the Texans, and then what, he still bombed. The only games we won behind center were within our division with Hill behind center, and to be real, you may not like it, but i bet we wouldnt have beat them if they were playing like they are now.

But enough about should of or would of. Dont lose sight brotha AFrik, that Sing, and i quote said, Hill started the beginning of the season because at that time, he gave us the best chance to win. Key words, at that time.

Now, with a new WR starting core, new OC plays being called, new o-lineman. With all these changes, Smith gives us the best chance to win. And stop pointin out INT's im watchin every week and almost every damn qb this week threw for 1 or 2 int's. The point is, and the upside is that Smith has scored more Td's in his short span than in HIll's 6 games. So i mean it comes down to would u rather have a QB, that can ONLY manage a game, but no turnovers (oh besides sacks), or a QB who so far, has looked better with his feet, can utilize the entire field and all of our WR's,

and not too mention that Gore has had his best yardage avg's once Smith is behind center.

So i mean lets stop b***hin. He didnt do anything wrong. He was just being Hill, and when the smoke cleared and it caught up to him, he was pulled. Just that simple.

this is the problem.... I have no problem if Alex did all these things...or should I say, is allowed to do all these things....... when he has been allowed to pass like crazy...play in a spread...turnovers have happened....in a 5 day span Alex had 4INTs 2fumbles..

Raye opened up the offense for him in that Titans game...and there were alot of turnovers......then 5 days later...we came out in a spread type offense against the Bears (and I loved what Alex was doing...a couple of missed passes but, I still like it)....but what happened after that one INT.......right after that INT, Sing pulled EVERYTHING back.....and we started to try to run out the clock in the beginning of the 3rd qtr. ....with a 4pt lead .....

so this is the thing....if Alex is going to be used, then I want him to have more than one chance to redeem himself...or atleast let him get into rhythm and built more confidence....and just be aggressive as an offense.... (it doesn't have to be deep passes or what ever....just more spread type passes on 1st and 2nd down)

and if he struggles and throws INTs and fumbles...then get his arse out of there.....but if he plays like how some of yall Alex fans feel he can play... THEN GREAT and we have a great chance at the playoffs and maybe more....because we have alot of weapons on offense..and a great defense to get it done week in and week out against any team.

but....if we are going to change the whole offensive gameplan, midgame, just because of one INT...and play it close with Alex as our QB...then that is when I have a HUGE problem..... Alex just hasn't proved to be realible in these close type games.....yes he chokes.....in the Titans game late in the 4th qtr when he could have drove us down field to win the game...he threw an INT....our defense then held them to 3pts and we got another chance to tie the game....THIS IS RARE... Alex got a RARE opportunity to redeem himself...and drive us downfield to tie the game....he didn't have to do too much...it wasn't 4th and long or what ever...there was alot of time on the clock...but what did he do.....threw another pick ....

so if we ARE going to play these close types of games....then I'm more comfortable with Shaun, because he as PROVED that he can drive us down field in the 4th qtr when we needed him...on 3 occasions......

so Jersey.....if we are going to call plays like how we did against the Bears in the first half.... I have no problem with Alex or Shaun back there.....BUT if we are going to play these close, not to lose, type games then HELL NO I don't feel comfortable with Alex back there....and would rather have Shaun Hill back there.......does that sound like a bias point of view...or a point of view of someone who wants the best for the team to win games and make the playoffs...

does that answer your question though?

So Hill drove us down the field in the 4th quarter on 3 occasions...when was this? Are you counting preseason? All I remember is the Arizona game. That's one time. He did it against Minnesota, but that was very early in the 4th and we LOST. We lost because we got conservative, and that's because we had Shaun Hill in at QB. So yes, he drove us down there, but the coaches got conservative because they don't trust him.

It's the same with Alex. He comes out firing, and then in the 2nd half the coaches get conservative again and have him hand the ball off to Gore for 2-yard gains.

Maybe the QB isn't the problem. Maybe it's the coaches.

this doesn't make sense B650..... I find it VERY weird that "they would not trust him" right after he just came through for the team and got them a 4pt lead..... in Shaun's case I wouldn't say its trust....at least in that scenario.........but

in Alex case...it was RIGHT after that INT, that we got all conservative.....and less than 5 days after Alex threw 3ints and 2 fumbles.........so in Alex case...against the Bears...I feel yes there was not trust.......but in the Vike game....Shaun gave the coaches no reason not to trust him....they were just too conservative.....it was late in the 4th qtr and we had a 4pt lead....they were trying to run out the clock and force Farvra to drive the length of the field and pull out a miracle.......where as with Alex....it was right after that INT and our offense approach changed dramatically with a only a 4pt lead with 3rd and 4th qtr still to be played.

but yes...I agree the OC has problems with both QBs in trust in opening up the offense.....I'll just speak for Shaun...but he did fine with Martz in a pretty open offense...with Gore not having much of an impact....still scored TDs.....and I'm just he would do fine with the type of offense we ran in the first half against the Bears....
[ Edited by Afrikan on Nov 16, 2009 at 2:47 PM ]
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