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QB Competition

Originally posted by Leathaface:
Originally posted by indianajim:
Originally posted by Leathaface:

You guys are fooling yourselves if you think Alex Smith as any chance at being our opening day starter. Hill goes 3 for 7 and all of a sudden he's on even ground with Smith? Get real.

Does anyone honestly think Smith is going to win the 'competition'? That's what I'd like to hear. Not any of this "it's still in the air guys!" I'd like to know who actually believes Alex Smith is going to start.

I believe if Alex Smith outplays Hill again vs. Dallas, Smith will be our opening day starter.

Hill didn't just go 3/7, he did so with some REALLY bad throws, and one that was initially picked off until Morgan ripped it out of the DB's hands. He didn't have the bonehead drops that Smith had, and if those had been caught, the difference between Smith and Hill would have been even larger.

You and your emotional attachment to Hill would do well to develop some objectivity.

The pass to Morgan was not in the DBs hands. Morgan also saved Alex on a pass the previous week (no it wasn't a good throw, he got lucky it wasn't picked off).

You call them bonehead drops, I call them passes that weren't on target. All interceptions happen for a reason right? When you constantly throw behind, ahead, and above your targets, there will be some drops and there will be some interceptions. Smith is just as much to blame as Morgan. Every interception isn't clear cut like you'd like to believe. Is it just a coincidence that when Smith comes in, our WRs all of a sudden start to drop passes? Of course not.

Bottom line, at the end of the season you look a guys stats and you don't say his interceptions were/weren't his fault. It is what it is.

Anyway, I have no attachment to Hill, as hard as that may be for you to fathom. I just believe that he's the better QB in every way, shape, and form. Moreover, he's earned the right to start this year.

But they do get paid to catch anything in the vincinty. Not just ones perfectly placed in the hands. Gotta help the QB which in turn helps your stats and helps you team and hopefully we win the Game.
Originally posted by Leathaface:
Originally posted by indianajim:
Originally posted by Leathaface:

You guys are fooling yourselves if you think Alex Smith as any chance at being our opening day starter. Hill goes 3 for 7 and all of a sudden he's on even ground with Smith? Get real.

Does anyone honestly think Smith is going to win the 'competition'? That's what I'd like to hear. Not any of this "it's still in the air guys!" I'd like to know who actually believes Alex Smith is going to start.

I believe if Alex Smith outplays Hill again vs. Dallas, Smith will be our opening day starter.

Hill didn't just go 3/7, he did so with some REALLY bad throws, and one that was initially picked off until Morgan ripped it out of the DB's hands. He didn't have the bonehead drops that Smith had, and if those had been caught, the difference between Smith and Hill would have been even larger.

You and your emotional attachment to Hill would do well to develop some objectivity.

The pass to Morgan was not in the DBs hands. Morgan also saved Alex on a pass the previous week (no it wasn't a good throw, he got lucky it wasn't picked off).

You call them bonehead drops, I call them passes that weren't on target. All interceptions happen for a reason right? When you constantly throw behind, ahead, and above your targets, there will be some drops and there will be some interceptions. Smith is just as much to blame as Morgan. Every interception isn't clear cut like you'd like to believe. Is it just a coincidence that when Smith comes in, our WRs all of a sudden start to drop passes? Of course not.

Bottom line, at the end of the season you look a guys stats and you don't say his interceptions were/weren't his fault. It is what it is.

Anyway, I have no attachment to Hill, as hard as that may be for you to fathom. I just believe that he's the better QB in every way, shape, and form. Moreover, he's earned the right to start this year.

Okay Leatha, it's his F'N job to get his hands on the ball.

1stly "saving Smith from his bad throw" Ummmmmmmmmmm dude if ANY Receiver is around a bad pass they become DBs'. That's their JOB to keep the ball out of the mitts of the Defender.

2ndly and bare with me now, haven't seen the game but SAW the highlight. That freakin thing hit Morgan right in the mitts. He SHOULD have caught the pass. Especially when SO MANY think that Battle is expected to be cut.

I played the position I know what he's SPOSED to do. No not pros or even college ball but I don't care what level it is it's been the same since Pee Wees. Put your grubby mitts on the ball or knock it down. It is Morgan that caused the INT. Not Smith for throwing a "P{$$ poor pass". Morgan got his mitts on it so Smith is not responsible for the INT.

So sorry but you are wrong my friend.

*edit*Oh and point of clarification? Just how did Hill cement the right to Start this year? Super Bowl win? Mmmmm Division Championship? Oh okay Playoffs? +.500 season?

No to any of those? Then he did NOT earn the right to be named the Starter. I don't know how this is so hard for people to fathom but he did enough to earn the right to COMPETE but not enough to OWN the position outright. This goes in reverse for Smith. The guy lost his spot due to injury. He earned the right to compete based on his record prior to playing injured. He did not do enough to own the spot outright either so there we are in a competition for the top spot. From what I see statistically this past game they look alot alike. So if you think about it Smith is probably the guy. But I would go radical here if neither play well next week. I would start Huard on opening day because he HAS played well. But that's just me.

~Ceadder
[ Edited by Ceadderman on Aug 23, 2009 at 10:20 PM ]
After watching the Raiders/49ers replay, I must say... I was impressed by Alex Smith's pocket presence and his ability to go through his progressions from WR to WR. A lot of you would say Shaun Hill should start, (and to a point, I DO AGREE) but at the same time Alex has the better arm and mobility. It is not completely his fault that 3 WRs were unable to catch the ball. If the football is catchable, it is the WR's responsibility to do his job!

I think Alex deserves to start Game 3 vs. Dallas, then decide the starting QB for Week 1 of the regular season. Whether or not Alex wins the starting job for Week 1, I do believe he will be starting at some point this season. I think he just needs more playing time with the WRs and the starting offensive line so that he can get back into a rhythm with the offense.

My main concern with Shaun Hill starting is that these short dink and dunk passes will become ineffective as teams realize that he doesn't have the arm strength he needs to make certain throws. I just think Alex Smith will get better if he gets more playing time.

BOTTOM LINE: WE CAN'T START OFF THE SEASON SLOWLY! I guarantee if Shaun Hill starts off stumbling out of the blocks, HC Singletary will make a switch by Week 4. I still think Alex Smith has more upside. Maybe he won't start now, but I'm sure he will be the starting QB again!
Originally posted by PTulini:
After watching the Raiders/49ers replay, I must say... I was impressed by Alex Smith's pocket presence and his ability to go through his progressions from WR to WR. A lot of you would say Shaun Hill should start, (and to a point, I DO AGREE) but at the same time Alex has the better arm and mobility. It is not completely his fault that 3 WRs were unable to catch the ball. If the football is catchable, it is the WR's responsibility to do his job!

I think Alex deserves to start Game 3 vs. Dallas, then decide the starting QB for Week 1 of the regular season. Whether or not Alex wins the starting job for Week 1, I do believe he will be starting at some point this season. I think he just needs more playing time with the WRs and the starting offensive line so that he can get back into a rhythm with the offense.

My main concern with Shaun Hill starting is that these short dink and dunk passes will become ineffective as teams realize that he doesn't have the arm strength he needs to make certain throws. I just think Alex Smith will get better if he gets more playing time.

BOTTOM LINE: WE CAN'T START OFF THE SEASON SLOWLY! I guarantee if Shaun Hill starts off stumbling out of the blocks, HC Singletary will make a switch by Week 4. I still think Alex Smith has more upside. Maybe he won't start now, but I'm sure he will be the starting QB again!

I have faith in both of them, I really do
I think Hill will be announced by Wednesday.
I'm tired of every year talking about a QB Competition! Were suppose to be stabalize are we are not. How are we going to get better if we got no stability in the position. We need a real QB and stop experimenting because it always backfires and never works. Don't we learn from our mistakes? Our we the Raiders or something! There should be no doubt in our minds that we are drafting a QB with one of our 2 picks in the first round.

Let's go 49ers and get the season kicked off already!
Originally posted by Kalen49ers:
I dont have much confidence in either Hill or Smith, but for me Hill looks like the more ready QB out there. Smith just doesnt have it at all



just plain whatever. im done drilling facts and wasting my breath on haters

some people have legitimate statements against smith. but your just completely "talking out of your ass"
!
[ Edited by fan49 on Aug 24, 2009 at 12:27 AM ]
Originally posted by Leathaface:
Originally posted by indianajim:
Originally posted by Leathaface:

You guys are fooling yourselves if you think Alex Smith as any chance at being our opening day starter. Hill goes 3 for 7 and all of a sudden he's on even ground with Smith? Get real.

Does anyone honestly think Smith is going to win the 'competition'? That's what I'd like to hear. Not any of this "it's still in the air guys!" I'd like to know who actually believes Alex Smith is going to start.

I believe if Alex Smith outplays Hill again vs. Dallas, Smith will be our opening day starter.

Hill didn't just go 3/7, he did so with some REALLY bad throws, and one that was initially picked off until Morgan ripped it out of the DB's hands. He didn't have the bonehead drops that Smith had, and if those had been caught, the difference between Smith and Hill would have been even larger.

You and your emotional attachment to Hill would do well to develop some objectivity.

The pass to Morgan was not in the DBs hands. Morgan also saved Alex on a pass the previous week (no it wasn't a good throw, he got lucky it wasn't picked off).

You call them bonehead drops, I call them passes that weren't on target. All interceptions happen for a reason right? When you constantly throw behind, ahead, and above your targets, there will be some drops and there will be some interceptions. Smith is just as much to blame as Morgan. Every interception isn't clear cut like you'd like to believe. Is it just a coincidence that when Smith comes in, our WRs all of a sudden start to drop passes? Of course not.

Bottom line, at the end of the season you look a guys stats and you don't say his interceptions were/weren't his fault. It is what it is.

Anyway, I have no attachment to Hill, as hard as that may be for you to fathom. I just believe that he's the better QB in every way, shape, and form. Moreover, he's earned the right to start this year.

You're letting your bias get in the way of your game watching. The throw to Moran Vs. Denver was in the only place where Bailey could not get it.

Fact is that Morgan got two hands on the ball, popped it up, and it got picked. Morgan admitted that he took his eyes off the ball and was worrying about running before he caught the ball, and that it was on him.
Originally posted by boomer49er:
Originally posted by Leathaface:
Originally posted by indianajim:
Originally posted by Leathaface:

You guys are fooling yourselves if you think Alex Smith as any chance at being our opening day starter. Hill goes 3 for 7 and all of a sudden he's on even ground with Smith? Get real.

Does anyone honestly think Smith is going to win the 'competition'? That's what I'd like to hear. Not any of this "it's still in the air guys!" I'd like to know who actually believes Alex Smith is going to start.

I believe if Alex Smith outplays Hill again vs. Dallas, Smith will be our opening day starter.

Hill didn't just go 3/7, he did so with some REALLY bad throws, and one that was initially picked off until Morgan ripped it out of the DB's hands. He didn't have the bonehead drops that Smith had, and if those had been caught, the difference between Smith and Hill would have been even larger.

You and your emotional attachment to Hill would do well to develop some objectivity.

The pass to Morgan was not in the DBs hands. Morgan also saved Alex on a pass the previous week (no it wasn't a good throw, he got lucky it wasn't picked off).

You call them bonehead drops, I call them passes that weren't on target. All interceptions happen for a reason right? When you constantly throw behind, ahead, and above your targets, there will be some drops and there will be some interceptions. Smith is just as much to blame as Morgan. Every interception isn't clear cut like you'd like to believe. Is it just a coincidence that when Smith comes in, our WRs all of a sudden start to drop passes? Of course not.

Bottom line, at the end of the season you look a guys stats and you don't say his interceptions were/weren't his fault. It is what it is.

Anyway, I have no attachment to Hill, as hard as that may be for you to fathom. I just believe that he's the better QB in every way, shape, and form. Moreover, he's earned the right to start this year.

You're letting your bias get in the way of your game watching. The throw to Moran Vs. Denver was in the only place where Bailey could not get it.

Fact is that Morgan got two hands on the ball, popped it up, and it got picked. Morgan admitted that he took his eyes off the ball and was worrying about running before he caught the ball, and that it was on him.

boomer to the rescue please share some knowledge brother. i don't know who you support but your posts are always unbiased and well thought out!
[ Edited by fan49 on Aug 24, 2009 at 12:29 AM ]
  • ImaMod
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 10,482
Originally posted by boomer49er:
Originally posted by Leathaface:
Originally posted by indianajim:
Originally posted by Leathaface:

You guys are fooling yourselves if you think Alex Smith as any chance at being our opening day starter. Hill goes 3 for 7 and all of a sudden he's on even ground with Smith? Get real.

Does anyone honestly think Smith is going to win the 'competition'? That's what I'd like to hear. Not any of this "it's still in the air guys!" I'd like to know who actually believes Alex Smith is going to start.

I believe if Alex Smith outplays Hill again vs. Dallas, Smith will be our opening day starter.

Hill didn't just go 3/7, he did so with some REALLY bad throws, and one that was initially picked off until Morgan ripped it out of the DB's hands. He didn't have the bonehead drops that Smith had, and if those had been caught, the difference between Smith and Hill would have been even larger.

You and your emotional attachment to Hill would do well to develop some objectivity.

The pass to Morgan was not in the DBs hands. Morgan also saved Alex on a pass the previous week (no it wasn't a good throw, he got lucky it wasn't picked off).

You call them bonehead drops, I call them passes that weren't on target. All interceptions happen for a reason right? When you constantly throw behind, ahead, and above your targets, there will be some drops and there will be some interceptions. Smith is just as much to blame as Morgan. Every interception isn't clear cut like you'd like to believe. Is it just a coincidence that when Smith comes in, our WRs all of a sudden start to drop passes? Of course not.

Bottom line, at the end of the season you look a guys stats and you don't say his interceptions were/weren't his fault. It is what it is.

Anyway, I have no attachment to Hill, as hard as that may be for you to fathom. I just believe that he's the better QB in every way, shape, and form. Moreover, he's earned the right to start this year.

You're letting your bias get in the way of your game watching. The throw to Moran Vs. Denver was in the only place where Bailey could not get it.
Fact is that Morgan got two hands on the ball, popped it up, and it got picked. Morgan admitted that he took his eyes off the ball and was worrying about running before he caught the ball, and that it was on him.

Exactly. And on the play where the ball fell out of Morgan's hands wasn't Smith's fault at all. He threw it right to Morgan and it should've been an easy catch for Josh.
Our receivers had 3 drops that shouldve been easy completions for Smith. Smith stats look way wors than they really are, he went 3/9 and 1 INT, he shouldve went 6/9, with no INT. Shaun Hill went 3/7 and threw some terrible passes.
Not to mention Smith did this:

[ Edited by ImaMod on Aug 24, 2009 at 2:05 AM ]
  • ZRF80
  • Member
  • Posts: 13,551
Jesus, will all you Smith apologetics get REAL for once ? Is it sheer coincidence that EVERYTIME Smith is our QB, the "drops" and "miscues" by our receivers increase ? Did it ever occur to you people that Alex Smith is too slow in his reads, and that by the time he throws to his receivers, they're way past running their routes and are circling the field like chickens with their heads cut off. Yeah, if I ran a 5 yard outpattern, didnt have my QB throw to me......Id be running like a maniac too around all those defenders. Which would definitely skew my attention level to a point where I might not be concentrating on the ball too well.

Seriously, some of you guys need to wake up. Why dont you go back and pull out ALL your posts from Webzone archives that state "receivers dropped the ball", "receivers dropped the ball", "receivers dropped the ball". It's freaking hilarious, cause this "problem" only exists with Smith in. And please, dont even bother to try and convince us realists that Alex Smith has an arm like Favre's, and his receivers cant see the ball.

The truth: Alex doesnt do a good job reading through his progressions. When he does, he throws a bad ball. When he doesnt, he forces his receivers into unconventional positions. No s**t they keep dropping balls.

Im not saying Hill is Montana reincarnate. But he sure as hell has better command of the field than Smith has. And Id rather put the ball in his hands on 3rd and 21, than give Smith a shot on 3rd and 5.
Originally posted by ZRF80:
Jesus, will all you Smith apologetics get REAL for once ? Is it sheer coincidence that EVERYTIME Smith is our QB, the "drops" and "miscues" by our receivers increase ? Did it ever occur to you people that Alex Smith is too slow in his reads, and that by the time he throws to his receivers, they're way past running their routes and are circling the field like chickens with their heads cut off. Yeah, if I ran a 5 yard outpattern, didnt have my QB throw to me......Id be running like a maniac too around all those defenders. Which would definitely skew my attention level to a point where I might not be concentrating on the ball too well.

Seriously, some of you guys need to wake up. Why dont you go back and pull out ALL your posts from Webzone archives that state "receivers dropped the ball", "receivers dropped the ball", "receivers dropped the ball". It's freaking hilarious, cause this "problem" only exists with Smith in. And please, dont even bother to try and convince us realists that Alex Smith has an arm like Favre's, and his receivers cant see the ball.

The truth: Alex doesnt do a good job reading through his progressions. When he does, he throws a bad ball. When he doesnt, he forces his receivers into unconventional positions. No s**t they keep dropping balls.

Im not saying Hill is Montana reincarnate. But he sure as hell has better command of the field than Smith has. And Id rather put the ball in his hands on 3rd and 21, than give Smith a shot on 3rd and 5.

Thank you ZRF.

I don't think it's ever going to be possible to sway some fans. It has to do with the emotional attachment to a high QB pick. People want so bad for the guy to be the next Peyton Manning that they become so blinded to what's in front of them...the guy SUCKS. They also forget that many (if not most) top pick QBs never live up to expectations.

There are still people in Detroit who feel Joey H got a raw deal, there are still people in Cleveland who feel Couch got a raw deal, there are still people in Houston that feel Carr got a raw deal, and there will always people in SF that think Smith got a raw deal.

Let me quote Steve Young from his KNBR show here when asked about Alex Smith: "Every player can come to you with a laundry list full of reasons for why they shouldn't have made it. The fact is, the good ones figure out that way to make it." Spoken by the legend himself. Just to reiterate, this was in direct reference to Alex Smith.
[ Edited by Leathaface on Aug 24, 2009 at 4:02 AM ]
Originally posted by ZRF80:
Jesus, will all you Smith apologetics get REAL for once ? Is it sheer coincidence that EVERYTIME Smith is our QB, the "drops" and "miscues" by our receivers increase ? Did it ever occur to you people that Alex Smith is too slow in his reads, and that by the time he throws to his receivers, they're way past running their routes and are circling the field like chickens with their heads cut off. Yeah, if I ran a 5 yard outpattern, didnt have my QB throw to me......Id be running like a maniac too around all those defenders. Which would definitely skew my attention level to a point where I might not be concentrating on the ball too well.

Seriously, some of you guys need to wake up. Why dont you go back and pull out ALL your posts from Webzone archives that state "receivers dropped the ball", "receivers dropped the ball", "receivers dropped the ball". It's freaking hilarious, cause this "problem" only exists with Smith in. And please, dont even bother to try and convince us realists that Alex Smith has an arm like Favre's, and his receivers cant see the ball.

The truth: Alex doesnt do a good job reading through his progressions. When he does, he throws a bad ball. When he doesnt, he forces his receivers into unconventional positions. No s**t they keep dropping balls.

Im not saying Hill is Montana reincarnate. But he sure as hell has better command of the field than Smith has. And Id rather put the ball in his hands on 3rd and 21, than give Smith a shot on 3rd and 5.

If Alex is slow in his progressions... and sometimes he is... that is no excuse for receivers to drop catchable passes. Ball comes your way? You catch it, or you sit the bench. The only thing rediculous is this desparation by some to discredit Alex Smith. There are things that he needs to do better... ball placement and decision making... but that will come with time and comfort behind center.

Bottom line is catchable passes get caught... or it's on the receivers. They make too much coin for this pampered belief that the ball must be put perfectly placed.
Don't know why we're fighting about Smith being bad...when Hill played worse he throws like a girl. Sure he can read a defense but man he has no zip on ANY of his passes and he's been sacked more then Smith has this preseason so who holds on to the ball more? They both played HORRIBLY but Smith win's round two hands down with his pass to Vernon Davis for the first down was quick and on the money and the 3rd down pass to Arnaz Battle was perfect for the first down. Hill got lucky he should have been picked off if not for Morgan stealing that ball, so really Smith had a better game round 2...all be it, a better "crap" game lol. Let's stop fighting with each other and be happy that the offense is running over first team defenses with our back up running backs and that our defense is causing turnovers and stuffing the run without a couple of key starters...lets JUST BE HAPPY FOOTBALL IS BACK god I can't wait for Sundays!
  • fryet
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,863
So far, neither player has "won" the competition. Right now it appears that we are choosing the lesser of 2 evils. Smith did good things and bad things. Hill looked pretty mediocre as well. I couldn't fault Singletary for choosing either of them, but if they don't improve, we had better draft a 1st round QB next year.

Smith's problems:
throwing the ball too fast where a little touch would have helped (pass to Isaac Bruce comes to mind)
throwing a slightly inaccurate ball (often too high) - several passes were like this, especially the interception
rolling to his right to escape a sack always results in him throwing the ball away - if he has this great arm strength, let's see him throw it accross his body for a completion. If he is supposed to be a fast QB, let's see him outrun the DE and get some positive yardage.