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Singletary's Fate Tied to Raye?

I hope not, but I feel Sing's problem is inflexibility. I admire sticking with a person and a system to give it or him a valid chance to succeed. We'll see more in the weeks to come if we try to open it up. Do you think it's the lack of confidence in our offensive talent level that is the real reason for the play calling or is it stubborness with a philosophy?
Originally posted by sanfran49:

make that 4 out of 5
Originally posted by LasVegasWally:
I hope not, but I feel Sing's problem is inflexibility. I admire sticking with a person and a system to give it or him a valid chance to succeed. We'll see more in the weeks to come if we try to open it up. Do you think it's the lack of confidence in our offensive talent level that is the real reason for the play calling or is it stubborness with a philosophy?

No matter what is said in the media I think that there is a lack of confidence on the offensive side.
  • NP9er
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Originally posted by ttime1:
Originally posted by NP9er:
Mike Holmgren, Mike Shannahan, Jon Gruden, and yes even Steve Mariucci. And the list of OFFENSIVE HEAD COACHES goes on and on and on................

Look what he is working with. He has a lot of weapons but he has a weak barricade and has the choice of his trigger man being:

1) A back-up Qb who is better suited for managing wins than generating them

2) A kid who has the tangibles, but not the intangibles and is mentally dealing with the prospect of becoming a #1 draft choice bust.

3) A talented rookie who must be coached differently in order to master the play book.

I don't know if there are very many coaches who "win now" while developing to win under this scenario.

I'm not so worried about the "win now" concept, as I am getting an offense developed that continues to grow each year, making it and the team better over time both short term (two years), and long term (4th year and beyond). Sort of like that system the team use to run... What was that called again?
[ Edited by NP9er on Oct 18, 2009 at 11:25 PM ]
  • B650
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Originally posted by NP9er:
Originally posted by ttime1:
Originally posted by NP9er:
Mike Holmgren, Mike Shannahan, Jon Gruden, and yes even Steve Mariucci. And the list of OFFENSIVE HEAD COACHES goes on and on and on................

Look what he is working with. He has a lot of weapons but he has a weak barricade and has the choice of his trigger man being:

1) A back-up Qb who is better suited for managing wins than generating them

2) A kid who has the tangibles, but not the intangibles and is mentally dealing with the prospect of becoming a #1 draft choice bust.

3) A talented rookie who must be coached differently in order to master the play book.

I don't know if there are very many coaches who "win now" while developing to win under this scenario.

I'm not so worried about the "win now" concept, as I am getting an offense developed that continues to grow each year, making it and the team better over time both short term (two years), and long term (4th year and beyond). Sort of like that system the team use to run... What was that called again?

4) Crabtree used to play QB. Maybe he can just pass the ball to himself. Not only will we make the playoffs, he'll reach all of his incentives. It's a win-win.
Dude once again.

Raye is being hamstrung by the QB. It's just THAT simple.

Sing calls Run or Pass, Raye has to send in plays that fit the personnel. Sing CAN override the play but with 25 seconds ticking off he doesn't have much wiggle room. So in the end they probably send in the original plays.

Some people act like there is no game clock and they can take their sweet time deciding what play to run if Sing is not enthused with Raye's selection.

It's the QB and has ALWAYS been the QB.

~Ceadder
Originally posted by B650:
Originally posted by fzrdave:
I didn't like picking up Raye as the offensive coordinator and I haven't seen anything yet to change my mind. Sing picked him up, so he's going to have to answer up to that. I could easily see yet another new offensive coordinator next season, or at least I really, really hope so. If that next offensive coordinator breaths some life into this offense, then everyone will forget about Raye being here, but if Raye stays or if the next offensive coordinator lays an egg like Raye, then that could lead to the end of Sing's stay here in charge of our 9ers.

Singletary just wanted a puppet OC so he can have all the power himself; someone that believes that all you need to do in the NFL is run around like a caveman and hit people in the mouth. If Raye is fired, I expect the next OC to be someone who's never had any success.

I don't believe we would have been pursuing Linehan is that was the case. Raye was kinda the last option and I don't see them firing Raye as soon as every1 is expecting. Its not like this was a top 15 hell top 20 offense to begin with. If you look at pts per game we are in the same neighborhood as last season. And our next OC will most likely be Mike Johnson whenever we have a change at the position
Originally posted by Psinex:
Originally posted by JDeezy:
When Norv Turner gets fired after this year, I'm hoping Sing calls him up and gives him his old job back....BUT Sing doesn't seem like the type of guy to tell Raye to step aside after one year. He always preaches loyalty. It's early, but I don't think Raye's tendencies are going to change one bit. But it is apparently Singletary who wants to play this way....hence the reason for Linehan not being here.

It's kind of interesting how Nolan handcuffed our defense from playing to the best of their natural talents, while allowing Martz to come in and open things up just before he was canned. I think hiring Jim Hostler in 2007 along with how he handled the Alex Smith shoulder injury was his undoing. Singletary is doing fine with the defense, but he has really put blinders on the offense by hiring Raye and playing an ultra-conservative scheme that doesn't allow runners to go outside the tackles and has no plays designed to go down the field.

Everything seems to stay in the middle of the field...our offense needs to go outside, or we are basically f'ed now that other teams have seen everything they need to see from our offense. I have a bad feeling that even with Frank's return, our running game is not going to suddenly break open. It's the same thing that happened in 2007. Teams stacked the box, daring us to throw past them. Three and out, three and out, three and out, three and out...

uh err - All I can add to this is WORD
  • sports_guy212
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Singletary's "fate" is by no means tied to Raye. Singletary is a great coach that changed the demeanor of football is San Fran. Raye runs a garbage offense that will never break the top 20. Yes we're a "running" team, but come on this guy is like the Mike Martz of a run heavy play book. I think it is worth over paying a great O Coordinator like Norv Turner than to settle for sub par coaches like Raye.
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Originally posted by sports_guy212:
Singletary's "fate" is by no means tied to Raye. Singletary is a great coach that changed the demeanor of football is San Fran. Raye runs a garbage offense that will never break the top 20. Yes we're a "running" team, but come on this guy is like the Mike Martz of a run heavy play book. I think it is worth over paying a great O Coordinator like Norv Turner than to settle for sub par coaches like Raye.

But Singletary hired Raye. He should be held responsible (at least partly).
Originally posted by sports_guy212:
Singletary's "fate" is by no means tied to Raye. Singletary is a great coach that changed the demeanor of football is San Fran. Raye runs a garbage offense that will never break the top 20. Yes we're a "running" team, but come on this guy is like the Mike Martz of a run heavy play book. I think it is worth over paying a great O Coordinator like Norv Turner than to settle for sub par coaches like Raye.

I don't think you understand the point I was making. If Singletary sticks up for Raye and remains stubbornly loyal to him like Nolan did for Hostler, he could also end up with his head on the chopping block before long. There has to be accountability for the offense being as bad as it is for the first 5 weeks of the season. If Singletary is not willing to have Raye replaced or get a "special offensive assistant" ala Tollner, you have to question his judgment and ability to see the error of his ways.
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
Originally posted by JDeezy:
Originally posted by matt49er:
Originally posted by JDeezy:
When Norv Turner gets fired after this year, I'm hoping Sing calls him up and gives him his old job back....BUT Sing doesn't seem like the type of guy to tell Raye to step aside after one year. He always preaches loyalty. It's early, but I don't think Raye's tendencies are going to change one bit. But it is apparently Singletary who wants to play this way....hence the reason for Linehan not being here.

i agree having Norv back would be great but we need some consistency at OC and norv would get a hc job in a year or 2. i wish we would have got cam cameron

After he gets fired for the 3rd time, Norv Turner will never be a head coach in this league again.....his time has come and gone.

jerry jones will probably just try to f**k us over if we got norv. their team is going down and he would gladly take the niners down with him. no retread coaches, having norv would be great but that ship has sailed i think.

People that run a high profile business...like oh, let's say a NFL football team... have some pride & self respect. Doubtful the 49ers would re-hire someone that walked out on them at the last minute, leaving their team in dissaray with not having time to find a competent replacement.
  • B650
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Originally posted by djfullshred:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
Originally posted by JDeezy:
Originally posted by matt49er:
Originally posted by JDeezy:
When Norv Turner gets fired after this year, I'm hoping Sing calls him up and gives him his old job back....BUT Sing doesn't seem like the type of guy to tell Raye to step aside after one year. He always preaches loyalty. It's early, but I don't think Raye's tendencies are going to change one bit. But it is apparently Singletary who wants to play this way....hence the reason for Linehan not being here.

i agree having Norv back would be great but we need some consistency at OC and norv would get a hc job in a year or 2. i wish we would have got cam cameron

After he gets fired for the 3rd time, Norv Turner will never be a head coach in this league again.....his time has come and gone.

jerry jones will probably just try to f**k us over if we got norv. their team is going down and he would gladly take the niners down with him. no retread coaches, having norv would be great but that ship has sailed i think.

People that run a high profile business...like oh, let's say a NFL football team... have some pride & self respect. Doubtful the 49ers would re-hire someone that walked out on them at the last minute, leaving their team in dissaray with not having time to find a competent replacement.

Well, the same team just started a 22-year old WR who held out against them because he wanted more money, after just 2 weeks of practice.
One thing is for sure. Singletary better have a long term plan for a consistent offense and coordinator. The QB Coach better be a good coordinator or Singletary better bring in someone to groom and be ready to take over for Raye with a smooth transition.