Ghost mocking V 1.0 - pre-combine

Nickelback is not a 3 down player.

Originally posted by kronik:
Nickelback is not a 3 down player.

Aldon (a top-ten pick) wasn't a three-down player either his rookie year. He played his role as our pass rush specialist and eventually worked his way into the starting DE/OLB role. I view Joyner as an eventual starter at safety, with the ability to play nickel from day one. And again, with all the nickel packages these days, that role is essentially a starting role.

Originally posted by kronik:
Nickelback is not a 3 down player.

And? In this defense the nickel corner plays like a starter basically, it is a position that shouldn't be ignored.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by kronik:
Nickelback is not a 3 down player.

And? In this defense the nickel corner plays like a starter basically, it is a position that shouldn't be ignored.

Plus, in many games and in certain scenarios, the nickel corner is absolutely on the field all 3 downs.

Well soon enough we will see what Baalke thinks of Joyner. If Baalke picks him I will be happy, if not I will be happy with the pick he chooses, unless it is Balmer.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
And? In this defense the nickel corner plays like a starter basically, it is a position that shouldn't be ignored.

I believe the first round is meant for 3 down players. I know the importance of nickel cornerbacks. But those can be drafted outside of the first round.

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Aldon (a top-ten pick) wasn't a three-down player either his rookie year. He played his role as our pass rush specialist and eventually worked his way into the starting DE/OLB role. I view Joyner as an eventual starter at safety, with the ability to play nickel from day one. And again, with all the nickel packages these days, that role is essentially a starting role.

Aldon was drafted with the plan of him being a 3 down player. During his rookie year, we had depth at the position so he was allowed time to develop. Aldon was always viewed as a 3 down player. As for Joyner, I think his size is such a huge disadvantage. He may be the best player pound for pound or inch for inch. But does that really matter when you are in a one on one situation in the red zone against Jimmy Graham or Gronk? Heck even Whitner who is larger gets manhandled by Graham and Gonzales.

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Plus, in many games and in certain scenarios, the nickel corner is absolutely on the field all 3 downs.

You are correct there. Sometimes, the game plan calls for playing nickel the entire game. Good point there.

Originally posted by kronik:
I believe the first round is meant for 3 down players. I know the importance of nickel cornerbacks. But those can be drafted outside of the first round.

You clearly don't. In this defense, in key moments, the nickel CB will clearly be out there on the field and is basically a starter. If you can get a guy who can lock down that position, especially after seeing some of the issues that Rogers had in the slot, not to mention someone that can potentially take over at strong safety, I fail to see the downside. This team is plenty talented, its exactly that additional talent at nickelback and other spots that defines the difference between a championship team and a wannabe.


Considering the talent on this roster, I don't see more than 1 or 2 other positions where a potential draft pick could make as big of an immediate impact as a playmaking slot corner.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
You clearly don't. In this defense, in key moments, the nickel CB will clearly be out there on the field and is basically a starter. If you can get a guy who can lock down that position, especially after seeing some of the issues that Rogers had in the slot, not to mention someone that can potentially take over at strong safety, I fail to see the downside. This team is plenty talented, its exactly that additional talent at nickelback and other spots that defines the difference between a championship team and a wannabe.

Tell me how many nickel cornerbacks have been drafted in the first round in the past 10 - 20 years. I like Joyner as a slot, but not as a NFL safety. These days, every team has been drafting the monster 6-6 tight ends that can run. I can't imagine Joyner defending those monsters. In college, it can work most of the time, but in the pro's? I'm not so sure.

Originally posted by kronik:
Tell me how many nickel cornerbacks have been drafted in the first round in the past 10 - 20 years. I like Joyner as a slot, but not as a NFL safety. These days, every team has been drafting the monster 6-6 tight ends that can run.

Joyner is a special player in every way. He's an instant impact guy, much like how Reid was. You can slide him in a slot corner, a safety, a special teams performer...etc..etc, just an all around talented pure football player.

As far as safeties go, make sure that you send a memo to Seattle, that little 5'10" midget they have at safety clearly can't get it done, he's just too short.

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Plus, in many games and in certain scenarios, the nickel corner is absolutely on the field all 3 downs.

This.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Joyner is a special player in every way. He's an instant impact guy, much like how Reid was. You can slide him in a slot corner, a safety, a special teams performer...etc..etc, just an all around talented pure football player.

As far as safeties go, make sure that you send a memo to Seattle, that little 5'10" midget they have at safety clearly can't get it done, he's just too short.

Joyner is 5-8 maybe.

Originally posted by kronik:
Joyner is 5-8 maybe.

Yes, 2 inches changes everything, especially for a guy who's as outstandingly athletic as Joyner is. Mathieu looked crap-tastic at 5'9" as well.


The reality is if your only reason for disliking Joyner is his height, then you have no good reason at all. Talent is talent, if you can get a guy who is that versatile, instinctive, with an incredible nose for the football and and a true love for the game, what more do you want?

Originally posted by kronik:
Joyner is 5-8 maybe.

Yes, but 195 lbs with a arm length / wing span of someone who is 6´1