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Theoretically: The Domino Trades

Originally posted by Garlicboy:
Just posted something regarding the theft of 49ers practice squad players and the sound reasoning in drafting injured ACL players. The only answer I see is the NFI list. Using the late round draft picks to draft injured players you can stash on the NFI list.

Just a refresher, The Chiefs stole Marcus Cooper off the practice squad, the Dolphins stole Michael Thomas off the practiced squad, and even the Jags stole UDFA rookie TE Marquies Gray off the practice squad.



My latest mock: I have QB Logan Thomas being converted to a TE. I have 8 healthy picks with 2 possible practice squad candidates in Thomas and Gallon/Archer.

#2a S LaMarcus Joyner (T. down 2015 3rd), trade 1st for 2nd & 2015
#2b CB Pierre Desir
#2c WR Martavis Bryant
#3a C Weston Richburg
#3b WR Donte Moncreif
#3c ILB Yawin Smallwood
#5 Inj. QB Aaron Murray (Trade down for 2015 7th), 4th for a 5th & 2015 7th
#6 Inj. CB Aaron Colvin (Trade down for 2015 7th ), 5th for a 6th & 2014 7th
#7a TE Logan Thomas (Trade down for 2014 7th), 6th for a 7th & 2015 7th
#7b WR Geremy Gallon or Dri Archer
#7c Inj. OG Spencer Long#7d Inj. FB Trey Millard
#7e Inj. S Nickoe Whitley (7th round pick obtained in trade down)

2013 Redshirts/Injured: NT: Ian Williams, DT: Dominique Dial, DE: Tank Carridine, DE: Lawrence Okoye, OT: Marquardt, RB: Marcus Lattimore

*No D lineman, OT, or RB needed in 2014 draft due to redshirt/Injured players returning in 2014

UDRFA/ Undrafted Rookie Free Agents: QB: Connor ShawQB: Denarius McGheeDT: Chris Whaley (INJURED)

Interesting take. I'm not sure I would go that way with the picks, but I wouldn't hate that draft necessarily.
Originally posted by GorefullBore:
Interesting take. I'm not sure I would go that way with the picks, but I wouldn't hate that draft necessarily.

Thanks. Obviously the top players/picks are in the eye of the behholder. I just want BPA at S/CB/WR/C with our top 6 picks.

However, I am hell bent on drafting injured players late because:

1.) This draft is DEEP!!! A record 98 underclassmen went out for this draft. So perfect time to draft and stash.
2.) NFI/PUP list is the ONLY way to SAFELY stash players on our roster. People can easily pluck players off our Practice squad at any time.
3.) Ironically at our positions of future need due to 2015 free agency, there are quality injured ACL players:

ACL injured players and 2015 Free Agents:

FB: Trey Millard is the best FB in the draft 2015 Free agent: Bruce Miller
OG: Spencer Long was an All-American 2015 Free agents: Iupati, Snyder & Kilgore
QB: Aaron Murray 4 year starter *need a back-up
CB: Aaron Colvin, was a 2nd rounder 2015 Free agent Chris Culliver
DT: Chris Whaley, former RB 2015 Free agent Glenn Dorsey
S: Nickoe Whitley, top safety No young back-up safety's on roster or practice squad
Originally posted by Garlicboy:
Originally posted by MC9BEAT:
We could trade the late picks for 2015 draft choices 1 round earlier. Turn our 7th rounders into four 6th rounders next year. I could see 8 players from this draft making the team depending upon how many free agents we lose.

The only issue I have with this plan is that the 2014 draft is STRONG. Future drafts are going to be weaker. Why? A record high 98 underclassmen came out for this draft. Which is why, I would draft as many ACL injured players as possible, because it is the only 100% guaranteed way to stash a player on your roster. We can stash players on our practice squad as evidenced by Marcus Cooper. He didn't clear waivers and had a great rookie season with the Chiefs. Players can even get plucked off of our practice squad like S. Michael Thomas and become AFC player of the week.

I'm getting sick of picking players late in the draft only to have them get plucked off of our practice squad.

Draft healthy players with our first 6 or 7 picks and draft injured redshirts with our last 5 or 6 picks.
If Someone special we think is a great player and they are available in round 6 or 7 because of injury and normally it would have taken a 1st or 2nd rounder to get them or possibly a 3rd then I could see us taking them as a redshirt like we did with Carradine and Dial. Problem is we don't have many open projected spots opening up for 2015. This years free agents we are mostly ready to lose and create roster opennings. Next years we are going to resign or extend. Crabtree and Kap to name a few.

If someone special we truly believe will add to our team next year is available in rounds 6-7 because of an injury go with it. Otherwise I would rather get a 6th rounder in 2015 rather than draft someone who can't make the team not because they don't show promise but because we lack roster spots. We are already a very deep team everywhere except CB and WR. Then next year we can look to trade them for 2016 5th rounders or use them to move up in that draft.

Isn't great having soo many picks in such a deep draft? 7 picks in the 1st 4 rounds. If we draft well this could set us up for years to come.
Originally posted by Garlicboy:
Originally posted by MC9BEAT:
We could trade the late picks for 2015 draft choices 1 round earlier. Turn our 7th rounders into four 6th rounders next year. I could see 8 players from this draft making the team depending upon how many free agents we lose.

The only issue I have with this plan is that the 2014 draft is STRONG. Future drafts are going to be weaker. Why? A record high 98 underclassmen came out for this draft. Which is why, I would draft as many ACL injured players as possible, because it is the only 100% guaranteed way to stash a player on your roster. We can stash players on our practice squad as evidenced by Marcus Cooper. He didn't clear waivers and had a great rookie season with the Chiefs. Players can even get plucked off of our practice squad like S. Michael Thomas and become AFC player of the week.

I'm getting sick of picking players late in the draft only to have them get plucked off of our practice squad.

Draft healthy players with our first 6 or 7 picks and draft injured redshirts with our last 5 or 6 picks.
If Someone special we think is a great player and they are available in round 6 or 7 because of injury and normally it would have taken a 1st or 2nd rounder to get them or possibly a 3rd then I could see us taking them as a redshirt like we did with Carradine and Dial. Problem is we don't have many open projected spots opening up for 2015. This years free agents we are mostly ready to lose and create roster opennings. Next years we are going to resign or extend. Crabtree and Kap to name a few.

If someone special we truly believe will add to our team next year is available in rounds 6-7 because of an injury go with it. Otherwise I would rather get a 6th rounder in 2015 rather than draft someone who can't make the team not because they don't show promise but because we lack roster spots. We are already a very deep team everywhere except CB and WR. Then next year we can look to trade them for 2016 5th rounders or use them to move up in that draft.

Isn't great having soo many picks in such a deep draft? 7 picks in the 1st 4 rounds. If we draft well this could set us up for years to come.
Gotta have the dance partners and considering that the 7's don't get traded till the 3rd, maybe 4th round at the earliest that really limits all this trading up. Yes, they have value but it doesn't mean you will get the value.
Originally posted by Garlicboy:
Originally posted by MC9BEAT:
We could trade the late picks for 2015 draft choices 1 round earlier. Turn our 7th rounders into four 6th rounders next year. I could see 8 players from this draft making the team depending upon how many free agents we lose.

The only issue I have with this plan is that the 2014 draft is STRONG. Future drafts are going to be weaker. Why? A record high 98 underclassmen came out for this draft. Which is why, I would draft as many ACL injured players as possible, because it is the only 100% guaranteed way to stash a player on your roster. We can stash players on our practice squad as evidenced by Marcus Cooper. He didn't clear waivers and had a great rookie season with the Chiefs. Players can even get plucked off of our practice squad like S. Michael Thomas and become AFC player of the week.

I'm getting sick of picking players late in the draft only to have them get plucked off of our practice squad.

Draft healthy players with our first 6 or 7 picks and draft injured redshirts with our last 5 or 6 picks.
Watching us waste our three 7th rounders this past year is why I an leery of drafting four 7th rounders this year. If we see a player we can stash on the pup list that we believe has a future with the team it would make sense. Otherwise I would just as soon get a 6th rounder in 2015 for each of those picks. Who knows, maybe next year we could trade them for four 5th rounders in 2016. Then four 4th rounders in 2017 and so on.
Originally posted by MC9BEAT:
Watching us waste our three 7th rounders this past year is why I an leery of drafting four 7th rounders this year. If we see a player we can stash on the pup list that we believe has a future with the team it would make sense. Otherwise I would just as soon get a 6th rounder in 2015 for each of those picks. Who knows, maybe next year we could trade them for four 5th rounders in 2016. Then four 4th rounders in 2017 and so on.

I would do this, but you have to find a trading partner. How many teams are going to trade a 6th next year for a late 7th, when there is a good chance they can pick and sign that player as an undrafted rookie free agent.
Originally posted by Garlicboy:
Originally posted by MC9BEAT:
Watching us waste our three 7th rounders this past year is why I an leery of drafting four 7th rounders this year. If we see a player we can stash on the pup list that we believe has a future with the team it would make sense. Otherwise I would just as soon get a 6th rounder in 2015 for each of those picks. Who knows, maybe next year we could trade them for four 5th rounders in 2016. Then four 4th rounders in 2017 and so on.

I would do this, but you have to find a trading partner. How many teams are going to trade a 6th next year for a late 7th, when there is a good chance they can pick and sign that player as an undrafted rookie free agent.
Unfortunately not enough but sometimes they see a player still available and want him and they know if they don't draft him they have to compete with 31 other teams trying to get him to sign an undrafted free agent contract so you never know. Once the draft ends the phones go nuts with teams scrambling to get undrafted players still left.
Originally posted by MC9BEAT:
Unfortunately not enough but sometimes they see a player still available and want him and they know if they don't draft him they have to compete with 31 other teams trying to get him to sign an undrafted free agent contract so you never know. Once the draft ends the phones go nuts with teams scrambling to get undrafted players still left.

I'm all for trading a 7th for a 6th next year, but our 7th rounders are as follows nearly last: 3rd, 5th and 7th.

I guess it all comes down to the team and need. Not all 31 teams will be competing for the same free agents and I would think sorry teams like the Raiders would have the best shot at landing an Undrafted Free Agent. Actually I think Undrafted Free Agents will go to the team that:

1.) Has a roster spot available, so the have a good chance to make the team
2.) Pay the best sign on bonus as an Undrafted rookie Free Agent.
Originally posted by MC9BEAT:
Watching us waste our three 7th rounders this past year is why I an leery of drafting four 7th rounders this year. If we see a player we can stash on the pup list that we believe has a future with the team it would make sense. Otherwise I would just as soon get a 6th rounder in 2015 for each of those picks. Who knows, maybe next year we could trade them for four 5th rounders in 2016. Then four 4th rounders in 2017 and so on.

I also consider the draft very STRONG!!!

Why? Record 98, repeat 98 underclassmen declared, that is over 3 rounds with of draft picks.

This tells me that a 7th rounder may actually have more value than a 6th next year. Which is why I'm all for the draft and stash method of this past year. It worked last year, why not do it again this year.
Originally posted by Garlicboy:
Originally posted by MC9BEAT:
Watching us waste our three 7th rounders this past year is why I an leery of drafting four 7th rounders this year. If we see a player we can stash on the pup list that we believe has a future with the team it would make sense. Otherwise I would just as soon get a 6th rounder in 2015 for each of those picks. Who knows, maybe next year we could trade them for four 5th rounders in 2016. Then four 4th rounders in 2017 and so on.

I also consider the draft very STRONG!!!

Why? Record 98, repeat 98 underclassmen declared, that is over 3 rounds with of draft picks.

This tells me that a 7th rounder may actually have more value than a 6th next year. Which is why I'm all for the draft and stash method of this past year. It worked last year, why not do it again this year.
There is merit to the idea. If a player we think will be an upgrade to what we have or fill a need after the 2015 FA's are declared it would be worth it. We have our starting guards and looney is an experienced 4th rounder but if a guard who would have projected to round 2 or possibly 3 is there it would be worth it. If he was a 4th or 5th rounder prior to the injury probably not. The really special players probably won't last till the 7th round like Lattimore and Dial and Carradine didn't. But if a special player does I would take him with our 7th round picks and maybe even our 5th and 6th rounders as well.

If that kind of talent was available you are absolutely right. If it is not available I would rather trade the picks than draft them unless we have a very good idea the player will make the team. We wasted our three 7th rounders this past year. They all performed as well as we could have hoped. If a draft pick plays as well as you could reasonably hope for he should make the team. Otherwise you should not have drafted him in the 1st place.

Lets hope some special players drop to the 7th and we are sitting there in a position to scoop them up.
Originally posted by MC9BEAT:
There is merit to the idea. If a player we think will be an upgrade to what we have or fill a need after the 2015 FA's are declared it would be worth it. We have our starting guards and looney is an experienced 4th rounder but if a guard who would have projected to round 2 or possibly 3 is there it would be worth it. If he was a 4th or 5th rounder prior to the injury probably not. The really special players probably won't last till the 7th round like Lattimore and Dial and Carradine didn't. But if a special player does I would take him with our 7th round picks and maybe even our 5th and 6th rounders as well.

If that kind of talent was available you are absolutely right. If it is not available I would rather trade the picks than draft them unless we have a very good idea the player will make the team. We wasted our three 7th rounders this past year. They all performed as well as we could have hoped. If a draft pick plays as well as you could reasonably hope for he should make the team. Otherwise you should not have drafted him in the 1st place.

Lets hope some special players drop to the 7th and we are sitting there in a position to scoop them up.

That is why I am in favor of drafting injured players with our 5th, 6th and 3 -7th rounders so that we can put them on the PUP/NFI list.
1st, 2-2nds, 3-3rds and 4th draft healthy bodies or trade one for a future 2015 draft pick.
Originally posted by Garlicboy:
Originally posted by MC9BEAT:
Unfortunately not enough but sometimes they see a player still available and want him and they know if they don't draft him they have to compete with 31 other teams trying to get him to sign an undrafted free agent contract so you never know. Once the draft ends the phones go nuts with teams scrambling to get undrafted players still left.

I'm all for trading a 7th for a 6th next year, but our 7th rounders are as follows nearly last: 3rd, 5th and 7th.

I guess it all comes down to the team and need. Not all 31 teams will be competing for the same free agents and I would think sorry teams like the Raiders would have the best shot at landing an Undrafted Free Agent. Actually I think Undrafted Free Agents will go to the team that:

1.) Has a roster spot available, so the have a good chance to make the team
2.) Pay the best sign on bonus as an Undrafted rookie Free Agent.
you pretty much nailed it there, or in some cases just whoever called. They won't all get a call.
Originally posted by Garlicboy:
Originally posted by MC9BEAT:
There is merit to the idea. If a player we think will be an upgrade to what we have or fill a need after the 2015 FA's are declared it would be worth it. We have our starting guards and looney is an experienced 4th rounder but if a guard who would have projected to round 2 or possibly 3 is there it would be worth it. If he was a 4th or 5th rounder prior to the injury probably not. The really special players probably won't last till the 7th round like Lattimore and Dial and Carradine didn't. But if a special player does I would take him with our 7th round picks and maybe even our 5th and 6th rounders as well.

If that kind of talent was available you are absolutely right. If it is not available I would rather trade the picks than draft them unless we have a very good idea the player will make the team. We wasted our three 7th rounders this past year. They all performed as well as we could have hoped. If a draft pick plays as well as you could reasonably hope for he should make the team. Otherwise you should not have drafted him in the 1st place.

Lets hope some special players drop to the 7th and we are sitting there in a position to scoop them up.

That is why I am in favor of drafting injured players with our 5th, 6th and 3 -7th rounders so that we can put them on the PUP/NFI list.
1st, 2-2nds, 3-3rds and 4th draft healthy bodies or trade one for a future 2015 draft pick.

Let's hope some special talent falls to us. If we draft a great player and just have to wait a year it would be great or if we find a player healthy that fills a need. I just hope we don't waste the picks again.
As far as I'm concerned, the only players that should be put the waivers to get on the practice squad are Undrafted Rookie Free Agents.

The 49ers roster is too good. People are going to poach our 6th or 7th rounder that we try and have clear waivers and get on our practice squad. Even our UDRFA practice squad players aren't safe (Michael Thomas, Marquies Gray, Jason Schepler)
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