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QB Competition

Originally posted by BrodieFan:
JTO performed better because he was the only one who had a full understanding of Martz' schemes. I read that he wasn't helpful to Hill and Smith either - he seemed to treat the knowledge as his personal advantage, which is what it was - he just evidently wasn't a team player. I thought he could have been very good with better protection, but I think teams learned how to play him - how to jump the outlet receiver because they noticed that when he went to the outlet, he would go quickly, sometimes without hardly looking. At least a few of his ints were passes thrown right to someone.

I agree with everything you said.

Although, and in my opinion, him having an advantage because he knew the offense is irrelevant. I'm not saying it didn't help him. I'm just saying it's just the way things unfold. People can't say, "oh he only started because he knew the offense." Was anyone else qualified to run the offense at the time? Unfortunately not. Martz was our coordinator. People are basically saying that Martz shouldn't have been hired. Moreover, he performed GOOD in preseason. He didn't get the job handed to him. He won it.

Hill came in and did a great job after JTO failed to make adjustments to his errors. Some might claim the offense was tailored towards him. Fine, it may have been. I'll say that Hill just has a better feel for the game than JTO and an exponentially better feel for the game than Smith.
Originally posted by Leathaface:
Originally posted by BrodieFan:
JTO performed better because he was the only one who had a full understanding of Martz' schemes. I read that he wasn't helpful to Hill and Smith either - he seemed to treat the knowledge as his personal advantage, which is what it was - he just evidently wasn't a team player. I thought he could have been very good with better protection, but I think teams learned how to play him - how to jump the outlet receiver because they noticed that when he went to the outlet, he would go quickly, sometimes without hardly looking. At least a few of his ints were passes thrown right to someone.

I agree with everything you said.

Although, and in my opinion, him having an advantage because he knew the offense is irrelevant. I'm not saying it didn't help him. I'm just saying it's just the way things unfold. People can't say, "oh he only started because he knew the offense." Was anyone else qualified to run the offense at the time? Unfortunately not. Martz was our coordinator. People are basically saying that Martz shouldn't have been hired. Moreover, he performed GOOD in preseason. He didn't get the job handed to him. He won it.

Hill came in and did a great job after JTO failed to make adjustments to his errors. Some might claim the offense was tailored towards him. Fine, it may have been. I'll say that Hill just has a better feel for the game than JTO and an exponentially better feel for the game than Smith.

You're right, but I think there's still a bitter taste in some people's mouths over how the "QB Competition" was handled by the coaches last year. Anyone could see after a couple weeks that JTO was getting all the 1st team reps and was going to be chosen as the starter, but Nolan just kept up the phony line of a fair competition when anyone could tell JTO was getting preferential treatment. I don't see Sing handling situations as poorly, so this year's competition should be clearer.
Maybe I'm recalling history a little differently than the ardent Smith supporters, but I seem to remember a QB who consistently was late with his throws, under or over threw his receivers, and had little to no pocket sense (or a lack of peripheral vision for approaching tacklers; whatever). Is this the same guy we're talking about?
Admittedly, he was thrown into the fire too soon and with little in the way of a supporting cast, but we can't change that. all we can do is deal with the guy who emerged, and boys, he needs to show he's a vastly different guy than we've seen thus far. I can go as far as giving him the benefit of the doubt and see if he's a different QB than when last we saw him, but to say unequivacly that he's better than Hill, I think is way off base and inaccurate, certainly based on what we've seen of the two so far. We know Hill's not the greatest practice player, so I don't think a "compettition in camp is the way to choose. Hill has earned the starting job and should lose it based on his play in games. JMHO
I still don't understand a need for a competition. We have a guy who went 7-3 and 5-0 at home.

No Respect.

Shuan Hill's nickname should be Rodney Dangerfield.
[ Edited by Joecool on Apr 6, 2009 at 3:05 PM ]
Originally posted by Joecool:
I still don't understand a need for a competition. We have a guy who went 7-3 and 5-0 at home.

No Respect.

Shuan Hill's nickname should be Rodney Dangerfield.

and smith went 7-9 in 2006, with impressive wins vs seattle and denver, 2 and 1 in 2007 before being hurt, and is the guy that present management chose to be the quarterback of the future...

i really do not see why fans write smith off so quickly, alot seem to be putting alot of stock in smith's 3 games in 2007 when he came back and played with a severely seperated shoulder....i realize that shaun hill could probably excel with a seperated shoulder, but most qbs with a shoulder needing major surgery arent going to play too well, and im not going to put much stock in such games in judging a player

shaun hill has never started, let alone won, a game that meant anything in the standings.....he has rode out the end of 2 dismal seasons....

what is the probably with hill earning the job, certainly if he is so great he will surely be able to withstand any competition, heck he probably would have beat out cutler or warner if the niners had obtained them
Originally posted by hofer36:
Originally posted by Joecool:
I still don't understand a need for a competition. We have a guy who went 7-3 and 5-0 at home.

No Respect.

Shuan Hill's nickname should be Rodney Dangerfield.

and smith went 7-9 in 2006, with impressive wins vs seattle and denver, 2 and 1 in 2007 before being hurt, and is the guy that present management chose to be the quarterback of the future...

i really do not see why fans write smith off so quickly, alot seem to be putting alot of stock in smith's 3 games in 2007 when he came back and played with a severely seperated shoulder....i realize that shaun hill could probably excel with a seperated shoulder, but most qbs with a shoulder needing major surgery arent going to play too well, and im not going to put much stock in such games in judging a player

shaun hill has never started, let alone won, a game that meant anything in the standings.....he has rode out the end of 2 dismal seasons....

what is the probably with hill earning the job, certainly if he is so great he will surely be able to withstand any competition, heck he probably would have beat out cutler or warner if the niners had obtained them

Originally posted by hofer36:
Originally posted by Joecool:
I still don't understand a need for a competition. We have a guy who went 7-3 and 5-0 at home.

No Respect.

Shuan Hill's nickname should be Rodney Dangerfield.

and smith went 7-9 in 2006, with impressive wins vs seattle and denver, 2 and 1 in 2007 before being hurt, and is the guy that present management chose to be the quarterback of the future...

i really do not see why fans write smith off so quickly, alot seem to be putting alot of stock in smith's 3 games in 2007 when he came back and played with a severely seperated shoulder....i realize that shaun hill could probably excel with a seperated shoulder, but most qbs with a shoulder needing major surgery arent going to play too well, and im not going to put much stock in such games in judging a player

shaun hill has never started, let alone won, a game that meant anything in the standings.....he has rode out the end of 2 dismal seasons....

what is the probably with hill earning the job, certainly if he is so great he will surely be able to withstand any competition, heck he probably would have beat out cutler or warner if the niners had obtained them

LOL you do know the difference between 7-3 and 7-9; right?...


I just can't believe the homer factor on the board sometimes...
I say let Hill start and if we start out 2-3 or 1-3 or something similar...let Smith play.

I prefer Smith to be "the guy" (because it saves us drafting again 3 years) and it would just be nice to know that all of our money didnt go totally to waste. That being said, Hill won fair and square. Who cares who wins on the practice field...the guy WON in games. Thats all that matters. This is coming from a Smith supporter.

Smith winning and doing well would be the most IDEAL situation...I think we can ALL agree on that. But Hill deserves the job. Its disrespectful IMO to say otherwise. 7-3 overall and 5-0 at home. Thats pretty impressive. Everyone keeps saying, "Well teams will figure him out and we'll be fvcked.." ok fine...so lets get to that point first. They havent "figured him out" yet so why not just fly with it for now.


All I'm saying is what do we have to lose? If Hill fvcks up then we have Smith who, while may not be spectacular, is young, fairly talented, has a good attitude, and can shown he CAN win.

But bottom line: HILL should start game 1.
Originally posted by Leathaface:
Originally posted by hofer36:
Originally posted by Joecool:
I still don't understand a need for a competition. We have a guy who went 7-3 and 5-0 at home.

No Respect.

Shuan Hill's nickname should be Rodney Dangerfield.

and smith went 7-9 in 2006, with impressive wins vs seattle and denver, 2 and 1 in 2007 before being hurt, and is the guy that present management chose to be the quarterback of the future...

i really do not see why fans write smith off so quickly, alot seem to be putting alot of stock in smith's 3 games in 2007 when he came back and played with a severely seperated shoulder....i realize that shaun hill could probably excel with a seperated shoulder, but most qbs with a shoulder needing major surgery arent going to play too well, and im not going to put much stock in such games in judging a player

shaun hill has never started, let alone won, a game that meant anything in the standings.....he has rode out the end of 2 dismal seasons....

what is the probably with hill earning the job, certainly if he is so great he will surely be able to withstand any competition, heck he probably would have beat out cutler or warner if the niners had obtained them


Quote:
I think we're gonna draft Sanchez and trade him.

I also think Smith will beat Hill in the competition.

Now that was funny!!!

[ Edited by ezrider on Apr 6, 2009 at 8:16 PM ]
Originally posted by LambdaChi49:
I say let Hill start and if we start out 2-3 or 1-3 or something similar...let Smith play.

I prefer Smith to be "the guy" (because it saves us drafting again 3 years) and it would just be nice to know that all of our money didnt go totally to waste. That being said, Hill won fair and square. Who cares who wins on the practice field...the guy WON in games. Thats all that matters. This is coming from a Smith supporter.

Smith winning and doing well would be the most IDEAL situation...I think we can ALL agree on that. But Hill deserves the job. Its disrespectful IMO to say otherwise. 7-3 overall and 5-0 at home. Thats pretty impressive. Everyone keeps saying, "Well teams will figure him out and we'll be fvcked.." ok fine...so lets get to that point first. They havent "figured him out" yet so why not just fly with it for now.


All I'm saying is what do we have to lose? If Hill fvcks up then we have Smith who, while may not be spectacular, is young, fairly talented, has a good attitude, and can shown he CAN win.

But bottom line: HILL should start game 1.

I agree with this 100%.
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by hofer36:
Originally posted by Joecool:
I still don't understand a need for a competition. We have a guy who went 7-3 and 5-0 at home.

No Respect.

Shuan Hill's nickname should be Rodney Dangerfield.

and smith went 7-9 in 2006, with impressive wins vs seattle and denver, 2 and 1 in 2007 before being hurt, and is the guy that present management chose to be the quarterback of the future...

i really do not see why fans write smith off so quickly, alot seem to be putting alot of stock in smith's 3 games in 2007 when he came back and played with a severely seperated shoulder....i realize that shaun hill could probably excel with a seperated shoulder, but most qbs with a shoulder needing major surgery arent going to play too well, and im not going to put much stock in such games in judging a player

shaun hill has never started, let alone won, a game that meant anything in the standings.....he has rode out the end of 2 dismal seasons....

what is the probably with hill earning the job, certainly if he is so great he will surely be able to withstand any competition, heck he probably would have beat out cutler or warner if the niners had obtained them

LOL you do know the difference between 7-3 and 7-9; right?...


I just can't believe the homer factor on the board sometimes...

jim druckenmiller was 1-0 as a starter maybe he should be brought back..
Originally posted by hofer36:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by hofer36:
Originally posted by Joecool:
I still don't understand a need for a competition. We have a guy who went 7-3 and 5-0 at home.

No Respect.

Shuan Hill's nickname should be Rodney Dangerfield.

and smith went 7-9 in 2006, with impressive wins vs seattle and denver, 2 and 1 in 2007 before being hurt, and is the guy that present management chose to be the quarterback of the future...

i really do not see why fans write smith off so quickly, alot seem to be putting alot of stock in smith's 3 games in 2007 when he came back and played with a severely seperated shoulder....i realize that shaun hill could probably excel with a seperated shoulder, but most qbs with a shoulder needing major surgery arent going to play too well, and im not going to put much stock in such games in judging a player

shaun hill has never started, let alone won, a game that meant anything in the standings.....he has rode out the end of 2 dismal seasons....

what is the probably with hill earning the job, certainly if he is so great he will surely be able to withstand any competition, heck he probably would have beat out cutler or warner if the niners had obtained them

LOL you do know the difference between 7-3 and 7-9; right?...


I just can't believe the homer factor on the board sometimes...

jim druckenmiller was 1-0 as a starter maybe he should be brought back..

He threw for 239 yards with 1 TD and 4 INTs. Now how many games did it take Alex Smith to throw a TD? What was his INT/TD ratio that first year again? Oh yeah, you don't even need to simplify it: 1/11
Originally posted by hofer36:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Originally posted by hofer36:
Originally posted by Joecool:
I still don't understand a need for a competition. We have a guy who went 7-3 and 5-0 at home.

No Respect.

Shuan Hill's nickname should be Rodney Dangerfield.

and smith went 7-9 in 2006, with impressive wins vs seattle and denver, 2 and 1 in 2007 before being hurt, and is the guy that present management chose to be the quarterback of the future...

i really do not see why fans write smith off so quickly, alot seem to be putting alot of stock in smith's 3 games in 2007 when he came back and played with a severely seperated shoulder....i realize that shaun hill could probably excel with a seperated shoulder, but most qbs with a shoulder needing major surgery arent going to play too well, and im not going to put much stock in such games in judging a player

shaun hill has never started, let alone won, a game that meant anything in the standings.....he has rode out the end of 2 dismal seasons....

what is the probably with hill earning the job, certainly if he is so great he will surely be able to withstand any competition, heck he probably would have beat out cutler or warner if the niners had obtained them

LOL you do know the difference between 7-3 and 7-9; right?...


I just can't believe the homer factor on the board sometimes...

jim druckenmiller was 1-0 as a starter maybe he should be brought back..

Wow, your use of statistics (including specific attention to sample size) is mind boggling
You're right - one game is not a big enough sample. But I could say the same thing about a half a season. I think Shaun Hill should probably start because he ended the season as the starter and had some success, but my worry is that by the third or fourth game he played, some DB's had him almost completely figured out.