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Singletary's Fate Tied to Raye?

  • B650
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 4,205
Originally posted by BY_4_HOF:
We can no longer call the game offensively, how we have over the first 5 weeks and expect to win. Its an aberation that we have been able to win a few games, despite repeatedly telling the other team what we are going to do every play.

BOTTOM LINE, we can't line up half the game with 1 wr sets (for obvious runs) and then switch to empty backfields (for obvious passes) and expect to have success on those plays. we need to create at least some sense in the defense's mind that this play could be a pass downfield, a swing pass, or an interior run...right now they are keying off every play....and unless the play calling advances from pop warner, we will be looking at a dissapointing slide from a fortunate start.

and if we happen to get another lead this season, WE CAN'T RUN the same play up the middle for the entire 4th qtr and expect to hold the lead.

The problem is that SingRaye believe that it doesn't matter if other teams know the play or not, because we should be able to execute regardless. Caveman mentality at it's finest. And we wonder why we were unprepared against Atlanta. If you can't outsmart your opponent in this league from time to time, you aren't going anywhere. This isn't Tecmo Bowl, this is the NFL.
Originally posted by JDeezy:
Originally posted by matt49er:
Originally posted by JDeezy:
When Norv Turner gets fired after this year, I'm hoping Sing calls him up and gives him his old job back....BUT Sing doesn't seem like the type of guy to tell Raye to step aside after one year. He always preaches loyalty. It's early, but I don't think Raye's tendencies are going to change one bit. But it is apparently Singletary who wants to play this way....hence the reason for Linehan not being here.

i agree having Norv back would be great but we need some consistency at OC and norv would get a hc job in a year or 2. i wish we would have got cam cameron

After he gets fired for the 3rd time, Norv Turner will never be a head coach in this league again.....his time has come and gone.

didn't we think that last time?
Originally posted by matt49er:
Originally posted by JDeezy:
Originally posted by matt49er:
Originally posted by JDeezy:
When Norv Turner gets fired after this year, I'm hoping Sing calls him up and gives him his old job back....BUT Sing doesn't seem like the type of guy to tell Raye to step aside after one year. He always preaches loyalty. It's early, but I don't think Raye's tendencies are going to change one bit. But it is apparently Singletary who wants to play this way....hence the reason for Linehan not being here.

i agree having Norv back would be great but we need some consistency at OC and norv would get a hc job in a year or 2. i wish we would have got cam cameron

After he gets fired for the 3rd time, Norv Turner will never be a head coach in this league again.....his time has come and gone.

didn't we think that last time?

3rd times a charm.
  • NP9er
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 163
Mike Holmgren, Mike Shannahan, Jon Gruden, and yes even Steve Mariucci. And the list of OFFENSIVE HEAD COACHES goes on and on and on................
Originally posted by NP9er:
Mike Holmgren, Mike Shannahan, Jon Gruden, and yes even Steve Mariucci. And the list of OFFENSIVE HEAD COACHES goes on and on and on................

Look what he is working with. He has a lot of weapons but he has a weak barricade and has the choice of his trigger man being:

1) A back-up Qb who is better suited for managing wins than generating them

2) A kid who has the tangibles, but not the intangibles and is mentally dealing with the prospect of becoming a #1 draft choice bust.

3) A talented rookie who must be coached differently in order to master the play book.

I don't know if there are very many coaches who "win now" while developing to win under this scenario.
[ Edited by ttime1 on Oct 17, 2009 at 11:23 PM ]
I think we could do better, he wasn't even our first choice.
Originally posted by DShanghai69er:
Absolutely. Our performance over the next three games will likely decide our fate this season and the spotlight will heavily be on Raye's offense to creatively attack Houston's defense, keep up with Peyton in Indy, then be able to take advantage of a weak Titan's secondary back home. You can bet your @$$ that if we can't stay competitive in these next three games, Singletary will demand changes to our playcalling. My only concern is whether or not it is Coach Sing who is more enamoured with the smashmouth running strategy than Coach Raye...

I think the way this team plays is as Singletary says. This was evident with Martz back there last year, with Singltary controlling him. Which was a good thing, because Martz was wanting "pass only offense". Singletary isnt the only coach out there that can motivate a team, we just havent had a coach here in a while that puts it to his players like Sing does. Walsh did it better, without using physical force. Yes he has a winning record, but we have been winning by overacheiving, which comes to reality against good teams, and playing with half an offense that Singletary said is all he needs in so many words. Singltary is interfering with our offense like Nolan was interfering with our defense. I have no facts, but it is evident. If we kept everything the same, drafted for both lines next year, and got the west coast offense back in here, which is what we fans want to see. Singletary must stay away from what he really doesnt understand in offense. We could be very balanced and win games ourselves instead of expecting the other team to fold. Think about this, if I were defensive minded, would I want our defense to play with a 21 point lead? Hell yes, the offense has fewer options, and we know what they must do. Another thing, no more prevent defense or offense with a 7 point lead in the fourth qtr. Next time we do this, I will turn off the TV!
[ Edited by TheCatch on Oct 18, 2009 at 8:04 AM ]
Originally posted by TheCatch:
Originally posted by DShanghai69er:
Absolutely. Our performance over the next three games will likely decide our fate this season and the spotlight will heavily be on Raye's offense to creatively attack Houston's defense, keep up with Peyton in Indy, then be able to take advantage of a weak Titan's secondary back home. You can bet your @$$ that if we can't stay competitive in these next three games, Singletary will demand changes to our playcalling. My only concern is whether or not it is Coach Sing who is more enamoured with the smashmouth running strategy than Coach Raye...

I think the way this team plays is as Singletary says. This was evident with Martz back there last year, with Singltary controlling him. Which was a good thing, because Martz was wanting "pass only offense". Singletary isnt the only coach out there that can motivate a team, we just havent had a coach here in a while that puts it to his players like Sing does. Walsh did it better, without using physical force. Yes he has a winning record, but we have been winning by overacheiving, which comes to reality against good teams, and playing with half an offense that Singletary said is all he needs in so many words. Singltary is interfering with our offense like Nolan was interfering with our defense. I have no facts, but it is evident. If we kept everything the same, drafted for both lines next year, and got the west coast offense back in here, which is what we fans want to see. Singletary must stay away from what he really doesnt understand in offense. We could be very balanced and win games ourselves instead of expecting the other team to fold. Think about this, if I were defensive minded, would I want our defense to play with a 21 point lead? Hell yes, the offense has fewer options, and we know what they must do. Another thing, no more prevent defense or offense with a 7 point lead in the fourth qtr. Next time we do this, I will turn off the TV!

I liked the "controlled" martz when Sing took over. Maybe they would get into too many arguments though...

I thought Cosell really described Raye's problems the best, and that is not taking advantage of matchups. I mean, we have played weak secondary's the past several weeks and have yet to exploit those. I mean, wasn't Raye like our 4th or 5th choice for OC?
I think Raye was the 7th guy Sing interviewed lol. Honestly though, Linehan was the only worthy candidate out of that group, but he made some excuse about not wanting to move his family before signing with Detroit (same time zone I guess).

I hope the Chargers tank so Norv gets fired and we get him back.
Originally posted by JDeezy:
Originally posted by NinersCluebat:
Is Rayes job in Sing's hands or is the decision higher up?

Sing hired him its in his hands.

I was one of the guys that wished martz would stay. Martz's play calling changed when sing and hill took over. Also, raye was the something like the 31st choice for the OC job. I would like to have some consistency at the OC position but I would not be surprised if raye will be replaced. I hope he stays.
Originally posted by B650:
Originally posted by BY_4_HOF:
We can no longer call the game offensively, how we have over the first 5 weeks and expect to win. Its an aberation that we have been able to win a few games, despite repeatedly telling the other team what we are going to do every play.

BOTTOM LINE, we can't line up half the game with 1 wr sets (for obvious runs) and then switch to empty backfields (for obvious passes) and expect to have success on those plays. we need to create at least some sense in the defense's mind that this play could be a pass downfield, a swing pass, or an interior run...right now they are keying off every play....and unless the play calling advances from pop warner, we will be looking at a dissapointing slide from a fortunate start.

and if we happen to get another lead this season, WE CAN'T RUN the same play up the middle for the entire 4th qtr and expect to hold the lead.

The problem is that SingRaye believe that it doesn't matter if other teams know the play or not, because we should be able to execute regardless. Caveman mentality at it's finest. And we wonder why we were unprepared against Atlanta. If you can't outsmart your opponent in this league from time to time, you aren't going anywhere. This isn't Tecmo Bowl, this is the NFL.

And you know Sing thinks this way because....?Oh because you know more about football and running a team than Sing. My bad.
  • B650
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 4,205
Originally posted by ObePwnD:
Originally posted by B650:
Originally posted by BY_4_HOF:
We can no longer call the game offensively, how we have over the first 5 weeks and expect to win. Its an aberation that we have been able to win a few games, despite repeatedly telling the other team what we are going to do every play.

BOTTOM LINE, we can't line up half the game with 1 wr sets (for obvious runs) and then switch to empty backfields (for obvious passes) and expect to have success on those plays. we need to create at least some sense in the defense's mind that this play could be a pass downfield, a swing pass, or an interior run...right now they are keying off every play....and unless the play calling advances from pop warner, we will be looking at a dissapointing slide from a fortunate start.

and if we happen to get another lead this season, WE CAN'T RUN the same play up the middle for the entire 4th qtr and expect to hold the lead.

The problem is that SingRaye believe that it doesn't matter if other teams know the play or not, because we should be able to execute regardless. Caveman mentality at it's finest. And we wonder why we were unprepared against Atlanta. If you can't outsmart your opponent in this league from time to time, you aren't going anywhere. This isn't Tecmo Bowl, this is the NFL.

And you know Sing thinks this way because....?Oh because you know more about football and running a team than Sing. My bad.

Because I'm seeing a rotation of 2 or 3 different run plays, and all of them are straight up the gut. See the Arizona game. See the Minnesota game when we ran it 3 straight times despite not being able to run the ball all day. Pretty obvious that Singletary isn't trying to outsmart anyone. He's stubborn and he thinks that we should just be able to run the ball at will, despite the fact that our OL can't block a team of Hello Kitty's.

He also stated that there's no backup plan if the running game isn't working.

You do the math, genius.
[ Edited by B650 on Oct 18, 2009 at 11:23 AM ]
I didn't like picking up Raye as the offensive coordinator and I haven't seen anything yet to change my mind. Sing picked him up, so he's going to have to answer up to that. I could easily see yet another new offensive coordinator next season, or at least I really, really hope so. If that next offensive coordinator breaths some life into this offense, then everyone will forget about Raye being here, but if Raye stays or if the next offensive coordinator lays an egg like Raye, then that could lead to the end of Sing's stay here in charge of our 9ers.
  • B650
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  • Posts: 4,205
Originally posted by fzrdave:
I didn't like picking up Raye as the offensive coordinator and I haven't seen anything yet to change my mind. Sing picked him up, so he's going to have to answer up to that. I could easily see yet another new offensive coordinator next season, or at least I really, really hope so. If that next offensive coordinator breaths some life into this offense, then everyone will forget about Raye being here, but if Raye stays or if the next offensive coordinator lays an egg like Raye, then that could lead to the end of Sing's stay here in charge of our 9ers.

Singletary just wanted a puppet OC so he can have all the power himself; someone that believes that all you need to do in the NFL is run around like a caveman and hit people in the mouth. If Raye is fired, I expect the next OC to be someone who's never had any success.
Originally posted by B650:
Originally posted by fzrdave:
I didn't like picking up Raye as the offensive coordinator and I haven't seen anything yet to change my mind. Sing picked him up, so he's going to have to answer up to that. I could easily see yet another new offensive coordinator next season, or at least I really, really hope so. If that next offensive coordinator breaths some life into this offense, then everyone will forget about Raye being here, but if Raye stays or if the next offensive coordinator lays an egg like Raye, then that could lead to the end of Sing's stay here in charge of our 9ers.

Singletary just wanted a puppet OC so he can have all the power himself; someone that believes that all you need to do in the NFL is run around like a caveman and hit people in the mouth. If Raye is fired, I expect the next OC to be someone who's never had any success.

I don't know about the second part of your statement, it very well could be true, but I absolutely agree with you 100% on the first half. and that doesn't speak well to Sing's long-term tenure here with our 9ers.