Biggest need in 1st Round???

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Kolohe:
How in the heck can anyone say WR now??

Did you people see what's starting at CB as of right now, DL isn't any better??

With D Line, O Line, CB and especially what just happened to our ILB positions this offseason WR is just rediculous. But it doesn't surprise me it's still high up the list. People like glamor positions.

WR is currently running 2nd. ILB is last. I think that tells you a lot about WZ fans right there. We lost Willis, Borland and Bowman is coming back from an injury and we don't know if he will ever be the same. So we are down 2 and maybe all 3 of our talented ILB's but according to the WZ we don't need one and we need a WR much more even after signing Torrey Smith. One of the best deep threats in the game.......

The "rediculous" watched last season. Willis and Bowman didn't play last year, nor did Brock, Dorsey, Williams, etc. Offense lost its mainstay in Gore. Defense played well despite last year's injuries. Offense played crap with Gore.

People will disagree, I still say DL. I think having a dominant front seven in the NFL is your meal ticket if you can't get by playing chuck and duck and have a Top 5 QB. Being able to shut down team's running games to force them into 2nd and long, 3rd and long consistently and having a top notch pass rush is to me the biggest factor when it comes to winning games.


With the losses at ILB, I think the need for more dominant performances on the DL is even greater, a dominant DL, a unit better able to hold up, more quality pass rushers at OLB.....etc.


I think the need at WR is greatly over-exaggerated. You're a running team that rarely uses more than 3 WR sets. You have Boldin and Torrey Smith, you have Patton and Ellington waiting in the wings, you have Simpson who may or may not work out but he's had success in the NFL previously. You can find a guy in the middle rounds to develop and to compete with Patton and Ellington to take over for Boldin at WR next year.


You have VD, McDonald and Carrier at TE as well, all guys who will need snaps.

For me, it's DL...whether Justin Smith retires or not. My rationale: with the loss of Ray Mac and potentially JS, that's a lot of years of experience out the door. Signing Dockett will definitely help ease the transition to younger players, but now's the time to take one of the studs...maybe even two. In the 1st rd, I'm thinking Malcolm Brown and Eddie Goldman could be available. I don't see Baalke trading up to get Shelton...and I'll be very surprised to see him make it past Da Bears (you know Fangio would jump on him to anchor his 3-4). Goldman gives you a stout NT, but he's played DE at FSU, as well. Brown's the more athletic of the two, but could play NT or DE. Either guy would be a fine pick. Another possibility is the big NT from OKla, Jordan Phillips. He's strictly a NT, but he could free up others in the DE rotation. Any of these 3 players could become cornerstones on our DL...and for that reason, I hope Baalke grabs one of 'em in the 1st rd.

Originally posted by CorvaNinerFan:
I don't see Baalke trading up to get Shelton...and I'll be very surprised to see him make it past Da Bears (you know Fangio would jump on him to anchor his 3-4).

Once again, people keep saying this but we have Fangio on record that he prefers smaller NT's. I'm not sure that the Bears jump on Shelton, particularly considering their needs at safety and a few other spots. If anything I would expect the Bears to take a pass rusher.


That said, I don't see Shelton making it to the 49ers spot but if he did, to me that's the pick, no doubt about it. Get a monster NT in the middle to take up blockers, take some pressure off the DE's, get the defense into more 3rd and long situations.

Originally posted by English:
You are missing a point regarding ILBs. I think most people accept it as a need. They just don't see it as a need which must be addressed in the first round.

When we take a DL or (less likely) a 3-4 OLB in the 1st I expect a wave of disappointment across the zone.

This. There is no ILB worth taking at 15, none. If the 49ers traded down to like pick 28 or 29 and took a guy like Kendricks, I would not be upset but if they stand pat, ILB ain't happening.

We've needed a true NT for a couple of years now.

Originally posted by mayo49:
We've needed a true NT for a couple of years now.

I agree. Ian Williams and Dorsey have done a tremendous job, but I don't see either of them as long term solutions. Williams is coming off a second severe injury and Dorsey is coming back after missing a whole season. Both have expiring contracts. If they could land a guy like Shelton, a centerpiece for the front seven, even if he is "only a 2 down guy", I'd be psyched.

I'd have no problem if Baalke was able to get Shelton...but I think he'll be long gone. WRT Fangio taking him or not, another consideration for Shelton is his outstanding mobility for a guy his size. I think that could sway Fangio to lobby hard for him. Let's face it, there's not much that scares anyone on the Bears' front, so Shelton could be the anchor for better things to come. If Baalke really wants a big NT, then Phillips could be the guy, but he'd probably pick him if he traded down from #15.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by mayo49:

We've needed a true NT for a couple of years now.

I agree. Ian Williams and Dorsey have done a tremendous job, but I don't see either of them as long term solutions. Williams is coming off a second severe injury and Dorsey is coming back after missing a whole season. Both have expiring contracts. If they could land a guy like Shelton, a centerpiece for the front seven, even if he is "only a 2 down guy", I'd be psyched.

I was watching some more highlights of Shelton today and man I'd love to see him in a Niner uniform they could alway throw Dorsey into a DE spot. And we do know Mangini likes big boys on the line. I highly doubt he makes it to us but we will have a ton of comp picks next year and baalke could get wild with some trades in this draft....could you imagine Shelton, dockett, smith (maybe), lynch, and smith coming at ya

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Yeah it's all good to debate on this ....I think tackle is set for at least 3 years, so I don't see the point in looking for someone to take over that spot. Thomas can play guard or tackle as well same with Boone.

I would rather see what we have with Thomas before drafting someone to take a spot that we have been hearing he is the front runner for. Let's let our rookies from last year do something before looking to the next class and guard while important isn't worth a top 15 pick, it's just not. There will be a ton of good OT beyond the 1st.

Ty Sambrailo
Jake Fisher
D.J. Humphries
Tyrus Thompson
Daryl Williams
Cedric Ogbuehi etc.....will all be around in the 2nd and beyond and are very good tackles.

you talk about Kap's 52 sacks, which is awful, but health and play-calling played a huge factor. Throw in that yes we lost our best run-blocking linemen, but we also lost our worst pass blocking lineman too Thomas might be more balanced than Iupati and that's a good thing.

I will say this much to our back and forth debate...

I won't be disappointed if Baalke goes something different than Oline in the 1st. I'm fine with BPA. But I will be disappointed if we don't look to it in rounds 1-3?

I'm sure there are other guys that we can draft in the later rounds. My fear is if we wait, I don't want Looney type guys. Even J Mart was a first or 2nd round talent and he sucks as well. Some are just hit and miss and some latter round guys can prosper. I would rather not keep gambling.

Yes there were tons of injuries and playcalling sucked. I expect that to change. But i do think all those injuries showed us the Oline is a mess.

Dline is a good area to address but those guys I feel like they take time and don't make an immediate impact.

You keep saying at 15 you want an immediate impact or starter but I don't know what position we would get that at.

Baalke drafts these injured guys at good value but we wait a long time to see what we get in them. We keep doing that and before long, Staley's contract will be up or Torrey's or Boldin gone or Davis, etc... Baalke needs to pull the trigger sometimes to try and win it all. I think the team is good but if we can't protect Kap (Oline) or rush the Passer (Dline/OLB), I just don't see us winning games.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
People will disagree, I still say DL. I think having a dominant front seven in the NFL is your meal ticket if you can't get by playing chuck and duck and have a Top 5 QB. Being able to shut down team's running games to force them into 2nd and long, 3rd and long consistently and having a top notch pass rush is to me the biggest factor when it comes to winning games.


With the losses at ILB, I think the need for more dominant performances on the DL is even greater, a dominant DL, a unit better able to hold up, more quality pass rushers at OLB.....etc.


I think the need at WR is greatly over-exaggerated. You're a running team that rarely uses more than 3 WR sets. You have Boldin and Torrey Smith, you have Patton and Ellington waiting in the wings, you have Simpson who may or may not work out but he's had success in the NFL previously. You can find a guy in the middle rounds to develop and to compete with Patton and Ellington to take over for Boldin at WR next year.


You have VD, McDonald and Carrier at TE as well, all guys who will need snaps.

I go back and forth between DL and CB. Baalke has proven that he can find CB talent later, but they usually sign bargain vets too. I'd LOVE to see Shelton pile drive Lynch into the turf, but I can see value in either CB or Dline.

How would Goldman look as a NT?

Originally posted by Butter:
I go back and forth between DL and CB. Baalke has proven that he can find CB talent later, but they usually sign bargain vets too. I'd LOVE to see Shelton pile drive Lynch into the turf, but I can see value in either CB or Dline.

How would Goldman look as a NT?

Goldman is a better fit at NT in the 3-4 than at DE. I just don't see Baalke trading up for a NT in the 1st Rd. He puts more value in the DE and OLB positions than NT.
Goldman is not value at #15, believe Baalke looks to Rd 2/3 for DL - Edwards, Anderson, Hardison.

Originally posted by jacklegniner:

Originally posted by NYniner85:
Yeah it's all good to debate on this ....I think tackle is set for at least 3 years, so I don't see the point in looking for someone to take over that spot. Thomas can play guard or tackle as well same with Boone.

I would rather see what we have with Thomas before drafting someone to take a spot that we have been hearing he is the front runner for. Let's let our rookies from last year do something before looking to the next class and guard while important isn't worth a top 15 pick, it's just not. There will be a ton of good OT beyond the 1st.

Ty Sambrailo
Jake Fisher
D.J. Humphries
Tyrus Thompson
Daryl Williams
Cedric Ogbuehi etc.....will all be around in the 2nd and beyond and are very good tackles.

you talk about Kap's 52 sacks, which is awful, but health and play-calling played a huge factor. Throw in that yes we lost our best run-blocking linemen, but we also lost our worst pass blocking lineman too Thomas might be more balanced than Iupati and that's a good thing.

I will say this much to our back and forth debate...

I won't be disappointed if Baalke goes something different than Oline in the 1st. I'm fine with BPA. But I will be disappointed if we don't look to it in rounds 1-3?

I'm sure there are other guys that we can draft in the later rounds. My fear is if we wait, I don't want Looney type guys. Even J Mart was a first or 2nd round talent and he sucks as well. Some are just hit and miss and some latter round guys can prosper. I would rather not keep gambling.

Yes there were tons of injuries and playcalling sucked. I expect that to change. But i do think all those injuries showed us the Oline is a mess.

Dline is a good area to address but those guys I feel like they take time and don't make an immediate impact.

You keep saying at 15 you want an immediate impact or starter but I don't know what position we would get that at.

Baalke drafts these injured guys at good value but we wait a long time to see what we get in them. We keep doing that and before long, Staley's contract will be up or Torrey's or Boldin gone or Davis, etc... Baalke needs to pull the trigger sometimes to try and win it all. I think the team is good but if we can't protect Kap (Oline) or rush the Passer (Dline/OLB), I just don't see us winning games.

I'm all for getting o-line depth and I think anyone's line would be a mess if they had as many injuries as SF did last year....talent can be found all over the draft example: Boone was a UDFA and like you said Martin was a 2nd round pick and blows lol, so their are risks all over the draft.

Right baalke drafts good injured players, so why not let Thomas play next year instead of finding someone to take "his"spot after only being on the team for 1 year? Time to see what some of these value picks can do in starting roles (Thomas,Tank, and possibly Millard)

The issue last year, IMO was injured o-line and the fact the Roman/Harbs didn't change the game plan based on these injuries. They still ran 3 WR sets instead of 2 TE sets to help block, there was zero read-options and play actions that could have helped Kap move around, instead they tried to keep him in the pocket and pick apart secondaries when the pocket collapsed in 2 sec.

I'm fine with they going in the 3rd or 4th with OL because we already have starters in place for the line next year...DL is very important in our 3-4 and having a good rotation is needed.

As far as BPA at 15 I could see the following there...

Parker-He would fight for reps from day one and be at the very least #3 WR and more than likely #1 the following year (if we don't resign Boldin). We lost SJ, Crabs, and Lloyd and while I love the Smith pickup, Parker would be great for kap and his 80 inch wingspan and would be a monster in the red-zone. I see Alson Jeffery with this kid.

Trae Waynes-Best Cb in the draft and might not be there, but he would start from day one, I love his style He is tough and has the length/speed we like.

Bud Dupree- Stud pass rusher and has a motor on him, never have enough pass rush and we are one injury away from being awful at this position. Not sure what we will be doing with Brooks.

If those guys are gone that means OT falls to us then I wouldn't hate the pick but would prefer a trade down....I really hope we don't go after Arik Armstead at 15.

Originally posted by tohara3:
Best player available whether offense or defense for me

Ding Ding Ding. Too many if's come into play on saying biggest need. If the number one CB is available at 15, I think it is a lock the niners will take him.

If the best CB is off the board, and 15 is too high for ILB, then one has to look at DE, OT and WR. Which players will make more of an impact for the next 5 years. One has to also look at the strenth of the draft class. Davante Parker is the #3 WR but he is still a true #1,

For the OL folks, it has been articulate on how Brandon Thomas our 3rd round pick from last year did just fine against Clowney. If he is healthy he will be awesome. That is an IF, but I would rather think positive and go CB, DL or WR over OL and ILB for round 1.

Originally posted by NYniner85:
I'm all for getting o-line depth and I think anyone's line would be a mess if they had as many injuries as SF did last year....talent can be found all over the draft example: Boone was a UDFA and like you said Martin was a 2nd round pick and blows lol, so their are risks all over the draft.

Right baalke drafts good injured players, so why not let Thomas play next year instead of finding someone to take "his"spot after only being on the team for 1 year? Time to see what some of these value picks can do in starting roles (Thomas,Tank, and possibly Millard)

The issue last year, IMO was injured o-line and the fact the Roman/Harbs didn't change the game plan based on these injuries. They still ran 3 WR sets instead of 2 TE sets to help block, there was zero read-options and play actions that could have helped Kap move around, instead they tried to keep him in the pocket and pick apart secondaries when the pocket collapsed in 2 sec.

I'm fine with they going in the 3rd or 4th with OL because we already have starters in place for the line next year...DL is very important in our 3-4 and having a good rotation is needed.

As far as BPA at 15 I could see the following there...

Parker-He would fight for reps from day one and be at the very least #3 WR and more than likely #1 the following year (if we don't resign Boldin). We lost SJ, Crabs, and Lloyd and while I love the Smith pickup, Parker would be great for kap and his 80 inch wingspan and would be a monster in the red-zone. I see Alson Jeffery with this kid.

Trae Waynes-Best Cb in the draft and might not be there, but he would start from day one, I love his style He is tough and has the length/speed we like.

Bud Dupree- Stud pass rusher and has a motor on him, never have enough pass rush and we are one injury away from being awful at this position. Not sure what we will be doing with Brooks.

If those guys are gone that means OT falls to us then I wouldn't hate the pick but would prefer a trade down....I really hope we don't go after Arik Armstead at 15.

Alright we are moving forward at least. I'm ok to find out what we have in the injured guys. Tank, thomas, etc... I just caution and worried that if we don't address the line and we start to have some injuries, it could be a mess again. But with the defense, they had all the injuries and showed they can still produce.

Teams like dallas had a terrible D but they could still make noise because they have a beastly Oline. That's all I want. Return the Oline to being dominate and I think the Niners will be relevant again.

With the 15th pick, I don't like Parker. I'm normally screaming for wr, but Baalke has passed this over for awhile now and since he finally added Boldin and Torrey(FA's), I just don't see it. But since I don't see it, that sounds like typical Baalke.

Waynes would love. Don't know if he is shutdown corner but thought if we could find a stud, it might give us more options on D like Seattle does or New England did with Revis. Either way, I like waynes. Immediate impact and a cheap Corner for at least 4 years?

I will have to look at Dupree more. If we go away from OL I would like an OLB. My view on defense is that a good 3/4 is about the LB's, especially the OLB's. The DLine and MLB's are important as well but if the LB's are athletic and can blitz, than anyone of them can rush the QB and bring pressure. It becomes difficult for the QB and Oline to read before snap. Fangio used the 34 but i did feel like it was predictable. Always rushed with 3 and the pressure came from Aldon.

Drew Bree's on the 3/4: "You really have at least five rushers on the field at all times instead of four, with the ability to bring a lot of pressures where you've got all these hybrid guys on the field that, "Hey are they gonna rush the passer? You don't really want your running back blocking them. Are they dropping in coverage?" So they can be more multiple, I'd say, which can be more problematic for an offense."

I think an Oline wants nothing more than a defense to rush 4 Dline linemen. So they know exactly where the pressure is coming from and so they know their assignment.

Anyways, I would love an OLB, just have to decide which guy I like. and I don't like Armstead Either. Not impressed with what I see.