3-4 or 4-3

Originally posted by 49erLifer:

Originally posted by BETTERDAYZ9ERS:

Originally posted by BirdmanJr:
Cuz we aren't going to a 3-4 anytime soon.

I know we switched more to a 4-3 when Sing stepped in but we have the players to switch in the middle of games like we have in the past. I just think now Singletary wants to stabilize a 4 man front for good.

I don't recall this.

Originally posted by BETTERDAYZ9ERS:
Now that we signed Evans does this mean we will use a 4 man front now and ditch the 3-4? His size suggests he needs to lined up with a 4 man front and Balmer and Soap will be moved inside to the nose, any thoughts?

Yeah, did you even watch the second half of the season or hear Sing speak?....

Originally posted by BETTERDAYZ9ERS:

Originally posted by BirdmanJr:
Cuz we aren't going to a 3-4 anytime soon.

I know we switched more to a 4-3 when Sing stepped in but we have the players to switch in the middle of games like we have in the past. I just think now Singletary wants to stabilize a 4 man front for good.

Christ..........

Originally posted by BETTERDAYZ9ERS:

Originally posted by BirdmanJr:
Cuz we aren't going to a 3-4 anytime soon.

I know we switched more to a 4-3 when Sing stepped in but we have the players to switch in the middle of games like we have in the past. I just think now Singletary wants to stabilize a 4 man front for good.

No bro we went with the 3-4 full time when Sing took over. We were runnin a combo with Nolan also his retarded big nickle package which kept Manny out on 3rd downs?

Originally posted by pdxredandgold:
make it stop.


or on the other hand maybe we should change the system we have, that we've been drafting for, coaching for, signing free agents for and that our D coordinator is schooled in because we got Demetric Evans.

yeah, that sounds smart

That's a good one! I agree, we need to build our defense around Demetric Evans. I'm for that. Let's go in a new direction.

It was confusing to draft him but we ar enot going away from the 3-4 especially since the winners of most of the last 5 superbowls have been 3-4 teams. Witht he exception of the G-men and the colts.

Evans is no cinch to be a starter. It's not like we picked up Haynesworth! Sure, we're going to rearrange our defense for a free agent.

Originally posted by BETTERDAYZ9ERS:

Originally posted by BirdmanJr:

What's so funny about it?

Some people want any excuse to use a colourfull little picture in their post

Some of you think I'm suggesting we're changing our scheme because of Evans. I might have not noticed our alignment on every snap of every game and I wasn't sure if Sing went to a 4-3 or not. I just noticed how well the defense played in the second half of the season. All I'm saying is where does Evans fit. He didn't play bad in place of Jason Taylor for the Skins last year.

We all know that Singletary excelled in Buddy Ryan's "46" defense. That was modified 4-3 with 4 down linemen 3 LBs and a safety lined up like a 4th linebacker. Esentially a 4-4.

If I remember correctly the "46" referred to the jersey number of the starting safety. Plank I belive.

So Singletary may have some leanings to a base 4-3.

With that said Spikes is not a 4-3 LB. So I am not sure. Something to watch in training camp and preseason....

Can someone update me on Evans? I have seen his stats and I am not at all impressed. Personally, I think we currently have better players than him.

To better understand the signing of Evans, you have to consider three things:

~configuration of most offenses
~how 3-4 defenses align to these configurations
~our current 3-4 DE talent (what they can do, and what they can't)

~Most offenses are set up with a quicker (and usually lighter) tackle on the left side, for the obvious purpose of being able to handle quicker pass rushers off the edge (and the blind side of most QBs). Being lighter, they don't always get the best push in the run game, so teams tend to run a little more to the right-side of their offense, where (typically) a more stout/stronger tackle sits.

~Since 3-4 defenses are short 1 person on the d-line, and most teams tend to run to the right-side of their offense the left defensive end in a 3-4 has to be a true anchor...someone who is stout enough to take on double-teams not get pushed around by the bigger right tackles (which is why you see guys like Richard Seymour, Chris Canty, Igor Olshansky, etc. on the left side of their defense).

~Balmer is the likely starter at LDE this year (with Smith and McDonald the likely rotation at RDE), and he definitely has the size (6'5", 315) and strength to be an anchor LDE in a 3-4. However, at this stage of his career, he hasn't shown the ability to provide much of a pass rush (neither did Soap last year, who essentially has the same skills as Balmer).

That's where Evans (6'4", 280ish) comes into play.

Balmer and Evans will play in a rotation, with KB on 1st/2nd downs, and Evans coming in on passing downs to provide a pass rush (much like the Patriots have used used Jarvis Green, who is essentially the same size as Evans). Now, we don't need a Julius Peppers-type of pass rush out of the 3-4 LDE (that's the OLB's role)...just someone strong enough to not get manhandled by the RT, yet who has enough moves to keep that RT occupied and the offense at lest respect what's happening on the front side.

That also explains why we didn't go after Olshansky (who is essentially a duplication of Balmer).

[ Edited by GhostofFredDean on Mar 6, 2009 at 09:51:42 ]

Originally posted by 49erjoe:
sign a [de] thats never played in a 3-4 when you could have signed canty who has played in it his whole career.

We never had a shot with Canty,so your position on the subject is of no consequence.

It looks like Sing is building a 1-gap aggressive rush 3-4 defense instead of a 2-gap pocket collapsing 3-4 defense.

With Smith & Evans rushing from different places on the field every down, there should be more opportunities to disrupt plays in the backfield by penetrating the LOS through mis-matches instead of brute force.

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean:
To better understand the signing of Evans, you have to consider three things:

~configuration of most offenses
~how 3-4 defenses align to these configurations
~our current 3-4 DE talent (what they can do, and what they can't)

~Most offenses are set up with a quicker (and usually lighter) tackle on the left side, for the obvious purpose of being able to handle quicker pass rushers off the edge (and the blind side of most QBs). Being lighter, they don't always get the best push in the run game, so teams tend to run a little more to the right-side of their offense, where (typically) a more stout/stronger tackle sits.

~Since 3-4 defenses are short 1 person on the d-line, and most teams tend to run to the right-side of their offense the left defensive end in a 3-4 has to be a true anchor...someone who is stout enough to take on double-teams not get pushed around by the bigger right tackles (which is why you see guys like Richard Seymour, Chris Canty, Igor Olshansky, etc. on the left side of their defense).

~Balmer is the likely starter at LDE this year (with Smith and McDonald the likely rotation at RDE), and he definitely has the size (6'5", 315) and strength to be an anchor LDE in a 3-4. However, at this stage of his career, he hasn't shown the ability to provide much of a pass rush (neither did Soap last year, who essentially has the same skills as Balmer).

That's where Evans (6'4", 280ish) comes into play.

Balmer and Evans will play in a rotation, with KB on 1st/2nd downs, and Evans coming in on passing downs to provide a pass rush (much like the Patriots have used used Jarvis Green, who is essentially the same size as Evans). Now, we don't need a Julius Peppers-type of pass rush out of the 3-4 LDE (that's the OLB's role)...just someone strong enough to not get manhandled by the RT, yet who has enough moves to keep that RT occupied and the offense at lest respect what's happening on the front side.

That also explains why we didn't go after Olshansky (who is essentially a duplication of Balmer).

Makes perfect sense only problem is Evans isn't that good. I watched him a lot he seems to work hard but that's about it. He never gets the the qb and is easily stonewalled. I don't see Evans accomplishing what this defense needs. Green is a better player.