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Blossoming Draft Picks

Originally posted by oldman9er:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:


Well, they made a serious misjudgment with Manny Lawson, who was brought in to be a pass rusher. He certainly does not have that skill set, and looks much more comfortable in a 4-3 set.

Davis has not lived up to expectations. He is physically gifted, but has never learned the art of running routes.

David Baas was the top pick in the second round, and is mediocre at best. The difference in talent between Baas, and Mankins, the player selected just before him is astonishing.

Brandon Williams was a bad bust. Reggie Smith is on the same road to becoming a third round bust.

Cohen, Wallace, Moore were head scratchers.

I think in the case of Manny, I think it's just a matter of development. Manny seemed, until now, rather unwilling to bulk up to 250... as if he didn't feel that was necessary. Well, too bad, Manny, you should have been forced to. He also should have been better developed in the art of the bull-rush and inside cut back techniques, instead of being allowed to always try his speed around the outside arc. I don't think it's too late for him, but he'll need help from the DL too.

Vernon... hard to justify taking a TE at #6 overall, and they did seem to overrate his receiving skills. He can be decent or good, but probably not worthy of the spot taken.

Jay Moore has been injured... that's it... Misfortunate, and we don't know what we have in him.

I was not a big fan of Wallace, Cohen, or Brandon Williams at all. We'll see about Wallace in the near future.

As for Baas, I've been through it too much to continue that dialogue. I think Baas played very well last season, and was a late bloomer due to the signing of Allen... injuries, whatever. I know you disagree, and think he is average at best, so all I can do there is agree to disagree.

It will be interesting to see how Manny does this year, in a defensive scheme that actually asks him to rush the passer, leaves him on the field long enough to make plays, and doesn't ask him to do alot of other stuff.

Seems, to me, that Manny, like a number of other guys on the team, has yet to have the full opportunity to develop as a player due, at least in part, to the inconsistencies in the coaching under the previous regime.

Cohen and Williams are gone, and forgotten.

Wallace, on the other hand is still around. Does he have any potential role on this team in the future? Signed as a possible replacement for Heitmann, who then signed a long term extension, he struggled in TC last year. Has he improved sufficiently to be groomed, for example, as a replacement for Baas at LG?
  • dmatt
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Originally posted by gresham49erfan:
Since the mid to late 90s with the possible exception of 2000 the 49ers draft classes as a whole have been less than stellar. Sure there have been the first round sucsesses and busts with the occasional steal but below the first round they have been a little less than average. This year however for the first time in recent memory a fair number of lower round draft picks are cracking or at least pushing for the starting line up. Chilo Rachal, Reggie Smith, Josh Morgan,Dashon Goldson, and Payrs Haralson could all be starters on week one, not to mention anyone from this years class. Maybe G.M. Scott deserves more credit than we give him. I thinks it's a good barameter to have your draft picks move up rather than aquiring free agents, I think the reality is if most free agents were that good...they would'nt be free agents, their teams would'nt have let them go. Maybe we are now finally seeing the "green shoots" of what will be a team that could be a contender.

I give him a lot of credit. Scott has done a very good job.
Originally posted by AB83Rules:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Scot has a mixed record. He's hit on some later rounders, but missed badly on many first and early second day picks.

Missed? or just didn't have the proper coaching or situations to cultivate the selections?

Well, they made a serious misjudgment with Manny Lawson, who was brought in to be a pass rusher. He certainly does not have that skill set, and looks much more comfortable in a 4-3 set.

Davis has not lived up to expectations. He is physically gifted, but has never learned the art of running routes.

David Baas was the top pick in the second round, and is mediocre at best. The difference in talent between Baas, and Mankins, the player selected just before him is astonishing.

Brandon Williams was a bad bust. Reggie Smith is on the same road to becoming a third round bust.

Cohen, Wallace, Moore were head scratchers.

i agree on Baas, we wanted Mankins, who went 32nd to NE, and i dont see Baas getting extended yet, until he plays a full yr as starter.


Is that true, did we want Mankins? I remember hearing that some draft "experts' (if there is such a thing) thought that the Patriots might have reached a little on Mankins w/ Baas still on the board. I believe Baas was still the #1 rated interior Olineman on the day of the draft, coming out of a school that is known to produce good Olinemen. I don't think you can fault them for taking Baas. He played great at times last year. Hopefully he gets more consistent.

[ Edited by Niners6262 on Jul 29, 2009 at 05:17:49 ]
Originally posted by AB83Rules:
Originally posted by 49wyztoscore:
I think Scot and Nolan drafted fine (besides taking Smith over Rodgers). It's how our talent has been utilized under Nolan is what pissed me off.

i agree, i think we've done a good job, hitting on some nice players, namely Haralson, Delanie, Robinson, Willis, Staley, VD and Lawson. and Goldson

While we have had our share of headscratchers, like Rasheed Marshall, etc...

I agree that there have been some headscratchers, but people forget that some of those have worked out. People went crazy (in a bad way) when we drafted D. Walker, and I believe that large portion of the board thought that Goldson was a bad pick.
Originally posted by Niners6262:
Originally posted by AB83Rules:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Scot has a mixed record. He's hit on some later rounders, but missed badly on many first and early second day picks.

Missed? or just didn't have the proper coaching or situations to cultivate the selections?

Well, they made a serious misjudgment with Manny Lawson, who was brought in to be a pass rusher. He certainly does not have that skill set, and looks much more comfortable in a 4-3 set.

Davis has not lived up to expectations. He is physically gifted, but has never learned the art of running routes.

David Baas was the top pick in the second round, and is mediocre at best. The difference in talent between Baas, and Mankins, the player selected just before him is astonishing.

Brandon Williams was a bad bust. Reggie Smith is on the same road to becoming a third round bust.

Cohen, Wallace, Moore were head scratchers.

i agree on Baas, we wanted Mankins, who went 32nd to NE, and i dont see Baas getting extended yet, until he plays a full yr as starter.


Is that true, did we want Mankins? I remember hearing that some draft "experts' (if there is such a thing) thought that the Patriots might have reached a little on Mankins w/ Baas still on the board. I believe Baas was still the #1 rated interior Olineman on the day of the draft, coming out of a school that is known to produce good Olinemen. I don't think you can fault them for taking Baas. He played great at times last year. Hopefully he gets more consistent.

The Niners had Mankins on the top of their board. The Pats grabbed him. Talk about bad luck.
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by Niners6262:
Originally posted by AB83Rules:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Scot has a mixed record. He's hit on some later rounders, but missed badly on many first and early second day picks.

Missed? or just didn't have the proper coaching or situations to cultivate the selections?

Well, they made a serious misjudgment with Manny Lawson, who was brought in to be a pass rusher. He certainly does not have that skill set, and looks much more comfortable in a 4-3 set.

Davis has not lived up to expectations. He is physically gifted, but has never learned the art of running routes.

David Baas was the top pick in the second round, and is mediocre at best. The difference in talent between Baas, and Mankins, the player selected just before him is astonishing.

Brandon Williams was a bad bust. Reggie Smith is on the same road to becoming a third round bust.

Cohen, Wallace, Moore were head scratchers.

i agree on Baas, we wanted Mankins, who went 32nd to NE, and i dont see Baas getting extended yet, until he plays a full yr as starter.


Is that true, did we want Mankins? I remember hearing that some draft "experts' (if there is such a thing) thought that the Patriots might have reached a little on Mankins w/ Baas still on the board. I believe Baas was still the #1 rated interior Olineman on the day of the draft, coming out of a school that is known to produce good Olinemen. I don't think you can fault them for taking Baas. He played great at times last year. Hopefully he gets more consistent.

The Niners had Mankins on the top of their board. The Pats grabbed him. Talk about bad luck.

MD- I never knew that, reminds me of the Fing Eagles taking Lito Sheppard with the pick before us in 2002. They already had Bobby Taylor and Troy Vincent. That really pissed me off.

[ Edited by Niners6262 on Jul 29, 2009 at 07:05:54 ]
I just need some type of reason why Reggie Smith and Cody Wallace were drafted by this team. he's had bad and good picks so let's see how these guys mentioned pan out.
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Scot has a mixed record. He's hit on some later rounders, but missed badly on many first and early second day picks.

So far, Reggie Smith is a joke. I don't understand why you put him with these guys.

Rachal was not a lower round pick. He was a second rounder.

Reggie Smith? Really? He's only going into his 2nd season and you're ready to write him off already?
Originally posted by BMore9ersfan:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Scot has a mixed record. He's hit on some later rounders, but missed badly on many first and early second day picks.

So far, Reggie Smith is a joke. I don't understand why you put him with these guys.

Rachal was not a lower round pick. He was a second rounder.

Reggie Smith? Really? He's only going into his 2nd season and you're ready to write him off already?

I agree that it's disappointing that Reggie has yet to be a factor. He was taken in the 3rd, but regarded back then as more of a first day pick. I hope his apparent lack of progression has more to do with SF being indecisive on where to play him. He went from CB (which I disagreed with) to FS to now being looked at as Lewis' backup at SS. I really hope that he can show us something in August, and also have an eye on Taylor if not.
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Scot has a mixed record. He's hit on some later rounders, but missed badly on many first and early second day picks.

So far, Reggie Smith is a joke. I don't understand why you put him with these guys.

Rachal was not a lower round pick. He was a second rounder.

I've given it a C-grade every year including this one. But oldman has a great point about drafting square players to fit into round holes and piss poor player development too has much to do with it.

It all starts with a scheme and then finding players who fit that scheme. We've seen the result of nothing more then what is perceived as BPA-strategy for quite some time now and to date, still have the exact same holes on offense and defense as we did 5-6 years ago.

[ Edited by NCommand on Jul 29, 2009 at 13:37:10 ]
I think he would grade out average or C compared to the rest of the league.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Scot has a mixed record. He's hit on some later rounders, but missed badly on many first and early second day picks.

So far, Reggie Smith is a joke. I don't understand why you put him with these guys.

Rachal was not a lower round pick. He was a second rounder.

I've given it a C-grade every year including this one. But oldman has a great point about drafting square players to fit into round holes and piss poor player development too has much to do with it.

It all starts with a scheme and then finding players who fit that scheme. We've seen the result of nothing more then what is perceived as BPA-strategy for quite some time now and to date, still have the exact same holes on offense and defense as we did 5-6 years ago.

Let's hope that some of these players really step up and prove themselves this year!
  • flow
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,394
Originally posted by 49wyztoscore:
I think Scot and Nolan drafted fine (besides taking Smith over Rodgers). It's how our talent has been utilized under Nolan is what pissed me off.

I think taking Davis over Ngata was a bigger miss than Smith over Rodgers.
Originally posted by Crazy4Niners:
Originally posted by 49wyztoscore:
I think Scot and Nolan drafted fine (besides taking Smith over Rodgers). It's how our talent has been utilized under Nolan is what pissed me off.

I think taking Davis over Ngata was a bigger miss than Smith over Rodgers.

That was a very big miss i'm sure alot of people forgot about. He would have been great in front of Willis, like he has Ray Lewis
Originally posted by tohara3:
Originally posted by Crazy4Niners:
Originally posted by 49wyztoscore:
I think Scot and Nolan drafted fine (besides taking Smith over Rodgers). It's how our talent has been utilized under Nolan is what pissed me off.

I think taking Davis over Ngata was a bigger miss than Smith over Rodgers.

That was a very big miss i'm sure alot of people forgot about. He would have been great in front of Willis, like he has Ray Lewis

Exactly... I have seen some claim that Willis is vastly overrated. To that, I just laugh, and have to imagine how much better he would be with a Ngata in front of him. He'd be a pure terror. Willis wouldn't have to limit his range to protect our NT... wouldn't be taking on OGs so regularly. Boggles the mind... Get this man a wall in front of him already!!!