Battle vs. Zeigler - Finish The Fight!

Originally posted by kronik:

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by kronik:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Can we start a thread on Hill vs. Zeigler? I mean, it's not like Hill is lighting the world on fire and we should automatically assume that he will be one of the top 5 WR's, or even make this team.

Maybe the 6.0 yards per catch in his last three games (8 catches for 48 yards) is sexy to some people, but am I missing something here?

At least Battle has proven year-in, year-out that he can play the game. What has Hill done to warrant a free pass on the roster next season?

LOL. What a joke. Let's see here:

Arnaz Battle's first 2 years:

receptions: 8
Yards: 143
TDs: 0

Jason Hill's first 2 years:

receptions: 31
yards: 323
TDs: 2

Oh yea, add in the facts that Hill does not have chronic knee issues and he is 5 years younger and his salary is cheaper.

Let's see your mindless unintelligent response to this one. Oh wait, aren't you the one to say draft Carriker instead of PWillie? Oh yea, Parys Haralson will never do anything either right?

Bottomline: If you respected and wished Battle well, you would hope he catches on with another team instead of being a 5th 6th WR on ours.

I agree regaarding Hill, but you need to compare like with like. Battle's first two years were spent learning a new position. Statistically they are really not comparable.

That being said, Hill will surely stick unless he screws up big time this summer. I suspect both Battle and Z will not make the final cut.

But I can't see anyone giving up a 5th or 6th round pick for him. Why should they when all they have to do is wait? Although, maybe Nolan will trade for him?

Agreed. But my point was this: MD is claiming "what has Hill done to get a free pass this year?" Well, what did Battle do in his first 2 years to get a free pass in his 3rd year?

Look, I appreciate Battle for what he has done which is mediocre. I don't hate the guy nor wish him any misfortune. But a smart GM (aka Bill Walsh) would trade or let go of an aging injury prone player a year early rather than a year too late. By releasing or trading Battle early, it gives Battle a better chance to be productive for his next team and it also allows our younger guys to gain more experience whether it's from games or practice time.

Football is truly a young man's sport and NFL teams don't keep players on their squads due to sentimental reasons. It's all about "what have you done for me lately" or "potential" or "salary cap friendly players" Neither of those are in Battle's favor.

As for Nolan trading for him? I don't think even he is stupid enough to think Battle is worth a 5th or 6th. Aging WR's just aren't worth much. Hell, stars like Tory Holt and Marvin Harrison have had problems finding teams.

I don't think we disagree here. Just wanted to say, though, that the comment about Nolan was a joke

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by kronik:

Originally posted by English:

Originally posted by kronik:

Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Can we start a thread on Hill vs. Zeigler? I mean, it's not like Hill is lighting the world on fire and we should automatically assume that he will be one of the top 5 WR's, or even make this team.

Maybe the 6.0 yards per catch in his last three games (8 catches for 48 yards) is sexy to some people, but am I missing something here?

At least Battle has proven year-in, year-out that he can play the game. What has Hill done to warrant a free pass on the roster next season?

LOL. What a joke. Let's see here:

Arnaz Battle's first 2 years:

receptions: 8
Yards: 143
TDs: 0

Jason Hill's first 2 years:

receptions: 31
yards: 323
TDs: 2

Oh yea, add in the facts that Hill does not have chronic knee issues and he is 5 years younger and his salary is cheaper.

Let's see your mindless unintelligent response to this one. Oh wait, aren't you the one to say draft Carriker instead of PWillie? Oh yea, Parys Haralson will never do anything either right?

Bottomline: If you respected and wished Battle well, you would hope he catches on with another team instead of being a 5th 6th WR on ours.

I agree regaarding Hill, but you need to compare like with like. Battle's first two years were spent learning a new position. Statistically they are really not comparable.

That being said, Hill will surely stick unless he screws up big time this summer. I suspect both Battle and Z will not make the final cut.

But I can't see anyone giving up a 5th or 6th round pick for him. Why should they when all they have to do is wait? Although, maybe Nolan will trade for him?

Agreed. But my point was this: MD is claiming "what has Hill done to get a free pass this year?" Well, what did Battle do in his first 2 years to get a free pass in his 3rd year?

Look, I appreciate Battle for what he has done which is mediocre. I don't hate the guy nor wish him any misfortune. But a smart GM (aka Bill Walsh) would trade or let go of an aging injury prone player a year early rather than a year too late. By releasing or trading Battle early, it gives Battle a better chance to be productive for his next team and it also allows our younger guys to gain more experience whether it's from games or practice time.

Football is truly a young man's sport and NFL teams don't keep players on their squads due to sentimental reasons. It's all about "what have you done for me lately" or "potential" or "salary cap friendly players" Neither of those are in Battle's favor.

As for Nolan trading for him? I don't think even he is stupid enough to think Battle is worth a 5th or 6th. Aging WR's just aren't worth much. Hell, stars like Tory Holt and Marvin Harrison have had problems finding teams.

I don't think we disagree here. Just wanted to say, though, that the comment about Nolan was a joke

LOL, yea I can tell. Thank god we aren't Bronco fans. They got McDaniels and Nolan!!

I would like to see our WR corp lookin like this:

Crab
Morgan
Hill
Jones
Zeigler

Lets trade Battle for a late rounder and cut Bruce.

Originally posted by IWantWinners:
i'd rather



then to discuss these two

rofl....haaaaahahaha

It is really time to cut our losses with Battle. Being hurt year after year is getting old. In with the new and out with old. Ziegler has showed no less talent than battle, he is younger, and more healthy. Battle doesn't really bring anything to the table. The wildcat could be argued, but MRob makes much more sense...

Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Can we start a thread on Hill vs. Zeigler? I mean, it's not like Hill is lighting the world on fire and we should automatically assume that he will be one of the top 5 WR's, or even make this team.

Maybe the 6.0 yards per catch in his last three games (8 catches for 48 yards) is sexy to some people, but am I missing something here?

At least Battle has proven year-in, year-out that he can play the game. What has Hill done to warrant a free pass on the roster next season?

MD, I like and respect Battle as much as anyone, and want nothing more than for him to win a SB in a niner uniform. However, Hill is young, has performed when called upon and is likely in this team's future. There is very little chance that a second year player, drafted early in the 3rd, who has done well when called upon, will get cut. Battle, on the other hand, who is granted the better player today, has been in the league for a decent amount of time, has maximized his potential, and is coming off a serious injury (granted his first one that has cost him significant playing time). He may or may not be in Singletary's plans for 2 or 3 years from now. That's just my view of the reality of it.

I like Battle as well but there simply is no room for him in a vastly improved receiving corps. Hill looked very good at the end of last season.

Quote:
Arnaz Battle - The gritty vet. Often injured, but reliable in the clutch. Can also return punts well enough. Can throw the ball effectively on option/Wildcat plays. Currently the 49ers' longest tenured WR. Fans either love him or hate him. Made Trent Dilfer occasionally look decent.

Won't return punts on this team. That will be Rossum, backed up by Sheets.
Won't be throwing in the wildcat or the option. That will be Robinson.
Doesn't matter how long he has been here -- that actually works against him.
Fan feelings mean squat.
What he did for Dilfer is important only to Dilfer.
The fact is he won't beat out Bruce, Morgan, Crabtree, Hill or Jones.

No room for he or Zeigler.

If we cut Battle he'll find another team to go to. If we cut Zeigler on the other hand chances are we could pick him back up at any time during the season should injuries start to plague us.

Outside of Bruce pretty much all of our guys have significant injury concerns. I'm keeping the guy you know can come in and start.

Originally posted by SJniner7:
It is really time to cut our losses with Battle. Being hurt year after year is getting old. In with the new and out with old. Ziegler has showed no less talent than battle, he is younger, and more healthy. Battle doesn't really bring anything to the table. The wildcat could be argued, but MRob makes much more sense...

Zeigler has proven nothing to us! I like his speed and I was there for his 60-or-so yard catch, but Battle contributes a lot more to our team. He can be a return guy in case Rossum pulverizes on the field. Whats wrong with our depth being proven guys? It only makes our team better right?

Battle has done more for this team than pretty much anybody else on our roster save for maybe 3 or 4 players. The constant disrespect he gets from this board is one reason why in general I don't consider this to be very knowledgeable of football overall.

I'll take Battle's years of dependability over Zeiglers 5 or 6 catches any day.

And all of ya'll saying he was there during "the sucky years" need to wake up and realize 7-9 is the best we've done since 02 and Battle was our best receiver during most of that time. We're not out of any "sucky years" until we prove we can win and as of yet we haven't done that.

Battle >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Zeigler


Edit... added even more >'s

2nd Edit... still not enough >'s

Originally posted by SJniner7:
It is really time to cut our losses with Battle. Being hurt year after year is getting old. In with the new and out with old. Ziegler has showed no less talent than battle, he is younger, and more healthy. Battle doesn't really bring anything to the table. The wildcat could be argued, but MRob makes much more sense...

You can't be serious?

Zeigler has only 5 career catches and the body type of a string bean. Heck, my dog has more body mass and only 5 fewer NFL catches than Zeigler! Maybe we should sign him!

How bout neither....

Crabtree, Jones, Hill, Bruce, Morgan....