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How many games will the Chiefs win PYMWYMI

How many games will the Chiefs win PYMWYMI

Originally posted by InHarbsWeTrust:
Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:
Oh, I don't know about ONLY difference... but it's a pretty glaring advantage that the others share. You disagree with proper development in the early years plus consistent scheme equaling quite a hefty advantage for a QB?

Development and familiarity are key advantages, but I think the main difference between those QBs and Alex is ability.

i guess i have to go with your opinion --didnt you post that you are a junkie

football wise, i mean
[ Edited by hofer36 on Aug 28, 2013 at 6:32 PM ]
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Originally posted by NineFourNiner:
Originally posted by InHarbsWeTrust:
Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:
Oh, I don't know about ONLY difference... but it's a pretty glaring advantage that the others share. You disagree with proper development in the early years plus consistent scheme equaling quite a hefty advantage for a QB?

Development and familiarity are key advantages, but I think the main difference between those QBs and Alex is ability.

Smith is not any of those guys, to be sure. Hell, he may not even be top 10. But he is better than some give him credit for.

All success that he's had - no credit to him.
All failures that he'd had - all on him.

That is what irks me.

Playing to not lose...shouldn't get credit for the win. Defense and ST won most of the games in 2011.

look at the way AS had to start out the game against the steelers..there is no way he can do that the whole game..and i'm not talking about stats..im talking about the tempo he had to use to get the ball out to the receivers.

he is a good dude..but just a stop gap player who knows his limits
not hating its just the truth..Proof you might say?

he was a UFA and only one team called after his best W/L record ever

Harbaugh didn't want AS starting after only one performance of a QB who was still green

Now here's the kicker...

AS yearly stats are no different from any year..The only thing he approved on was not taking chances which gave him a higher % but ended up with the same results

harbaugh and roman dictated the offense---they emphasized the run game, and not turning the ball over...even the sacks that many posters like to rip smith for were part of the design, roman saying they would rather take a sack than risk an interception

--and that is a formula that has consistently won in the nfl for years...smith took chances when the game situation dictated and was more successful than not----193 yds in the 3rd quarter vs the eagles, leading to a 23 point come from behind win, hitting walker for winning score vs detroit, hitting crabtree deep down the left sideline vs seahawks to set up akers game winning field goal, coming back from behind with 2 tds vs saints in last 3 minutes--if things like this are so easy why dont guys like romo, vick, palmer, freeman, newton, stafford rivers or cutler do it..

granted with kaepernick's strong arm harbaugh and roman can open things up more now, but that doesnt negate the accomplishments of smith...and there were alot of reasons why harbaugh went with the green qb over smith, including (1) he drafted kaepernick and not smith (2) the niners cap situation for 2013 made going with kaerpenick a beter use of cap dollars as opposed to paying smith 8-11 million a year....and harbaugh surely saw kaepernicks great physical skills and wanted to implement them in the offense--again more of a reflection on kaepernick than smith

and btw the f/a argument is fallacious and i suspect you know it....no body pursued smith because everyone expected he was going back to the niners, which he did! Smith didnt tour other teams like free agents looking to move on or get the best deal do, as he expected to be coming back...only when the niners flirted with manning did heevenmarket himself as a free agent and go visit the dolphins..again if the manning pursuit reflects on smith it also reflects on what harbaugh must have thought of kaepernick...niners would have had to commit for manning for 5 years as broncos did to get him, meaning that they wouldnt be turning things over to kaepernick while manning was there

does smith have limits? sure...that he achieved as much as he did with the niners with such limits is a testament to him ...btw those limits included being taken by a poor team with a coach who was clueless how to develop a young quarterback, ordinary receivers and lineman, new o-coordinators each season for his 1st 6 years....and having a shoulder injured costing him the better part of 2 seasons...yeah i suspect an injury like that can limit your ability to throw downfield, but why let such a fact get in the way of a good putdown?
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:
Originally posted by dtg_9er:
So much nonsense has been spewed by some that even mostly logical posters try and give it some credence...but it is what it is--untruth.

Most of the Smith supporters, such as the two of us, agree to all or some of

    The draft was weak when Alex Smith was drafted #1.
  • Smith was an excellent college QB who was in the running for Heisman, but was not considered to be elite by many pundits.
    Smith was unlucky enough to be drafted by a team who thought Nolan was a HC.
    Numerous OCs--new one almost every year.
    New systems yearly.
    Injury misdiagnosed--Nolan wins dumb coach of the year award.
    Upswing in Smith's career when Jimmy Raye was fired and then two years of very good QBing.
  • Injury allowed a super athlete to take over making Smith expendable (and un-affordable).
  • Smith now playing for a WCO offensive minded HC.
  • We all wonder if he will continue to improve and live up to his potential.

This is not the list of a fanatic who sees no wrong with Smith, but is an example of historical reality. Those who want to deny any and all good are doing so for some odd reason--like to tweak fellow posters, enjoy hating people, were disappointed and can't get over it...none of these reasons scream mature behavior.

Truly the best post in this entire thread. Every point made is as if you read my mind.

You deserve these.

Yeah, the live up to his potential isn't bias, right.

Let us take a look at the person who acquired him: Andy Reid. Reid is highly overrated.
It wasnt Reid whos able to make any QB work in Philly as most think. It was Westbrook who was the anchor and also carried the load of the success of that team. It will be Charles who will carry KC, not Alex.

McNab, who Reid spent a lot of time with developing was not able to do anything anywhere else.

Vick: another failure of Andy Reid.

Reid is just not a very good coach if he must rely on the QB to win.

Reid also had another bust, Kolb.

So, do you actually think Reid has a good eye for QBs? Most people can't change but if Reid acquired Alex conceding that he needs his offense based all around Charles with a sprinkle of easy passes, then I give him all the credit in the world. BUT, without Charles, KC is toast.

Adrian Peterson - MIN
Alfred Morris - WAS
Marshawn Lynch - SEA
Frank Gore - SF
Jamaal Charles - KC
CJ Spillman - BUF

What did these teams all have in common in 2012? Extremely strong run games, weak pass games, i.e, RB carrying the team...

WAS - 10-6
MIN - 10-6
SF - 11-4
SEA - 11-4

KC and BUF had horrible QB play... With even a serviceable QB, is it possible for them to have a winning record and get a playoff birth?
[ Edited by mkmasn on Aug 28, 2013 at 6:32 PM ]
Originally posted by mkmasn:
Adrian Peterson - MIN
Alfred Morris - WAS
Marshawn Lynch - SEA
Frank Gore - SF
Jamaal Charles - KC
CJ Spillman - BUF

What did these teams all have in common in 2012? Extremely strong run games, weak pass games.

WAS - 10-6
MIN - 10-6
SF - 11-4
SEA - 11-4

KC and BUF had horrible QB play... With even a serviceable QB, is it possible for them to have a winning record and get a playoff birth?

Not sure how you can lump the Kaep led 9ers in there with them... considering he was among the top 5 in attempts over 20+ yard and then lead the league in completion % for passes over 20+ yards over that time.
Originally posted by 5280High:
Not sure how you can lump the Kaep led 9ers in there with them... considering he was among the top 5 in attempts over 20+ yard and then lead the league in completion % for passes over 20+ yards over that time.

And yet he only broke 250 yards throwing in a game once...
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by HomerJ:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by NineFourNiner:
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Originally posted by NineFourNiner:
Originally posted by InHarbsWeTrust:
Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:
Oh, I don't know about ONLY difference... but it's a pretty glaring advantage that the others share. You disagree with proper development in the early years plus consistent scheme equaling quite a hefty advantage for a QB?

Development and familiarity are key advantages, but I think the main difference between those QBs and Alex is ability.

Smith is not any of those guys, to be sure. Hell, he may not even be top 10. But he is better than some give him credit for.

All success that he's had - no credit to him.
All failures that he'd had - all on him.

That is what irks me.

Playing to not lose...shouldn't get credit for the win. Defense and ST won most of the games in 2011.

look at the way AS had to start out the game against the steelers..there is no way he can do that the whole game..and i'm not talking about stats..im talking about the tempo he had to use to get the ball out to the receivers.

he is a good dude..but just a stop gap player who knows his limits
not hating its just the truth..Proof you might say?

he was a UFA and only one team called after his best W/L record ever

Harbaugh didn't want AS starting after only one performance of a QB who was still green

Now here's the kicker...

AS yearly stats are no different from any year..The only thing he approved on was not taking chances which gave him a higher % but ended up with the same results

You just proved my point. It DOES NOT MATTER what he does - your opinion is not. ever. going. to. change. You will find a way to discredit and explain away any modicum of success - The Saints, 18-19, winning seasons, come back victories, future success (should it come) in KC... all of it. ZERO. CREDIT. EVER.

It is NOT the truth, but it is YOUR truth... and that's why (a) there is no point debating with you and (b) you should be voluntarily staying out of this thread. The guy's a BUM, right? WHY WASTE YOUR TIME? WHY?

I like his last comment because that is not of opinion or eye test, it's a stat.

But you spend so much time discrediting STATS when they aren't in line with your agenda.

My agenda? You mean the general agreement across the league of Alex Smith, including our own coach? We ripped the Chiefs off.

pray tell how are you privvy to the general agreement across of the league of Alex Smith--did you have tapas with bill belichick last nite....this claim about what the "general agreement across the league" is has as much objectivity as your eye test---as far as i know the decision makers and shakers of the nfl dont publish their general agreements
Originally posted by Joecool:
Yeah, the live up to his potential isn't bias, right.

Let us take a look at the person who acquired him: Andy Reid. Reid is highly overrated.
It wasnt Reid whos able to make any QB work in Philly as most think. It was Westbrook who was the anchor and also carried the load of the success of that team. It will be Charles who will carry KC, not Alex.

McNab, who Reid spent a lot of time with developing was not able to do anything anywhere else.

Vick: another failure of Andy Reid.

Reid is just not a very good coach if he must rely on the QB to win. (don't get this at all)

Reid also had another bust, Kolb.

So, do you actually think Reid has a good eye for QBs? Most people can't change but if Reid acquired Alex conceding that he needs his offense based all around Charles with a sprinkle of easy passes, then I give him all the credit in the world. BUT, without Charles, KC is toast.

This is an odd and...contrived response. Reach his potential implies the potential his college success indicated. The opposite view--he has reached his potential and will never improve or play to the level of the past two years is assuming the negative. I am assuming nothing by saying I don't know if he will reach his potential, which is an open question--not an assumption of fact.

Andy Reid is a WCO guy...that's what I stated. You say he is over rated. Which of these statements is being assumptive? Which shows bias?

Reid did not succeed with McNabb or Vick? Your opinion once again...his record:

140-102-1 Career Record (583...better than Tom Coughlin, Jimmy Johnson, Marv Levy and makes him the 39th most successful coach in the NFL History.
8 Seasons with 10 or more wins).

But I'm not here saying he is a Bill Walsh, just that he has succeeded in the past and I don't assume he won't in the future. You are the one making assumptions.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:
Originally posted by dtg_9er:
So much nonsense has been spewed by some that even mostly logical posters try and give it some credence...but it is what it is--untruth.

Most of the Smith supporters, such as the two of us, agree to all or some of

    The draft was weak when Alex Smith was drafted #1.
  • Smith was an excellent college QB who was in the running for Heisman, but was not considered to be elite by many pundits.
    Smith was unlucky enough to be drafted by a team who thought Nolan was a HC.
    Numerous OCs--new one almost every year.
    New systems yearly.
    Injury misdiagnosed--Nolan wins dumb coach of the year award.
    Upswing in Smith's career when Jimmy Raye was fired and then two years of very good QBing.
  • Injury allowed a super athlete to take over making Smith expendable (and un-affordable).
  • Smith now playing for a WCO offensive minded HC.
  • We all wonder if he will continue to improve and live up to his potential.

This is not the list of a fanatic who sees no wrong with Smith, but is an example of historical reality. Those who want to deny any and all good are doing so for some odd reason--like to tweak fellow posters, enjoy hating people, were disappointed and can't get over it...none of these reasons scream mature behavior.

Truly the best post in this entire thread. Every point made is as if you read my mind.

You deserve these.

Yeah, the live up to his potential isn't bias, right.

Let us take a look at the person who acquired him: Andy Reid. Reid is highly overrated.
It wasnt Reid whos able to make any QB work in Philly as most think. It was Westbrook who was the anchor and also carried the load of the success of that team. It will be Charles who will carry KC, not Alex.

McNab, who Reid spent a lot of time with developing was not able to do anything anywhere else.

Vick: another failure of Andy Reid.

Reid is just not a very good coach if he must rely on the QB to win.

Reid also had another bust, Kolb.

So, do you actually think Reid has a good eye for QBs? Most people can't change but if Reid acquired Alex conceding that he needs his offense based all around Charles with a sprinkle of easy passes, then I give him all the credit in the world. BUT, without Charles, KC is toast.
mcnabb was pretty old and beat up whenhe left philly, arguably vick was a failure before he got to philly and kolb had like 4 starts with philly (2 of hich were for over 300yds i beleive) before he was traded
Originally posted by English:
Good God, people. This thread is an extended moan of utter futility. Smith doesn't play for us any more. Whatever your feelings about his ability, get over it. This thread is about the Chiefs win/loss record. If you still have issues about Smith one way or another after all these posts, try therapy.

Lol. Wishful thinking.....
I can't believe we're still talking potential regarding a 9 year vet. Alex Smith looked exactly the same in pre-season as he did when he played with the Niners. Every year people expect this brand new Alex and every year its the same old Alex, even if he does get a little better. I'm not saying that's bad, but his playing style will remain his playing style. Its as ingrained in him as his personality.
Originally posted by mkmasn:
Originally posted by 5280High:
Not sure how you can lump the Kaep led 9ers in there with them... considering he was among the top 5 in attempts over 20+ yard and then lead the league in completion % for passes over 20+ yards over that time.

And yet he only broke 250 yards throwing in a game once...

A loss as I recall.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:
Originally posted by dtg_9er:
So much nonsense has been spewed by some that even mostly logical posters try and give it some credence...but it is what it is--untruth.

Most of the Smith supporters, such as the two of us, agree to all or some of

    The draft was weak when Alex Smith was drafted #1.
  • Smith was an excellent college QB who was in the running for Heisman, but was not considered to be elite by many pundits.
    Smith was unlucky enough to be drafted by a team who thought Nolan was a HC.
    Numerous OCs--new one almost every year.
    New systems yearly.
    Injury misdiagnosed--Nolan wins dumb coach of the year award.
    Upswing in Smith's career when Jimmy Raye was fired and then two years of very good QBing.
  • Injury allowed a super athlete to take over making Smith expendable (and un-affordable).
  • Smith now playing for a WCO offensive minded HC.
  • We all wonder if he will continue to improve and live up to his potential.

This is not the list of a fanatic who sees no wrong with Smith, but is an example of historical reality. Those who want to deny any and all good are doing so for some odd reason--like to tweak fellow posters, enjoy hating people, were disappointed and can't get over it...none of these reasons scream mature behavior.

Truly the best post in this entire thread. Every point made is as if you read my mind.

You deserve these.

Yeah, the live up to his potential isn't bias, right.

Let us take a look at the person who acquired him: Andy Reid. Reid is highly overrated.
It wasnt Reid whos able to make any QB work in Philly as most think. It was Westbrook who was the anchor and also carried the load of the success of that team. It will be Charles who will carry KC, not Alex.

McNab, who Reid spent a lot of time with developing was not able to do anything anywhere else.

Vick: another failure of Andy Reid.

Reid is just not a very good coach if he must rely on the QB to win.

Reid also had another bust, Kolb.

So, do you actually think Reid has a good eye for QBs? Most people can't change but if Reid acquired Alex conceding that he needs his offense based all around Charles with a sprinkle of easy passes, then I give him all the credit in the world. BUT, without Charles, KC is toast.

I can see Joecool's response for any success that Smith might have with the Chiefs -- ".. but it's Charles!"
[ Edited by 9erfanAUS on Aug 28, 2013 at 10:13 PM ]
Originally posted by hofer36:
mcnabb was pretty old and beat up whenhe left philly, arguably vick was a failure before he got to philly and kolb had like 4 starts with philly (2 of hich were for over 300yds i beleive) before he was traded

Hold on a second. Vick was a failure yet he went to multiple playoffs?? So what does that make Alex?
Originally posted by 9erfanAUS:
I can see Joecool's response for any success that Smith might have with the Chiefs -- ".. but it's Charles!"

That was the first thing I got out of it.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by hofer36:
mcnabb was pretty old and beat up whenhe left philly, arguably vick was a failure before he got to philly and kolb had like 4 starts with philly (2 of hich were for over 300yds i beleive) before he was traded

Hold on a second. Vick was a failure yet he went to multiple playoffs?? So what does that make Alex?

Vick's win % in said play off games?

With that said, I don't agree that Vick was a failure going to Phili.
[ Edited by Jakemall on Aug 28, 2013 at 10:26 PM ]