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2014 Draft a NT

  • Garcia
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 27,661
No
Originally posted by Memphis9er:
Originally posted by solidg2000:
If you want a true might as well draft this guy

Daniel McCullers - DT Tennessee - 6'6 352

this guy was a bright spot on an otherwise poor defense, he's worth a look.

Wow bright spot really him lol I dont watch much college football but I did watch some playz from a few tenn gamez N this guy was invisible not thankz .....
Originally posted by matt49er:
The 49ers play a true NT less than 50% of the snaps and already have Dorsey (who had a great year) and Ian Williams (who was starting over Dorsey b4 he got hurt) plus we have Q.Dial. Zero need for a NT.
This.

Guys, we simply don't line up TRUE NTs.
I do not think this is necessary. We have Williams back from Injury. We have Dorsey and Dial for depth... and our NT's dont play a lot in our Defense. They are usually replaced for our NB.
would rather pick up a legit cornerback
The only role the big space eater will have is when we play the physical backs like Eddie Lacy or Marshawn Lynch. Outside of that, they aren't on the field enough and we already have 3 guys that will be exclusively playing NT (I doubt Dial will get many snaps at DE next season).
The Niners had a top 5 rush defense last year. But how much will Bowman ' s absence impact that next year? And this is all based on Ian Williams recovering from his injury.

Also, I never said they should use a top pick Ellis and Allen project as late 3rd to 4th round picks at best.

With 12 picks, I'm pretty surprised there is this level of resistance to shooting for a 2nd or 3rd string NT.
Originally posted by Butter:
The Niners had a top 5 rush defense last year. But how much will Bowman ' s absence impact that next year? And this is all based on Ian Williams recovering from his injury.

Also, I never said they should use a top pick Ellis and Allen project as late 3rd to 4th round picks at best.

With 12 picks, I'm pretty surprised there is this level of resistance to shooting for a 2nd or 3rd string NT.

It's not resistance, it's just a difference in opinion. Seems pretty straightforward to most of those who disagree with you...we had an incredible run defense last year and that's with really only Dorsey being healthy. Williams (who's signed through 2015) will be nearly a year removed from his injury and Dial will have a full camp under his belt. It's not a perfect situation, but few positions are. For most positions, you generally hope to have 1 really good starter (check), one veteran for depth (check) and a youngster with potential (check). Throw in Purcell and maybe a late-round pick and we're looking pretty good there both short term and long.

Add to this, the fact that our NT plays roughly half of the defensive snaps=not on the field that much comparatively speaking.

BTW, if Bowman misses any time, I doubt it will be long. If they do struggle without him though, I doubt a rookie 2nd/3rd string NT picked in the 3rd or 4th rounds will be able to make up that difference. That seems pretty unrealistic.
  • buck
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 10,158
Can we stop this talk about getting a real, a true, or abona fide nose tackle?

Jeff Ratliff played nose tackle in a 3-4 defense for Dallas from 2009 to 2012.
He playing weight was closer to 300 pounds than it was to 320 pounds.

He was named All Pro in 2009. He made Pro Bowl as a nose tackle in 2009, 2010, and 2011.

If I remember correctly, he was a 1-gap nose tackle.

I am pretty sure that Dorsey and Williams are predominately 1-gappers.

And they are true, real, and bona fide nose tackles.

Today’s NFL has seen a rise in more aggressive, one-gap 3-4 defenses and you will see players now that line up as a 0-technique, but instead of playing both A-gaps, they will shoot one, relying on a linebacker behind them to plug the side they don’t attack. These players rely on speed and agility rather than size and bulk, and don’t really fit the prototype we are looking for.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/05/28/defensive-prototypes-defensive-line/
[ Edited by buck on Feb 13, 2014 at 8:18 AM ]
I think Williams and Dial can hold the fort. I think Dorsey goes back into the DE rotation.
Originally posted by lamontb:
I think Williams and Dial can hold the fort. I think Dorsey goes back into the DE rotation.

Wow, really? Dorsey did a great job for us as a starter; what would be the point of moving him to DE? Seems to me the ideal scenario is to start Dorsey, have Williams give him a breather now and again and have Dial be the backup guy along the line (DE/DT/NT).

McDonald - Dorsey - JSmith
TJE - Williams - Tank
Dial
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by lamontb:
I think Williams and Dial can hold the fort. I think Dorsey goes back into the DE rotation.

Wow, really? Dorsey did a great job for us as a starter; what would be the point of moving him to DE? Seems to me the ideal scenario is to start Dorsey, have Williams give him a breather now and again and have Dial be the backup guy along the line (DE/DT/NT).

McDonald - Dorsey - JSmith
TJE - Williams - Tank
Dial
Just thinking in terms of the fact that Dorsey struggled on the interior his whole career except last year. I just think he's a better DE than DT. Williams might be the better DT and why he was the starter. I wouldn't have any issue starting Dorsey though.
Originally posted by lamontb:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by lamontb:
I think Williams and Dial can hold the fort. I think Dorsey goes back into the DE rotation.

Wow, really? Dorsey did a great job for us as a starter; what would be the point of moving him to DE? Seems to me the ideal scenario is to start Dorsey, have Williams give him a breather now and again and have Dial be the backup guy along the line (DE/DT/NT).

McDonald - Dorsey - JSmith
TJE - Williams - Tank
Dial
Just thinking in terms of the fact that Dorsey struggled on the interior his whole career except last year. I just think he's a better DE than DT. Williams might be the better DT and why he was the starter. I wouldn't have any issue starting Dorsey though.

I think if Dorsey was a better DE, he would've still been in Kansas City. He did well at NT and I think will be the starter next season.
Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
Originally posted by lamontb:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by lamontb:
I think Williams and Dial can hold the fort. I think Dorsey goes back into the DE rotation.

Wow, really? Dorsey did a great job for us as a starter; what would be the point of moving him to DE? Seems to me the ideal scenario is to start Dorsey, have Williams give him a breather now and again and have Dial be the backup guy along the line (DE/DT/NT).

McDonald - Dorsey - JSmith
TJE - Williams - Tank
Dial
Just thinking in terms of the fact that Dorsey struggled on the interior his whole career except last year. I just think he's a better DE than DT. Williams might be the better DT and why he was the starter. I wouldn't have any issue starting Dorsey though.

I think if Dorsey was a better DE, he would've still been in Kansas City. He did well at NT and I think will be the starter next season.

KC moved him to DE b/c he was terrible on the interior. They tried him there when they ran 4-3 and 3-4. Then they moved him to DE where he played much much better. Before the move to DE dude was considered a bust. He probably still is considered a bust to most KC fans. Dude was a monster coming out of LSU and labeled the next Warren Sapp. Change of scenery, harder work ethic, and better coaching could have changed that. Thus why he played well for them this year. But I don't think he did an outstanding job to the point that Williams shoulnd't be inserted back to his job if 10o%. He was solid. .
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Another question is, do we really want that traditional 3-4 NT-type of guy? As fans, we keep wishing for that 330+ pound, 2-gap type of guy, but that's not necessarily the type of NT that this staff seems to look for. They seem perfectly happy with 300 pounders with strength and movement skills.
Ghost,
Your opinion as usual is well considered. But consider this. The Niners have two kinds of opponents, Seattle and the rest of the NFL. Stopping the Seahawks is a fundamental issue now. That means first stopping Lynch. We may not need a top flight NT through most of the season, but against Seattle, we do.