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QB Competition

I say let Hill "win" the job. See how he does. Give him 4 games. If we are 3-1, keep him in there, if we're 2-2 be very ready to pull his ass if we start losing games, but if we're 1-3, pull his ass ASAP.
Originally posted by indianajim:
another bit on the competition.

Mike Martz is gone. His system was not predicated on seeing the field as you drop back. It was predicated on "Defense does A, You will throw to B." There were no "options" for Hill to see. He drops, sees the defense, boom throws the ball. Very clever system, and reasonably successful system. I don't think he'll have that luxury with Raye's offense, and we will be back to a guy who can't deliver his rainbows downfield with any success. Ten yard seam to Vernon? Fine. 20 yard deep out to anybody else? Smith.

Smith is going to wow the coaches with his instant knowledge of the system and renewed arm strength, and you're going to see a guy who spent an entire season learning how to read defenses under one of the best QB coaches ever in Mike Martz. THAT will be the difference maker.

While I don't completely disagree, your post is contradictory. You state that Hill didn't have to read the field as he drops back because of how Martz' offense works. You are correct. But then you suggest that Smith will be better after having a year of learning how to read defenses from Martz. But Martz' offense doesn't require the QB to read the defense remember?
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by MrAdrenaline:
I don't understand how anyone can be against having a QB competition. If we had a Peyton Manning, then I would surely agree. Fact is, we don't have a QB of that caliber or anywhere near it on the roster. What can be the harm in making sure the BEST QB is starting once the regular season begins?

If you all are so sure that Hill is better, then what are you afraid of by having competition? Hill will win anyway right? He'll just be pushed harder, which should make him play better.

I for one am not convinced that Hill is the best QB on the roster. I don't care what he did last year. I want the best chance to win THIS year. If that is Hill then so be it, but if it is Smith, I'm OK with that too. Lets let them duke it out and see who deserves the job.

Anyone who is against the competition and says Hill should just be given the job is simply afraid Smith will win the competition and that they will be 'wrong' about which QB was best.

My main reason is because this teams' main issue has been chemistry. They just can't seem to get out of their own way. They all seem to believe in Hill the most by their demeanor on Sundays so why not stick with it until it doesn't work? Yes, Smith didn't lose his job, he got injured, but the belief of the team seems more in Hill and a very solid chemistry can be started early in TC rather than in game 8 of the regular season.

I think the team will have confidence in whoever the coaching staff chooses as the starter, knowing that they earned the spot in a fair competition.
Originally posted by Method:
I say let Hill "win" the job. See how he does. Give him 4 games. If we are 3-1, keep him in there, if we're 2-2 be very ready to pull his ass if we start losing games, but if we're 1-3, pull his ass ASAP.

I would go with even less games. 3 games. If he's 1-1, then he better swing in the right direction or he's out. I don't think this team can afford to wait more than 2 losses.

Now that's a true competition. Hill should just be told, "If you don't win, you lose your job." Eff this training camp crap where you have 5 seconds to throw the ball.
[ Edited by Joecool on Mar 11, 2009 at 2:50 PM ]
Originally posted by MrAdrenaline:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by MrAdrenaline:
I don't understand how anyone can be against having a QB competition. If we had a Peyton Manning, then I would surely agree. Fact is, we don't have a QB of that caliber or anywhere near it on the roster. What can be the harm in making sure the BEST QB is starting once the regular season begins?

If you all are so sure that Hill is better, then what are you afraid of by having competition? Hill will win anyway right? He'll just be pushed harder, which should make him play better.

I for one am not convinced that Hill is the best QB on the roster. I don't care what he did last year. I want the best chance to win THIS year. If that is Hill then so be it, but if it is Smith, I'm OK with that too. Lets let them duke it out and see who deserves the job.

Anyone who is against the competition and says Hill should just be given the job is simply afraid Smith will win the competition and that they will be 'wrong' about which QB was best.

My main reason is because this teams' main issue has been chemistry. They just can't seem to get out of their own way. They all seem to believe in Hill the most by their demeanor on Sundays so why not stick with it until it doesn't work? Yes, Smith didn't lose his job, he got injured, but the belief of the team seems more in Hill and a very solid chemistry can be started early in TC rather than in game 8 of the regular season.

I think the team will have confidence in whoever the coaching staff chooses as the starter, knowing that they earned the spot in a fair competition.

I don't think it's truly a fair competition unless you are judging game day play. JTO would light it up in practice but it doesn't mean he was the better QB. The same was said about Kyle Boller. Billick said he would play great in practice.

I don't want our starting QB judged by how he plays in practice where he can stay calm and throw an easy football.
Well i like the idea of how Jimmy Raye evaluated the two. He said he studied all of smith's 06 season twice. Saw how hill played against the jets, and the remainder of this last season. That led him to believe that the two qb's should battle it out. I dont want my coach to be subjective and just say hey look at how he does in practice only or look at him in games only. I mean how can we say we want the best for our team if we are just placing guys in positions. Sing said battle it out, then let them battle. they have a new OC with the same terminology. Not martz system of last year. As we said Hill has won us some games regardless of when during the season. and smith has won us games. So we get rid of nolan and martz. Say we wants whats best for our team, and the hill supporters it seems as if they are afraid that hill may lose the competition. Other than that there shouldnt be any problems if they start out on equal ground and compete.
  • yoda76
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Going into last season I don't remember so many people being up in arms over the "charade" qb competition that JTO was given......Im mean won outright.

But this season a lot of people just seem p**sed off that we are doing it again. This can only mean that they think Shaun Hill did enough to prove he is the best QB on our team. If he is, he will prove it again. But for some reason a lot of those people think we should draft a QB to groom as well. That makes no sense.

If Hill did enough to prove that he should be named the outright starter, then we shouldn't need to draft and groom another QB. But, IMO, Hill won us some games, but also looked terrible at times as well.

So far all of our QB's have proven they can win games in the NFL, but none of them have proven that they are a franchise QB that is above a QB competition.
Originally posted by BETTERDAYZ9ERS:
Originally posted by TOP_CAT:
Originally posted by BETTERDAYZ9ERS:
The problem is we don't know what is required in Raye's offense. We don't even if this whole "power running" team Sings wants us to be will work. Will it be just who makes fewer mistakes or the one who makes more plays? I never want to rule out Alex because he has a chip on his shoulder but I've seen enough of Hill to know that he can carry an offense for now!


You see,the problem is that Sing or Raye have never said they want to be a power running team. They have said they want to be able to run the ball down the throats of the defenses anytime they choose to do that.

They have also said they want to be an almost 50-50 running and passing team.

So we KNOW that the Niners under Sing and Raye will pass quite a bit and will use the TE's and RB's quite a bit to catch passes.

We also KNOW that we will run first to set up the pass (play action baby !).

We know that they want to be able to run for 1st downs on 3rd and 2 or 4th and 1,instead of having to punt all the time in those situations ,like last year under Martz.

So we KNOW that Sing was sooooo upset about being sooooo soft in the power running game last season under Martz that he fired his butt and brought in a OC that believed as he did,that you need to use the TE's and have a "real" fullback etc etc ,if you want to move the chains and get those critical first downs in crunch time .

I for one agree with sing,don't you ?

Yeah definitely, it's just hard to imagine the type of offense we will be next year. I agree with being able to run the ball effectively because we have a 1600 yard running back in our backfield but on the flip side you don't have to be able to run the ball to go far in this league. Arizona couldn't run the ball all year and look what happened. They threw the ball all over the place so they played to their strengths. Since we don't have the same players on offense then let's run and play strong defense.

Actually if you look,they started winning when they committed to the run in the playoffs.They got to the Superbowl the way 99.985634542745% of Superbowl caliber teams do...running and defense.When they were relying too heavily on the passing game,their defense was on the feild too long and they lost a lot of games.
  • kem99
  • Veteran
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Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by Method:
I say let Hill "win" the job. See how he does. Give him 4 games. If we are 3-1, keep him in there, if we're 2-2 be very ready to pull his ass if we start losing games, but if we're 1-3, pull his ass ASAP.

I would go with even less games. 3 games. If he's 1-1, then he better swing in the right direction or he's out. I don't think this team can afford to wait more than 2 losses.

Now that's a true competition. Hill should just be told, "If you don't win, you lose your job." Eff this training camp crap where you have 5 seconds to throw the ball.

If you yank the starting QB after 3 (or less than 3 games) then you didn't pick the right QB coming out of training camp to begin with. By this criteria, I guess Hill would have been pulled last year since he lost 2 of his first 3 starts. Of course, he went on to win 4 of his next 5 but by your plan here, he never would have had the chance.

You can't be pulling QBs on a whim or at the first sign of trouble. If its appropriate to pull the QB, it will be obvious. It was obvious when Singletary pulled JTO. It was obvious when Nolan pulled Smith after he came back too early from the initial shoulder injury. You don't have to set some sort of an artificial determining factor. If/when its time to make a switch at QB, it will be obvious. If it isn't obvious, its not time to switch QBs. Its that simple.
Smith looked good in 06, better then Hill did in 08. Let them battle and I'm rooting for Smith. People often judge without merit. Hill is not a better QB then Smith, point blank bottom line. If you think otherwise look at the tape, not at some superficial stats. Our WRs were stronger in 08 then 06 and overall we had a better team.

ps. gore plays better with Smith =)
As the great Weezer said, "Say it ain't so."

Per Matt Barrows:
Both Smith and Huard have been told they'll have a chance to compete for the starting position, and the 49ers have left open the possibility of adding another competitor.

http://www.sacbee.com/sf49ers/story/1715249.html?mi_rss=49ers
What's the problem? The more the merrier. Hill will end up the starter.
I sure as hell hope not! I am hoping he is just a 3rd roster filler. If Sing starts Huard over Hill and Smith, I am going to be severely .......
I can see Huard getting the #2 spot; just behind Hill and ahead of Smith...
  • supersing
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i don't see the problem. in a perfect world alex takes it hands down, is comeback player of the year and super bowl mvp. in our world may the best man win!