There are 118 users in the forums

Remember
Not a member? Register Now!

Phoenix49ers 2014 Mock Draft V3.0-Christmas Edition

Love loading up at DB and WR! Seems a very reasonable approach...mainly because it agrees with me!
Originally posted by SFrush:
Wtf? Someone had a 48 hour epiphany on Allen Robinson.

Credit goes to you mostly, and the fact that the coaching staff seems to be continually inept when it comes to developing receivers.
Originally posted by communist:
Don't think that we will draft a run-stuffing monster NT. Iirc, we never lined up a fatty at NT under Fangio.
he is just 5-8? I don't know about that. I mean, 5-8 is REALLY small. Mismatch all sunday long, here we go.

There is no way that Harbaalke is going to draft a 5-8 CB. All things being somewhat equal they want a substantial CB - 6' or taller. They want aggressive, talented, fast, strong, leaping, great instincts, fluid hips, the whole nine yards but in a substantial package. I like the idea of an aggressive CB but it will not happen in the 1st five rounds of a SF draft. They might go with one in UDFA as they did with Daryl Morris, but they would prefer a Cooper to a Morris. So good thought but wrong selection in my opinion. So lets go for Gilbert.
Originally posted by Ninefan56:
There is no way that Harbaalke is going to draft a 5-8 CB. All things being somewhat equal they want a substantial CB - 6' or taller. They want aggressive, talented, fast, strong, leaping, great instincts, fluid hips, the whole nine yards but in a substantial package. I like the idea of an aggressive CB but it will not happen in the 1st five rounds of a SF draft. They might go with one in UDFA as they did with Daryl Morris, but they would prefer a Cooper to a Morris. So good thought but wrong selection in my opinion. So lets go for Gilbert.

The reality is both Gilbert and Dennard are likely gone by the time the 49ers pick. Also, Baalke has shown a willingness to buck conventional thought, claiming that you know what they will or won't do is just silly. Once again you focus on the guy being 5'8", not on being a tremendous playmaker and the heart of a very good defense, this is exactly why smart GM's take players like Joyner and look like geniuses later on because all the guy does is produce while other GM's worry about measurables. It's the same reasoning as to why Russell Wilson was a 3rd rounder instead of a 1st round pick.


I find it extremely bizarre the obsession that people have with a couple of inches of height which is rather meaningless, especially considering Joyner's considerable athletic ability. Whitner can play safety at 5'10, Brown can play cornerback at 5'10", but take away two inches and the guy is worthless? Nonsense.
Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
The reality is both Gilbert and Dennard are likely gone by the time the 49ers pick. Also, Baalke has shown a willingness to buck conventional thought, claiming that you know what they will or won't do is just silly. Once again you focus on the guy being 5'8", not on being a tremendous playmaker and the heart of a very good defense, this is exactly why smart GM's take players like Joyner and look like geniuses later on because all the guy does is produce while other GM's worry about measurables. It's the same reasoning as to why Russell Wilson was a 3rd rounder instead of a 1st round pick.


I find it extremely bizarre the obsession that people have with a couple of inches of height which is rather meaningless, especially considering Joyner's considerable athletic ability. Whitner can play safety at 5'10, Brown can play cornerback at 5'10", but take away two inches and the guy is worthless? Nonsense.

Folks put too much emphasis on one area and forget how important instinct is for a DB. Then you have Keith McGill and Dowling, who offer very different attibutes. Dowling is listed by CBS in the 7th round, but it's too early to put that in cement. I like the fact that Both Joyner and Dowling can play S or CB...gives the team a lot of flexibility.
Originally posted by communist:
Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:
A Marshawn-Lynch-stopping NT is good. A 5'8" CB, not so good.
Don't think that we will draft a run-stuffing monster NT. Iirc, we never lined up a fatty at NT under Fangio.
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:
A Marshawn-Lynch-stopping NT is good. A 5'8" CB, not so good.

That 5'8" DB is fast, hard hitting and aggressive, everything I want covering the slot or the Wes Welkers, Santana Moss', Danny Amendola, Steve Smiths of the NFL. Anyone paying attention to FSU's secondary knows that Joyner and Terrance Brooks pretty much make that secondary.
he is just 5-8? I don't know about that. I mean, 5-8 is REALLY small. Mismatch all sunday long, here we go.
I agree it's unlikely the FO will select a monster NT. That hasn't been their MO (just as the FO seems to prefer taller DBs). I'm stating my preference for a specialist dedicated to stopping Lynch and short yardage plays. .
  • Kolohe
  • Hall of Fame
  • Posts: 31,332
Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:
Originally posted by communist:
Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:
A Marshawn-Lynch-stopping NT is good. A 5'8" CB, not so good.
Don't think that we will draft a run-stuffing monster NT. Iirc, we never lined up a fatty at NT under Fangio.
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:
A Marshawn-Lynch-stopping NT is good. A 5'8" CB, not so good.

That 5'8" DB is fast, hard hitting and aggressive, everything I want covering the slot or the Wes Welkers, Santana Moss', Danny Amendola, Steve Smiths of the NFL. Anyone paying attention to FSU's secondary knows that Joyner and Terrance Brooks pretty much make that secondary.
he is just 5-8? I don't know about that. I mean, 5-8 is REALLY small. Mismatch all sunday long, here we go.
I agree it's unlikely the FO will select a monster NT. That hasn't been their MO (just as the FO seems to prefer taller DBs). I'm stating my preference for a specialist dedicated to stopping Lynch and short yardage plays. .

You can't say the front office prefers smaller DB's when players like Darryl Morris, Trenton Robinson, Tramane Brock, Donte Whitner, Tarrell Brown were either selected, picked up, starting or extended. I think the front office just prefers players with a good head on his shoulders that can play ball. BTW those players listed are 5'9" and just a smidge over 5'9" making them a pubic hair close to 5'10".
Troy Polamalu is listed at 5'10"...and might be close. Anyone who would prefer a bigger DB over Troy is just insane! If this guy has Troy potential, and his write up suggests really great instincts, I would be delighted even at 5'8".
Originally posted by dtg_9er:
Troy Polamalu is listed at 5'10"...and might be close. Anyone who would prefer a bigger DB over Troy is just insane! If this guy has Troy potential, and his write up suggests really great instincts, I would be delighted even at 5'8".

The thing is, I'm not advocating for Joyner to be a starting CB on the outside. The 49ers would have Culliver, Brock, Wright and also McGill to play on the outside. A guy like Joyner, you play him in the slot and he has the speed/quickness to stay with those smaller slot guys that have given the 49ers trouble at times. You could also move him out to safety in case of an injury or just to give some different looks on defense. With all the different looks teams are giving in the passing game, the spread offenses and so on, having a high quality slot corner is important as well. Joyner might be smaller than Rogers, but also a lot faster with better quickness, he also has instincts that you just can't teach or coach-up. A natural ballhawk.
Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Originally posted by dtg_9er:
Troy Polamalu is listed at 5'10"...and might be close. Anyone who would prefer a bigger DB over Troy is just insane! If this guy has Troy potential, and his write up suggests really great instincts, I would be delighted even at 5'8".

The thing is, I'm not advocating for Joyner to be a starting CB on the outside. The 49ers would have Culliver, Brock, Wright and also McGill to play on the outside. A guy like Joyner, you play him in the slot and he has the speed/quickness to stay with those smaller slot guys that have given the 49ers trouble at times. You could also move him out to safety in case of an injury or just to give some different looks on defense. With all the different looks teams are giving in the passing game, the spread offenses and so on, having a high quality slot corner is important as well. Joyner might be smaller than Rogers, but also a lot faster with better quickness, he also has instincts that you just can't teach or coach-up. A natural ballhawk.

No, he would be at a disadvantage against tall receivers in the RZ and elsewhere, but just as Polamalu makes up for his lack of size, there is no reason to assume Joyner can't. If he were just used against smaller quick receivers--fine; but if he becomes a truly great DB...well then--double win. Culling out players due to one shortcoming (pun intended) is just silly if their other qualities are elite. This is especially true when the team is stacked and has a lot of picks!

How tall was Darrell Green? 5'8" 184. Joyner? 5'8" 190.
Originally posted by dtg_9er:
No, he would be at a disadvantage against tall receivers in the RZ and elsewhere, but just as Polamalu makes up for his lack of size, there is no reason to assume Joyner can't. If he were just used against smaller quick receivers--fine; but if he becomes a truly great DB...well then--double win. Culling out players due to one shortcoming (pun intended) is just silly if their other qualities are elite. This is especially true when the team is stacked and has a lot of picks!

How tall was Darrell Green? 5'8" 184. Joyner? 5'8" 190.

I think both of the smaller CB's that I like, Joyner and Allen, would be first round picks easily if they were 6 feet tall.
Originally posted by kronik:
Joyner, Archer may be great college players but at that size, I doubt Baalke would pick them. Baalke is a size/speed guy especially with our high picks. Better find prospects with long arms. Short guys with short arms, I just don't see it happening.

Love your threads tho, keep up the good work

I think Baalke is bigger on college production. AJ Jenkins didn't scream size. Neither did Kendall Hunter coming out. But they were both productive players. I think we are going to get at least one true burner on offense. It's the achilles heel of our nemesis and someone with some elite speed can take advantage of Kaep's big arm. I like the Archer pick or anyone with a similar skillset honestly. People often talk about what a great addition Boldin has been to our team and he has, but the true MVP is Vernon Davis (the speed guy). We are 0-3 when he misses significant time in a game. Getting another deep threat that would make it difficult on defenses would only help us more.
Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
Originally posted by kronik:
Joyner, Archer may be great college players but at that size, I doubt Baalke would pick them. Baalke is a size/speed guy especially with our high picks. Better find prospects with long arms. Short guys with short arms, I just don't see it happening.

Love your threads tho, keep up the good work

I think Baalke is bigger on college production. AJ Jenkins didn't scream size. Neither did Kendall Hunter coming out. But they were both productive players. I think we are going to get at least one true burner on offense. It's the achilles heel of our nemesis and someone with some elite speed can take advantage of Kaep's big arm. I like the Archer pick or anyone with a similar skillset honestly. People often talk about what a great addition Boldin has been to our team and he has, but the true MVP is Vernon Davis (the speed guy). We are 0-3 when he misses significant time in a game. Getting another deep threat that would make it difficult on defenses would only help us more.

Agree. We need more speed
Young players under six feet tall:

Brock

Brown

Hunter

James

Morris

Wright


Seems Baalke has nothing against small DBs or RBs.
Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
I think Baalke is bigger on college production. AJ Jenkins didn't scream size. Neither did Kendall Hunter coming out. But they were both productive players. I think we are going to get at least one true burner on offense. It's the achilles heel of our nemesis and someone with some elite speed can take advantage of Kaep's big arm. I like the Archer pick or anyone with a similar skillset honestly. People often talk about what a great addition Boldin has been to our team and he has, but the true MVP is Vernon Davis (the speed guy). We are 0-3 when he misses significant time in a game. Getting another deep threat that would make it difficult on defenses would only help us more.

Yes, this offense definitely needs an infusion of speed. A guy like Archer would an an additional dimension to this offense.