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With EVERY position addressed, should 49ers move up in 2015 for top WR/CB?

Originally posted by jreff22:
Premature to ask.

And thinking we know who the top prospects will be in a year from now never works out.

This. And IMO we may not need either. At WR, I'm not in the camp that Crabtree is def gone, I actually think we get him and Kaep extended. We have Crabs, Boldin, Johnson, Patton, Ellington. Even if Crabs does leave, that doesn't mean we will need a top flight WR. At CB, I'm in Baalke's corner meaning that he obviously has more confidence in our current group than most of the fan base. Brock IMO proved to be a very solid starting CB, Culliver was awesome in 2012 and could really be a top flight guy this year and I like Ward as the slot guy. Wright could absolutely end up going back to his previous form he had in Detroit and with the rookies we got, if even one (other than Ward) pan out, that's a great group right there.
Originally posted by NickSh49:
Brooks is one year older than Patrick Willis

He's no spring chicken either, and both have played a TON OF snaps.

All I know is that Skuta and Lemonier showed a relentless motor when rushing the passer last year. Brooks at times stopped pursuit.
Should we move up ? We didn't even have to move up this year and we still waited until the 4th round and the year before also the 4th. Am I saying Bruce Ellington is crap ? Not at all. Am I saying I would have preferred picking a higher-rated WR in the 2nd ? Absolutely yes. I am not even saying we must draft so and so. Knowing what Baalke is like, I had already lowered my expectations whereby I would have been happy as long as he picked just one, anyone in the 2nd amongst Adams, Matthews, Richardson, Latimer, etc. But, heck no said Baalke.

Put it this way, even if we think we should at the end of the 2014 season, let's just say I wouldn't put my life savings on it that it would happen.
Baalke will surely continue to work in the long term.

So it will be BPA.
Originally posted by Garlicboy:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Okoye is a nice story but won't make this roster. If Tank comes back 100%, he will sit behind Smith. Obviously we will need another body to replace RayMac and/or be the primary swing backup but we can't really control the draft. If we can't trade up, the targets could be gone before we pick.

Either way our needs will change in 10 months. If Kap takes a step back one could argue that QB might be the biggest priority in 2015. No way to know yet.

The biggest need going into this draft was WR and CB...did we half ass address it or are we just running in circles?

We addressed WR with Stevie Johnson, but Michael Crabtree is a free agent next year and Anquan Boldin the year after.

CB: We have 3 free agents in 2015: Chris Culliver, Eric Wright and Perrish Cox.

We addressed the positions, but we have more free agents at WR and CB coming up in 2015.

If Cully can unscrew his head out of his ass we should resign him...but cheaply. I think his level of stupidity is tied with Aldon but both have a year to prove they aren't retarded. Cully won't command big money. He hasn't played enough and has more negative headlines than interceptions. At best he's a full time starter. At worst he's the primary backup at CB and an emergency FS if everybody gets diarrhea. If he comes in under 3 mill per year on a 4-5 yr deal it's golden for us. Having 3 starting CB's for the price of Sherman is a smart financial plan.

Cox and Wright won't be here very long.

Johnson is good but not #1 take over a game good. Especially with the occasional suspect hands he's known for. Quinton and Bruce should be complementary WR's that we keep for years. All Johnson will get from us is this contract (with a probable small extention). So we could have Crabs gone, then Boldin, then Johnson. I agree we need a viable long term answer at the position but that guy may not come for a while. If we do dump Crabs after the year I would hope we go WR early to find the next guy. But again who knows what the needs could be or who is available.

If we win the Super Bowl, Boldin could retire and Crabs could still walk. That leaves a big void and only 3 actual WR's under contract. And if we assume the normal WR maturation of 3 years...still leaves Patton 1 year from "getting it" and Bruce 2 years away.

The point in this rant is that we have many potential variables. You can look at who we drafted and see possible replacements but nothing is a given. Thinking the kid drafted in the 7th will replace a starter is wishful thinking. Likewise the kid we drafted in the 1st may never get off the bench. Had 2012 been a solid draft many of these picks probably don't happen. Same thing happened shortly after 2008 and 2009. If you don't destroy a draft you won't ever been in a draft pinch and forced to take a position of dire need. With AJ busting we got f**ked. We burned a high pick, lost a roster spot, had no speed threat, and had to go trade for one this year. Positions where we do these little 1-2 year deals and draft poorly is normally where we struggle. Outside of Boone how many non 1st round OL have stuck around recently? The only one is Kilgore and we have no idea how he will be. But the point is bad drafting and poo FA contracts means we needed a guy like Snyder who is trash. If any of the top guys from this year bomb, look for those positions to be a "need" again.
That's kind of what I wanted to do this year. But they went and filled a lot of needs. That said I would do anything it takes to get a top flight WR or top CB in 2015. Or both. We classically trade back and back and back. Plus we like those 3rd round compensatories we always get for losing FA's. I think we do need 1 year where we deal up and get ELITE talent at certain positions of need. I hope we trade up and fix some of those issues next year.

All of those things said I would have to say we need to wait to see what happens this year. Because things always change. Some hole gets filled better than you think by some player who surprises you. Then you always have a drop off or injury at some position. So there will a new hole some place we don't expect either. Until 2014 gets late in the season or the end you can't say what things you will need.
At this time it looks like CB and WR will be on the wish list for the 2015 draft. Things can change. If we lose Aldon we should go for the best pass rusher, period. We have no idea if injuries will change our needs before the draft. We have no idea if players we are counting on turn out to be dissapointments. Only time will tell.
  • Giedi
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Originally posted by buck:
The biggest question marks will emerge after we have played some football.

Yep. Everybody looks good now on paper, but the game is played on sunday. Seattle's past drafts looked average to terrible (but with some PED's ) they really turned out great. As great as our drafts look today, injuries and off field problems can derail some of it. I don't think we have to wait until the end of the playoffs to begin speculating on next year. But I do think we can speculate after some number of actual games have been played.
My question is why are we only saying we might need a top flight WR in 2015 ? If my memory serves me right, have we not been talking about getting a bonafide deep threat vertical wideout for at least 2 years now ? The need had long been identified back at the end of the 2011 season. As such, Baalke went out to sign Randy Moss who as it turned out had long run out of gas in his tank. Then, he also drafted AJ Jenkins in the 2012 draft which as we all know has turned out to be a complete bust. This deep threat need further escalated as Kap became our starting QB half way through the 2012 season as he took over from Alex Smith given his immense arm strength. So, what did Baalke do ? In the 2013 draft, Baalke drafted Quinton Patton in the 4th round, was he supposed to be that deep threat answer then ? Or is it supposed to be Brandon Lloyd who is already 32 which I doubt ? Or could it be Stevie Johnson who is more known as a slot receiver ? Or perhaps Bruce Ellington who is also more known as a slot wideout ? Not saying he can't play deep, are we going to line him up on the outside and is he supposed to be that deep threat answer ? I might be wrong, but I doubt Baalke had "deep threat" in mind when he signed Stevie Johnson and drafted Bruce Ellington. One thing for sure, neither Anquan nor Crab is that guy as they are both possession WRs.

In short, what I am saying is Baalke has never addressed that need properly or with success for more than 2 years now. So, do we need a top flight deep threat WR ? Absolutely, not may be in 2015, but this is an unfulfilled need which has been ongoing for years.
[ Edited by Rascal on May 12, 2014 at 7:39 AM ]
Like I said to all who predicted we will package and move up to get a WR, this year. Won't happen. AJ Jenkins now and for a awhile will impact the way we pick WRs. No first round picks! 3rd and 4th rounders.
Originally posted by OldJoe:
Like I said to all who predicted we will package and move up to get a WR, this year. Won't happen. AJ Jenkins now and for a awhile will impact the way we pick WRs. No first round picks! 3rd and 4th rounders.

Not even 2nd rounders ? That is why I was surprised cos this year's WRs were so deep, we could have just sat tight and waited for our turns in the 2nd without trading up.

But, say if your "AJ Jenkins theory" is indeed true, what you are essentially saying is Baalke is finally admitting he can't select WRs ? I mean I could agree with that, but surely Baalke would want to prove the whole world wrong, you don't think ?
[ Edited by Rascal on May 12, 2014 at 7:41 AM ]
  • buck
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I have stated many times that I felt that we should draft at least two receivers in this draft.

The 49ers did not do what I wanted them to do in the draft. But, as far as I know doing what I want does not seem to be a realistic standard for evaluating this draft.

The 49ers did pick up three wide receivers in the off season. Baalke et al signed Brandon Lloyd, traded for Stevie Johnson, and drafted Bruce Ellington.

Waiting to see what these three additions do in real games played on the field in the upcoming season obviously makes no sense, does it?

I think that waiting makes sense, but that is just my opinion.
[ Edited by buck on May 12, 2014 at 8:43 AM ]
  • buck
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double
[ Edited by buck on May 12, 2014 at 8:41 AM ]
  • buck
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Originally posted by Giedi:
Yep. Everybody looks good now on paper, but the game is played on sunday.

Or conversely, everybody looks bad on paper, especially our wide receivers and cornerbacks, and it makes no difference what happens on the field in games that are played.
I'm okay for making big jumps (e.g. trading up to #18 for Reid -- we got good value on that trade), but not for huge ones (e.g. Atlanta jumping up to #6 or whatever to get Julio Jones). So, should we trade up .. ? Probably not.