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Defense still needs to be fixed

i just want some stops on third down. seems like our team kicks ass at every down except the third
The DL needs a dominant NT...that's what really makes the 3-4 run as it's designed to. We don't have one...and my hope is that will be one of our two 1st round picks next draft. The other big need is a pass rusher...but that has to be upgraded in concert w/the NT. It's a packaged deal...and has to be approached that way. Justin Smith is a stud. Balmer needs to emerge (I think he will) this season...if he does, then our best shot at a better defense than last year is to get a cumulatively solid effort from Franklin & Sopoaga in the middle.

Reggie Smith is showing signs that S is his best position...Michael Lewis is beginning to show the effects of playing his position. I'm anxious to see how Goldson fares. If he's the answer at FS (at least for now), great. Like many Niner fans, I have visions of Taylor Mays back there...wouldn't that be sweet.

Our CB group now is stronger than it's been in years. I'm expecting considerably better overall play from them.

Our LB group is solid, especially inside. Manny has to step up...Haralson's pretty strong, just needs to stay healthy. Brooks is a guy I'm expecting to see emerge. I really like Jerry Hughes from TCU...the guy's a real baller. With a stronger front 3, someone like him could really make some plays from OLB position.
Originally posted by CorvaNinerFan:
The DL needs a dominant NT...that's what really makes the 3-4 run as it's designed to. We don't have one...and my hope is that will be one of our two 1st round picks next draft. The other big need is a pass rusher...but that has to be upgraded in concert w/the NT. It's a packaged deal...and has to be approached that way. Justin Smith is a stud. Balmer needs to emerge (I think he will) this season...if he does, then our best shot at a better defense than last year is to get a cumulatively solid effort from Franklin & Sopoaga in the middle.

Reggie Smith is showing signs that S is his best position...Michael Lewis is beginning to show the effects of playing his position. I'm anxious to see how Goldson fares. If he's the answer at FS (at least for now), great. Like many Niner fans, I have visions of Taylor Mays back there...wouldn't that be sweet.

Our CB group now is stronger than it's been in years. I'm expecting considerably better overall play from them.

Our LB group is solid, especially inside. Manny has to step up...Haralson's pretty strong, just needs to stay healthy. Brooks is a guy I'm expecting to see emerge. I really like Jerry Hughes from TCU...the guy's a real baller. With a stronger front 3, someone like him could really make some plays from OLB position.


LISTEN to this man... he is wise indeed.
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by 49ERGUY:
The defense is the stronger of the two units and that will probably be true this season. We need improved play at NT and Pass Rush. Our defense will probably improve and could very possibly be in or near the top ten.

you are right justin smith is doing an excellent job and haralson did a good job with whatever time he did last year i think we need a ?NT and a FS


Franklin has been getting props since Sing took over. I dont think NT is an issue, look how good our run D is.

Franklin has been getting props as a 1-gap NT. To run a 3-4 effectively, you need
a NT that can take on two blockers. Ice is not effective as well.

If you saw Hampton last night for Pittsburg, that is what a NT is supposed to do.
A dominant NT can hide alot of less stellar D-line play.

Our problem is that we are trying to run a 3-4 with quite a few 4-3 linemen.
Originally posted by nvninerfan1:
Originally posted by Oakland-Niner:
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by 49ERGUY:
The defense is the stronger of the two units and that will probably be true this season. We need improved play at NT and Pass Rush. Our defense will probably improve and could very possibly be in or near the top ten.

you are right justin smith is doing an excellent job and haralson did a good job with whatever time he did last year i think we need a ?NT and a FS


Franklin has been getting props since Sing took over. I dont think NT is an issue, look how good our run D is.

Franklin has been getting props as a 1-gap NT. To run a 3-4 effectively, you need
a NT that can take on two blockers. Ice is not effective as well.

If you saw Hampton last night for Pittsburg, that is what a NT is supposed to do.
A dominant NT can hide alot of less stellar D-line play.

Our problem is that we are trying to run a 3-4 with quite a few 4-3 linemen.

obviously there is more than one way to run a 3-4. If what you say is true absolutely, then most teams running a 3-4 should quit immediately. The reality is, guys like Casey Hampton and Haynesworth are rare gems, just like the coveted passrusher. If it was that easy everyone would have one. What you mean by 3-4 lineman is a guy that can take on two MASSIVE NFL lineman at the same time. Guess what? Theren't many men out there that can do that. So I'm pretty sure you can run a one gap 3-4 (Like Manuskey was a part of in SD I believe) and still be pretty productive. My point of bring this thread back was just to say that in my opinion it sure looks like our scheme is vanilla and predictable compared to many of the other teams that run a 3-4.

[ Edited by Oakland-Niner on Sep 11, 2009 at 14:48:16 ]
Our Defense does NOT need to be fixed. We only need to manufacture a pass rush.

We were ranked 13th in defense last year with a very strong second half of the year. I'm sure Manusky is not going to go completely different than what worked for him when he got the reigns in game 8 from last year.

Also, QB and offensive turnovers can help a little.
I suspect that our defense is being vastly overrated because we played a lot of teams on the downward spiral. Whatever though... what we need and are hoping for is that Franklin can suddenly, somehow become a good 1-gap NT like the Cowgirl's Ratliff. Now THAT is a NT that often demands an OC and OG to focus on him in pass rush, or he can knife in on a QB. Such a QB pressure is rare from anyone that we have thus far. We also must ask that our NT can hold up at the LOS when he is doubled on run plays. Too often have I seen Franklin pushed backwards on his arse and 3-5 yards off the LOS.

People that act is if our D is just fine are burying their heads in the sand. Our D doesn't outright suck... and might be enough to keep us competitive vs average or less opponents... but it is far from the top 10 dream that some are fantasizing over. Maybe I'm just in a negative mood... but I don't think that's what it is... just keeping it real.
IMO (Thanks for asking... ), our defense is solid. It's not a liability, but not good enough to carry us to where we need to be. If we had a New Orleans O, we could win a Championship. But with our current O, we would be lucky to sniff the playoffs. Anyone who thinks we have arrived does'nt watch enough non-niner football.

[ Edited by Oakland-Niner on Sep 11, 2009 at 15:32:51 ]
You need to be fixed like my horny dog.
The defense will be fine, and even better when we can rush the passer.
Originally posted by oldman9er:
I suspect that our defense is being vastly overrated because we played a lot of teams on the downward spiral.

Downward Spiral teams, yes. Downward spiral o-lines, no. -During the Jets game we had gained pressure/sacks on Favre who was in front of a 4-star/veteran offensive line which had 3 pro-bowlers in 2008 (Alan Faneca, Nick Mangold, Damien Woody). -New York was still in contention up to that point to steal the division from Miami, and we played spoiler. -Nobody just gives up a win cause they wanna end the season.

-Not making excuses, but a win is a win, and yes we do need to improve upon our pass-rush/3rd down consistency, but we're judging a 2009 defense that hasn't even played a down yet (intact) within an actual season game (with some of the scheming which we had found success with towards the closing stretch, other than the vanilla crap we've been playing).
Originally posted by FriscoKid220:
Our offense is pretty much done and solidified for a few years now. We may need to get a couple o lineman here or there and let our scheme sink in with the players, but we need to focus on our defense now. The way I look at it, The centerpieces of this defense are Patrick Willis, Nate Clements, and Michael Lewis. Parys contributes too. We'll have to wait and see if Manny can finally do his thing. But our D line and secondary need to be retooled. WE need a safety, and some fierce NT. The ends are ok with Justin Smith being the balls of it. But we need more. No one is scared of our D line. We need to find someone who can get to the qb from that position. We desparetely need a ballhawk/hard hitting free safety. I hope Goldson can do it, but if he can't, then we have to find someone quick. Regardless of how this season pans out, we need to really make our defense the focal point of next off season and definitely be the main concern going into next years draft.

We ain't got no pass rush. Were are the Sacks?
Singeltaty is pretty confident thats good for me.
Originally posted by SnakePlissken:
Originally posted by oldman9er:
I suspect that our defense is being vastly overrated because we played a lot of teams on the downward spiral.

Downward Spiral teams, yes. Downward spiral o-lines, no. -During the Jets game we had gained pressure/sacks on Favre who was in front of a 4-star/veteran offensive line which had 3 pro-bowlers in 2008 (Alan Faneca, Nick Mangold, Damien Woody). -New York was still in contention up to that point to steal the division from Miami, and we played spoiler. -Nobody just gives up a win cause they wanna end the season.

Ultimately yes, a win is a win, but c'mon. The Jets lost 4 of their last 5 games, having just edged out Buffalo for that 1 win. Favre and the offense was 1 of 10 in 3rd down conversions. You gonna tell me that was some high powered offense? Thomas Jones managed 100 yds just once in those games, and had 5.6 averaged against SF, yet only averaged 79 yards a game in the 5 final games. Also that Favre had something wrong with his arm prior, but it was not disclosed. ( http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-jets-favresinjury&prov=ap&type=lgns )
Originally posted by BigMar:
Originally posted by FriscoKid220:
Our offense is pretty much done and solidified for a few years now. We may need to get a couple o lineman here or there and let our scheme sink in with the players, but we need to focus on our defense now. The way I look at it, The centerpieces of this defense are Patrick Willis, Nate Clements, and Michael Lewis. Parys contributes too. We'll have to wait and see if Manny can finally do his thing. But our D line and secondary need to be retooled. WE need a safety, and some fierce NT. The ends are ok with Justin Smith being the balls of it. But we need more. No one is scared of our D line. We need to find someone who can get to the qb from that position. We desparetely need a ballhawk/hard hitting free safety. I hope Goldson can do it, but if he can't, then we have to find someone quick. Regardless of how this season pans out, we need to really make our defense the focal point of next off season and definitely be the main concern going into next years draft.

We ain't got no pass rush. Were are the Sacks?

Pass Rush? Who needs a Pass Rush ... Manusky is more concerned about tackling the receivers RIGHT AFTER they catch the ball. Problem is he didn't indicate just how many yards downfield!