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Donte Whitner aka Hitner

Originally posted by Cooper22:
Originally posted by D_Niner:
Oh... I thought pro bowls where there to recognize the best players at a given position for the year.

So, why again did these cheeper options not make the pro bowl?

First of all, you need to get off Whitner's nuts.. Second of all, pro bowlers are voted by the fans who have seen him on highlights.. Thirdly, he was surrounded by the best defense in the league.. When he wasn't (Smith was hurt), it was pretty clear he was the weak link

Off his nuts? I didn't know common sense ment you were on someones nuts.

Look, a replacement safety that's played at a pro bowl level will cost us at least 4 mil; but, the new guy won't have the same knowledge/familiarity with this D. In short, it will hurt the team.
Originally posted by AZ9erfan520:
Originally posted by Cooper22:
You kind of contradicted yourself.. You said we don't need cheaper, but then you go on to all these other needs that we have to fill.. We're really pushing the cap this year and we need to save money wherever we can (hence letting Goldson walk and Manningham taking a pay cut).. We need some way to pay for all these needs and still ending up below the cap.. I'm not really understanding your logic there.. Releasing Whitner would save the money needed to address all the needs that you listed (as well as the need for an upgrade at SS IMO)

My point was we have holes in quite a few areas, and if one is filled (dline rotation) it directly benefits our secondary. You yourself alluded to the decline of the dline having a negative effect on the db's. All im saying, and most here would agree, if you fix the d-line you fix the secondary problem. If Baalke determines we are strapped for cash and wants to restructure some deals and make some cuts to give us extra space so be it, but cutting Whitner right now is a bad idea. As it is we have no idea whats going on at FS. Are we sticking with Dahl? Is Culliver moving over? If so who is his replacement at CB? How does that effect Rogers? Are we drafting a FS? Is Woodson's walker in good enough condition for him to play effectively at FS? Are we going to draft a CB and move him to FS? For me that is to many questions to have to put another vacancy at the SS position. Is Whitner an all world SS? No he isn't, im not debating that. What im saying is for this season he will due. Especially if we fix the problem with the dline. Actually, if we don't fix the dline problem our defense is going to regress quite a bit. That alone is why we will not get rid of Whitner this year but instead worry about dlinemen.

We don't need to upgrade SS. All season analysts talked about how the niners had one of the best safety tandems in the league. Now suddenly, two tough playoff games and Whitner is not good...
So he's not the best in coverage, but he ain't some scrub..

The entire secondary needs to play better than they did for much of the season. Of course losing Justin for the final 1/3 hurt but even before then, teams were able to find open areas of the field. There were just too many mental and physical breakdowns last season. Whitner was just a part of that. That is why so many mocks include a DB as one of the first three picks.
Originally posted by KowboyKiller:
So he's not the best in coverage, but he ain't some scrub..


I will say, that may have been the turning point in the game (very early too). Served notice to the NO team.

I am a SF native, but live in St Louis. Watched the game at a bar with friends. In the audience were a bunch of rowdy, huge, trash talking NO fans (mostly women, who were burly). Anyway, Whitner laid the wood to Thomas...shut that crowd down. It was awesome. Pure silence, classic.
Originally posted by dj43:
The entire secondary needs to play better than they did for much of the season. Of course losing Justin for the final 1/3 hurt but even before then, teams were able to find open areas of the field. There were just too many mental and physical breakdowns last season. Whitner was just a part of that. That is why so many mocks include a DB as one of the first three picks.

Very much agree. Better pass rush combined with a DB and FS picks will do the trick.
Originally posted by Cooper22:
Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Whitner must be the new Delanie Walker of this board suddenly.

The dude cleans up after Bowman missed tackles. And sometimes goes against 6'4-6'6 tighends and to no one's surprise lost in those match-ups in the end zone. This usually happens around draft time when someone wants to push their own draft picks for a replacement.

I'm not sure if your post was serious or not. I've watched every game atleast once and have yet to see bowman miss a single tackle.. I've seen plenty of Whitners missed tackles, but none of bowmans.. As for covering tight ends, he pretty much got burned by every player he was responsible for.. So I don't really know what you were trying to say here.. Also, when Willis was asked to cover those bigger tight ends, he did just fine..

You aren't watching the games closely enough if you've never seen Bowman miss a tackle. He misses tackles. Ask anyone.
Originally posted by Cooper22:
Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Whitner must be the new Delanie Walker of this board suddenly.

The dude cleans up after Bowman missed tackles. And sometimes goes against 6'4-6'6 tighends and to no one's surprise lost in those match-ups in the end zone. This usually happens around draft time when someone wants to push their own draft picks for a replacement.

I'm not sure if your post was serious or not. I've watched every game atleast once and have yet to see bowman miss a single tackle.. I've seen plenty of Whitners missed tackles, but none of bowmans.. As for covering tight ends, he pretty much got burned by every player he was responsible for.. So I don't really know what you were trying to say here.. Also, when Willis was asked to cover those bigger tight ends, he did just fine..

You need to watch them again. Bowman sometimes misses tackles. Not often, but few. Whitner sometime is there to clean up. That's what his position required him to do when he sees it. Just going off the top, Whitner blewup Pierre Thomas because Bowman missed him initially. What I'm trying to say is that Whitner is playing a SS position that offense like to take advantage of because he has responsibility in both the run and pass defense. It's the nature of his position that he will lose and win some in each and every plays, especially in the end zone, where he has very little time to read and react on run or pass. If you think he's easily replaced with a better result, you may be mistaken. The position required more than just physical ability. It's also experience and instinct.
Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Originally posted by Cooper22:
Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Whitner must be the new Delanie Walker of this board suddenly.

The dude cleans up after Bowman missed tackles. And sometimes goes against 6'4-6'6 tighends and to no one's surprise lost in those match-ups in the end zone. This usually happens around draft time when someone wants to push their own draft picks for a replacement.

I'm not sure if your post was serious or not. I've watched every game atleast once and have yet to see bowman miss a single tackle.. I've seen plenty of Whitners missed tackles, but none of bowmans.. As for covering tight ends, he pretty much got burned by every player he was responsible for.. So I don't really know what you were trying to say here.. Also, when Willis was asked to cover those bigger tight ends, he did just fine..

You need to watch them again. Bowman sometimes misses tackles. Not often, but few. Whitner sometime is there to clean up. That's what his position required him to do when he sees it. Just going off the top, Whitner blewup Pierre Thomas because Bowman missed him initially. What I'm trying to say is that Whitner is playing a SS position that offense like to take advantage of because he has responsibility in both the run and pass defense. It's the nature of his position that he will lose and win some in each and every plays, especially in the end zone, where he has very little time to read and react on run or pass. If you think he's easily replaced with a better result, you may be mistaken. The position required more than just physical ability. It's also experience and instinct.

Agree. I will also add that, just as the niners do, TEs and WRs block Willis and Bowman and Whitner is the guy who makes the play. Our team is built on team tackling.
Originally posted by qnnhan7:
You need to watch them again. Bowman sometimes misses tackles. Not often, but few. Whitner sometime is there to clean up. That's what his position required him to do when he sees it. Just going off the top, Whitner blewup Pierre Thomas because Bowman missed him initially. What I'm trying to say is that Whitner is playing a SS position that offense like to take advantage of because he has responsibility in both the run and pass defense. It's the nature of his position that he will lose and win some in each and every plays, especially in the end zone, where he has very little time to read and react on run or pass. If you think he's easily replaced with a better result, you may be mistaken. The position required more than just physical ability. It's also experience and instinct.

I'm just saying I've seen whitner miss a lot more tackles than bowman
Whitner is the new scapegoat... and now that we have Dahl or a rookie... the last thing I wanna do is mess around with another safety.

f**k that
Whitner is in the last year of his deal. Overall, he's been a good player for us despite his deficiencies in coverage. It would be wise to draft a potential replacement, maybe 3rd or 4th round, just in case the team decides to go in another direction after the season.
Originally posted by SofaKing:
Whitner is in the last year of his deal. Overall, he's been a good player for us despite his deficiencies in coverage. It would be wise to draft a potential replacement, maybe 3rd or 4th round, just in case the team decides to go in another direction after the season.

I like us to start developing one behind Whitner. If we can develop one from a 3rd or 4th rounder into a Probowler like we did with Goldson all the better.
Originally posted by Cooper22:
Originally posted by qnnhan7:
You need to watch them again. Bowman sometimes misses tackles. Not often, but few. Whitner sometime is there to clean up. That's what his position required him to do when he sees it. Just going off the top, Whitner blewup Pierre Thomas because Bowman missed him initially. What I'm trying to say is that Whitner is playing a SS position that offense like to take advantage of because he has responsibility in both the run and pass defense. It's the nature of his position that he will lose and win some in each and every plays, especially in the end zone, where he has very little time to read and react on run or pass. If you think he's easily replaced with a better result, you may be mistaken. The position required more than just physical ability. It's also experience and instinct.

I'm just saying I've seen whitner miss a lot more tackles than bowman

lol
Originally posted by SofaKing:
Whitner is in the last year of his deal. Overall, he's been a good player for us despite his deficiencies in coverage. It would be wise to draft a potential replacement, maybe 3rd or 4th round, just in case the team decides to go in another direction after the season.

Agreed. Giving up 14 TD's is horrendous by any standard but having a DC continue to match up your 5'10" SS on guys such as Boldin and Pitta is even worse...to do it all season is inexcusable. This is the bigger issue. We should not have to "hide" Whitner's poor coverage ability esp. in the RZ/EZ. It flat out cost us the Superbowl. That said, I'd love if we could keep him AND let him compete with a high draft pick SS with more upside to learn from. And to those who seem to think the front 7 can help disguise our weaknesses, you are dead wrong. They will continue to attack Whitner every game now...now that we have been exposed there as many teams have that mismatch at their exposure (taller TE's and bigger WR's they can move inside on him). It works in reverse...if you have better cover S's, Brooks/Aldon get those coverage sacks as well or TFL instead of just QB pressures that still end up going to huge plays and TD's.

I've been very curious to see how the FO was going to fix our secondary (the DL shouldn't be too hard - high draft pick at NT or DE to train under Justin).

At the end of the day, if we have Brown - FS (?) - Whitner - Rogers back there again, we're in big trouble! Teams won't even bother to run it...
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