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How can the Denver Broncos spend SO much?

  • titan
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Originally posted by ChazBoner:
it'll all crumble to s**t once manning goes down again.

This could be the "Call of the Year"....that would be crazy, funny, and sad for Peyton all at the same time.
Originally posted by SFFanSince72:
JohnnyDel comes in with the educated breakdown once again. Dude, you are my hero.

So I have a question, If Paraag Maranthe (sp?) is supposed to be our cap genius, why is it that we are a measly $10 mil under the cap without a "normally" paid franchise QB, while Denver is sitting at $27 mil under the cap with Peyton Manning, Denaryius Thomas, Julius Thomas, Wes Welker, Shaun Phillips, plus nearly their entire O-Line??? I know you talked about the front office structurinig contracts so there is much more guaranteed money at the beginning of the contract and less prorated signing bonus over the length, but why aren't we saving our future cap space this same way?

You mention the allure of producing and coming to Denver to compete for a ring. Does this mean their role players are taking below market contracts? And if that is the case, why aren't we (or other clubs) using that strategy to get guys to take below market for the sake of building a "Dream Team" to compete for a ring? Basically what it sounds like your saying with this argument is that Elway has sold the Broncos to his role players far more convincingly than any other NFL front office.

Aside: This actually gets to an issue that I've always wondered about. For most players getting to be "the best" and into the HOF is far more rewarding than getting a contract headline in the media - half of which they know they will never earn - yet taking less money for yourself despite "market value" means that you are going to be surrounded by more highly skilled players. The more highly skilled the players surrounding you the better your stats are going to look. (For example a mediocre CB is going to look great if his D-Line doesn't give the opposing QB any time) And finally the better your stats are the more that player is going to be in debate about whether he is the one of the "greats" at his position. (One could argue that Peyton Manning's record breaking season last year was a product of this principle)

Overall I agree that Denver does have some serious holes at this point in the off-season (see RB) but it also appears that Elway is circumventing the current salary cap system by convincing a large number of players to play for less than market value even after their rookie contracts.

There's a few factors, we do stack contracts at times to save cap space. When a team gives a player a signing bonus they can pro-rate the signing bonus onto different years as they see fit. Most teams average it out over the contract but sometimes use it as a way to stack the contract for a favorable cap figure. For example: Patrick Willis' big contract extension it was either his first or second year of it he had a a little over a 17 mil cap figure. Same is true for J Smith's extension and his initial signing. His 2nd year he had something like a 14 mil cap figure. Because of that, his cap figure for his remaining years is relatively low. Also, we has MUCH more money put into the defensive side of ball than Denver does. Not counting the Talib or Ware signings, we're spending over 20 mil more on the defensive side of the ball. Now, not sure on the specifics of the yearly cap figures of those two signings, but they may now be spending as much as we are the defensive side.
They just lost Decker and sexy wife to the Jets.
If this was a poker game, Denver is "ALL IN".

Countdown to salary cap hell in 2-3 years.
Originally posted by joshuatree:
Originally posted by Stevec9932:
Not sure why players wanna play with Peyton.... dude has no clutch in him....

He's played in 3 Super Bowls. He needs a Terrell Davis

For real
Its all about backloading and guaranteed money in the NFL. The only number that matters is the guaranteed money. The rest can be manipulated around the cap each year.

Plus Denver is going hard for a SB right NOW. They know this might be Manning's final year, and Brock Osweiler is nowhere near ready. The entire franchise will crash and burn as soon as Manning retires.
Got to give props to Elway though. He's going for it and I bet he'll target a new top QB when Peyton is done too. If I was a QB and Elway was calling me I'd be very interested.
Sooner or later it wil catch up to them. They might have the cap this year. But they cant keep everyone long term.
Originally posted by MikeRumph:
what about New Orleans? They just cut half their team to franchise tag Jimmy Graham, but somehow they can afford Jairus Byrd?

The 1st year cap hit is less than 1m or somewhere around there, if I remember correctly, while the meat of the guaranteed money comes later when the cap is expected to increase or something along those lines.
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by SFFanSince72:
JohnnyDel comes in with the educated breakdown once again. Dude, you are my hero.

So I have a question, If Paraag Maranthe (sp?) is supposed to be our cap genius, why is it that we are a measly $10 mil under the cap without a "normally" paid franchise QB, while Denver is sitting at $27 mil under the cap with Peyton Manning, Denaryius Thomas, Julius Thomas, Wes Welker, Shaun Phillips, plus nearly their entire O-Line??? I know you talked about the front office structurinig contracts so there is much more guaranteed money at the beginning of the contract and less prorated signing bonus over the length, but why aren't we saving our future cap space this same way?

You mention the allure of producing and coming to Denver to compete for a ring. Does this mean their role players are taking below market contracts? And if that is the case, why aren't we (or other clubs) using that strategy to get guys to take below market for the sake of building a "Dream Team" to compete for a ring? Basically what it sounds like your saying with this argument is that Elway has sold the Broncos to his role players far more convincingly than any other NFL front office.

Aside: This actually gets to an issue that I've always wondered about. For most players getting to be "the best" and into the HOF is far more rewarding than getting a contract headline in the media - half of which they know they will never earn - yet taking less money for yourself despite "market value" means that you are going to be surrounded by more highly skilled players. The more highly skilled the players surrounding you the better your stats are going to look. (For example a mediocre CB is going to look great if his D-Line doesn't give the opposing QB any time) And finally the better your stats are the more that player is going to be in debate about whether he is the one of the "greats" at his position. (One could argue that Peyton Manning's record breaking season last year was a product of this principle)

Overall I agree that Denver does have some serious holes at this point in the off-season (see RB) but it also appears that Elway is circumventing the current salary cap system by convincing a large number of players to play for less than market value even after their rookie contracts.

There's a few factors, we do stack contracts at times to save cap space. When a team gives a player a signing bonus they can pro-rate the signing bonus onto different years as they see fit. Most teams average it out over the contract but sometimes use it as a way to stack the contract for a favorable cap figure. For example: Patrick Willis' big contract extension it was either his first or second year of it he had a a little over a 17 mil cap figure. Same is true for J Smith's extension and his initial signing. His 2nd year he had something like a 14 mil cap figure. Because of that, his cap figure for his remaining years is relatively low. Also, we has MUCH more money put into the defensive side of ball than Denver does. Not counting the Talib or Ware signings, we're spending over 20 mil more on the defensive side of the ball. Now, not sure on the specifics of the yearly cap figures of those two signings, but they may now be spending as much as we are the defensive side.

The Broncos will suffer the fate of the Redskins from a few years ago. They are bringing in too many high priced ego's who will be difficult to mesh into a team and they are screwing themselves in future negotiations with their own quality players. When you pay FA's huge deals, players who have played for the team expect the same or more, because after all they have been here, while that other guy made his name somewhere else. Signing FA's to huge contracts isn't ever a good business practice in the NFL, it will ALWAYS hurt you down the road one way or another.
[ Edited by WINiner on Mar 13, 2014 at 7:01 PM ]
Originally posted by WINiner:
The Broncos will suffer the fate of the Redskins from a few years ago. They are bringing in too many high priced ego's who will be difficult to mesh into a team and they are screwing themselves in future negotiations with their own quality players. When you pay FA's huge deals, players who have played for the team expect the same or more, because after all they have been here, while that other guy made his name somewhere else. Signing FA's to huge contracts isn't ever a good business practice in the NFL, it will ALWAYS hurt you down the road one way or another.

You're seeing that in New England, Revis got $12 mil for a single season, meanwhile the Pats are going back to Wilfork asking him to take a paycut after being a consistent and dominating performer for them for a long time and Wilfork is like "go f**k yourselves."
Denver still has like $10m in cap space too.
Originally posted by theduke85:
Denver still has like $10m in cap space too.

Its really because no one over there is making any money. It will all hit the fan once some of their own homegrown talent is due for a new contract or Manning is hurt/retires.
Originally posted by joshuatree:
Originally posted by Stevec9932:
Not sure why players wanna play with Peyton.... dude has no clutch in him....

He's played in 3 Super Bowls. He needs a Terrell Davis

Does Manning like a RB to steal his limelight?
What Happens is Like what Happened to the niners when the salary cap that C Policy and E DeBartolo were running loop holes through will catch up to Denver and they will be a team lower than the Raiders for a decade.