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2014 Senior Bowl

Originally posted by Ninerjohn:
I wasnt overly impressed by too many guys today. There will probably be 2 or 3 first rounders at most who played today. Carr impressed at seems a lock to me for the first rd. Ford obviously played well. Matthews looked pretty solid in limited opportunities. Other than that........... meh

some of the players i felt helped their stock were Dee Ford (so explosive off the ball), Jordan Matthews (didn't get the ball much, but showed great route running, hands, and willingness to run block), Stanley Jean-Baptiste, Chris Borland, and the safeties (Jimmie Ward, Craig Loston, Deone Bucannon, and Ahmad Dixon)
  • buck
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site has a 16 min interview with Pierre Desir


http://college2pro.com/showPlayer.php?id=6&page=bioList

and many other players

http://college2pro.com/bioList.php
Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Originally posted by gold49digger:
baptiste isnt a good football player? Im not saying we draft like the raiders and get physical freaks but this guy is a good player.

He's very raw. Not someone you throw in there to start unless you're a team like Seattle that simply presses and holds the s**t out of people. None of these taller guys people are going nuts over are ready to start right away, they all need time to develop.

I think that could be said about a lot of rookies. I think of the top cover corner in the draft last year (Milliner) who just about everyone thought could come in on day one and at the very least, hold his own. Of course he was awful most of the year and only started playing better the last few weeks of the season. So even a guy like Milliner who was the top-rated corner in the entire draft last year after coming from the best conference/best coach/best team in college football, will struggle to make that adjustment to the NFL.

Plus, I highly doubt they'd need a rookie to start at corner next season anyway, with Brock and Culliver pegged as the starters and more than likely, 1 (maybe even 2) low-cost veterans (Cox/Wright types) to fight it out for the slot/backup positions. IMO, we ideally draft at least two corners with different dynamics...the standard CB with average size, great hips, good balls skills AND a raw, jumbo-sized CB with upside. For years, our secondary has been missing key attributes: size, speed, the ability to jam big WRs/knock them off their routes and the ability to win when the ball is in the air so I think it's worth the risk to draft a SJB, McGill, Desir or Aikens.

I'm not saying we will or should copy everything Seattle does, but I really believe we need to incorporate more size/physicality/play-making ability into our secondary.
[ Edited by GhostofFredDean74 on Jan 27, 2014 at 10:52 AM ]
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Originally posted by gold49digger:
baptiste isnt a good football player? Im not saying we draft like the raiders and get physical freaks but this guy is a good player.

He's very raw. Not someone you throw in there to start unless you're a team like Seattle that simply presses and holds the s**t out of people. None of these taller guys people are going nuts over are ready to start right away, they all need time to develop.

I think that could be said about a lot of rookies. I think of the top cover corner in the draft last year (Milliner) who just about everyone thought could come in on day one and at the very least, hold his own. Of course he was awful most of the year and only started playing better the last few weeks of the season. So even a guy like Milliner who was the top-rated corner in the entire draft last year after coming from the best conference/best coach/best team in college football, will struggle to make that adjustment to the NFL.

Plus, I highly doubt they'd need a rookie to start at corner next season anyway, with Brock and Culliver pegged as the starters and more than likely, 1 (maybe even 2) low-cost veterans (Cox/Wright types) to fight it out for the slot/backup positions. IMO, we ideally draft at least two corners with different dynamics...the standard CB with average size, great hips, good balls skills AND a raw, jumbo-sized CB with upside. For years, our secondary has been missing key attributes: size, speed, the ability to jam big WRs/knock them off their routes and the ability to win when the ball is in the air.

I'm not saying we will or should copy everything Seattle does, but I really believe we need to incorporate more size/physicality/play-making ability into our secondary.

I don't think we've struggled with the big WO. Culliver was plenty capable of handling those. What we struggled with are speedy WOs, and elite technicians. We need a good, smart CB that can read routes and adjust well to the ball in the air. I think Brock is one such guy. I also have my eye on Thurmond in FA
Originally posted by RollinWith21n52:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Originally posted by gold49digger:
baptiste isnt a good football player? Im not saying we draft like the raiders and get physical freaks but this guy is a good player.

He's very raw. Not someone you throw in there to start unless you're a team like Seattle that simply presses and holds the s**t out of people. None of these taller guys people are going nuts over are ready to start right away, they all need time to develop.

I think that could be said about a lot of rookies. I think of the top cover corner in the draft last year (Milliner) who just about everyone thought could come in on day one and at the very least, hold his own. Of course he was awful most of the year and only started playing better the last few weeks of the season. So even a guy like Milliner who was the top-rated corner in the entire draft last year after coming from the best conference/best coach/best team in college football, will struggle to make that adjustment to the NFL.

Plus, I highly doubt they'd need a rookie to start at corner next season anyway, with Brock and Culliver pegged as the starters and more than likely, 1 (maybe even 2) low-cost veterans (Cox/Wright types) to fight it out for the slot/backup positions. IMO, we ideally draft at least two corners with different dynamics...the standard CB with average size, great hips, good balls skills AND a raw, jumbo-sized CB with upside. For years, our secondary has been missing key attributes: size, speed, the ability to jam big WRs/knock them off their routes and the ability to win when the ball is in the air.

I'm not saying we will or should copy everything Seattle does, but I really believe we need to incorporate more size/physicality/play-making ability into our secondary.

I don't think we've struggled with the big WO. Culliver was plenty capable of handling those. What we struggled with are speedy WOs, and elite technicians. We need a good, smart CB that can read routes and adjust well to the ball in the air. I think Brock is one such guy. I also have my eye on Thurmond in FA

I don't recall saying we struggled with big WOs. We struggled with WRs who were able to get clean releases off the line of scrimmage, roam free in our secondary and make big plays against our generally average-sized secondary.

What sets big corners apart is obviously the physicality, being able to knock WRs off their routes early (and sometimes often) and the potential to win more balls in the air than smaller CBs. Fads/trends happen for a reason in the NFL and sometimes they stick around because they're just more effective. Again, I'm not saying we abandon smaller/average-sized corners, because I'm sure some people might assume that's my point. It's not. I'm saying we need more size and physicality in our secondary and getting at least ONE bigger corner is worth the risk.
I would like CBs and Safeties who are good tacklers, good awareness of the play, and players who want to intercept the ball and have the skills necessary to do so. I am also hoping that Darryl Morris, or rookie CB, will end up being our Slot CB. So it will be interesting to see who we draft and what we focus on in the offseason.
I agree w/GOFD, we need to incorporate more size into our secondary...big WR's & athletic TE's are coming out of college in droves. Case in point, Jason Amaro from Texas Tech...tall, great hands, runs good routes. You need size/physicality to deal with guys like that. I like SJB...and Chris Davis showed well in the Sr Bowl. The latter obviously has excellent KR skills, too. BL is we need to what other teams (like Seattle) do to us...get physical w/receivers and have enough speed to deal with the quicker ones.
  • sfout
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Originally posted by CorvaNinerFan:
I agree w/GOFD, we need to incorporate more size into our secondary...big WR's & athletic TE's are coming out of college in droves. Case in point, Jason Amaro from Texas Tech...tall, great hands, runs good routes. You need size/physicality to deal with guys like that. I like SJB...and Chris Davis showed well in the Sr Bowl. The latter obviously has excellent KR skills, too. BL is we need to what other teams (like Seattle) do to us...get physical w/receivers and have enough speed to deal with the quicker ones.

You do remember that Chris Davis is the exact same size as Tarell Brown right, a shade under 5'10 and 200 pounds? He's not bigger than the average corner in the NFL. He did play well but that once again just points out that getting someone bigger shouldn't always be a priority going forward.
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Originally posted by gold49digger:
baptiste isnt a good football player? Im not saying we draft like the raiders and get physical freaks but this guy is a good player.

He's very raw. Not someone you throw in there to start unless you're a team like Seattle that simply presses and holds the s**t out of people. None of these taller guys people are going nuts over are ready to start right away, they all need time to develop.

I think that could be said about a lot of rookies. I think of the top cover corner in the draft last year (Milliner) who just about everyone thought could come in on day one and at the very least, hold his own. Of course he was awful most of the year and only started playing better the last few weeks of the season. So even a guy like Milliner who was the top-rated corner in the entire draft last year after coming from the best conference/best coach/best team in college football, will struggle to make that adjustment to the NFL.

Plus, I highly doubt they'd need a rookie to start at corner next season anyway, with Brock and Culliver pegged as the starters and more than likely, 1 (maybe even 2) low-cost veterans (Cox/Wright types) to fight it out for the slot/backup positions. IMO, we ideally draft at least two corners with different dynamics...the standard CB with average size, great hips, good balls skills AND a raw, jumbo-sized CB with upside. For years, our secondary has been missing key attributes: size, speed, the ability to jam big WRs/knock them off their routes and the ability to win when the ball is in the air so I think it's worth the risk to draft a SJB, McGill, Desir or Aikens.

I'm not saying we will or should copy everything Seattle does, but I really believe we need to incorporate more size/physicality/play-making ability into our secondary.

I totally agree with you Ghost although Culliver will be the slot CB if Rogers is released (very likely) as reported but is coming off ACL injury. Out of these big corners I believe SJB is the best of the crop in Nebraska he lined up everywhere compared to the others that I think can start day 1 if needed.
  • buck
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north team

Wide Receivers

Jared Abbrederis, Wisconsin – Shrunk just over an inch at the weigh-in. Showed why he was able to get open for the Badgers against top competition this year. He really runs routes well.

Michael Campanaro, Wake Forest – Shrunk over an inch and a half, but I am not convinced that actually is not a positive for him. It might actually help him when it comes to surviving in the slot in the NFL. Campanaro is one giant muscle and he was completely recovered from the separated shoulder. Tremendous feet and really excels laterally as a route runner. He seems to need to lean a little more when he makes cuts back to the football, but did everything I expected him to do this week.

Kain Colter, Northwestern – Colter looked like a wide receiver, which is more than anyone could say about Denard Robinson last year in a similar position. Beyond that, Colter did nothing to really stand out as a player.

Shaq Evans, UCLA – Evans is another player I have not seen on tape. In person, he was impressive. Nice build with broad shoulders, and showed strength and precision in route running. I was not expecting anyone on the North roster keep up with Jared Abbrederis in that respect, but he did a nice job. Sadly, he left with an injury but it was precautionary.

Robert Herron, Wyoming – His speed was impressive and he showed how well he can get open, which were not surprises. Herron seemed to press which caused him to drop the ball and get in a funk he had trouble leaving. In watching him, I did notice he had loud hands when he was catching the football which would suggest he is getting too much palm on the ball, which could be part of the problem. It was unusual because he has shown good hands in playing football in Laramie, Wyoming which is an unforgiving environment in terms of cold and wind.

Josh Huff, Oregon – Huff competed as hard as anyone on a consistent basis this week. He was able to win at a number of different areas of the field and he kept flashing talent. The North quarterbacks kept looking for him. I knew he could block from his tape, but was pleasantly surprised with just how much he was able to do as a receiver this week.

Jeff Janis, Saginaw Valley State – Might have been the most boring receiver there, for the right and wrong reasons. He never appeared to do anything wrong, but never did anything extraordinary either. To his credit, he never looked negatively impacted by the competition.


Defensive Backs

Deone Bucannon, Washington State – Physically impressive and a smart, personable guy. It would not be a surprise if his stock shot up on media boards as he was sort of hiding in Pullman for the Cougars. The secret is out and he could end up going quite high. Bucannon looked more like a linebacker than Telvin Smith.

Pierre Desir, Lindenwood – One of the more consistent performers of the week. His size and length are legitimate and he has shown good hips and the ability to react well in coverage.

Stanley Jean-Baptiste, Nebraska – Another one where people who did not know enough about him before will go back and look at him now. His athleticism is impressive and his experience as a receiver is beneficial.

Marqueston Huff, Wyoming – Huff has a nice skillset and could play both corner and safety. He really looked the part athletically. Whenever his playing career ends, the Wyoming football program would be smart to hire Huff as some sort of ambassador. He could not stop saying positive things about that school and program. Huff also said the best quarterback he faced this year was Derek Carr without question.

Jimmie Ward, Northern Illinois – Ward seemed to be the only true safety that made it clear he can be a huge asset in coverage. It does not mean that others cannot, but he showed he definitely can. Being able to play side by side with the rest of the safeties only served to help him stand out in that respect.

http://withthefirstpick.com/2014/01/27/reeses-senior-bowl-review-north-team/2/
  • buck
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south team

Wide Receivers

Cody Hoffman, BYU – Hoffman was a player, who in my view, took full advantage of the experience in Mobile. He looked smoother and more fluid in routes, able to look the part against the rest of the group. His outright speed and burst are questions but he uses his body well and knows how to get open and catch the football. Was an 1/8th of an inch short of 6'4" and looked impressive at 218lbs.

Jordan Matthews, Vanderbilt – Matthews showed his acumen and ability to run routes. Some criticized him for not gaining separation deep, but he stacked on the opponent well and had the right body position to make plays.

Matthews is another player who ran into some drops and when asked, wished he could have gone out on the JUGs machine for a few hours. He seemed to be someone who tried too hard on Monday and then bounced back the rest of the week.

Kevin Norwood, Alabama – Nothing outstanding about him physically but got open and found ways to make plays on the football.

Solomon Patton, Florida – Patton is a dynamic threat in space, but his inability to play consistently in his career showed up in his route running.

Jalen Saunders, Oklahoma – Slippery as a receiver and never shies away from a block.

Defensive Backs


Walt Aikens, Liberty – He was never afraid to go up and compete, showing physical play. Not overly tall but has some nice length because of his arms.

Craig Loston, LSU – He practiced exactly he played. Largely mediocre with a few splashes every now and again. Loston is physically impressive, but not much steak to go with the sizzle.

Keith McGill, Utah – McGill looked better in practice this week than he did in much of his tape. It was interesting that he is apparently on a far more healthy diet than the one they gave them at Mobile, which he said led to some significant cramping problems.

Jaylen Watkins, Florida – Watkins may have been one of the better corners this week and excelled in man coverage, coming up with a couple nice plays with his hands.

http://withthefirstpick.com/2014/01/27/reeses-senior-bowl-review-south-team/2/
  • buck
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•If you are looking for the best safety in the group for either team, Northern Illinois, Jimmie Ward is your guy. There is plenty to like about Ward and his approach to the game.

I believe that he is one of those safeties that sees the field well and once he does see it, he is gone. There are plenty of times where you see safeties over run the play, take a bad angle or must a tackle in the open field, Ward is not one of those guys. There were only a few coverages that these coaches were allowed to play, so that meant that the safeties had to figure into playing against the slot and when Ward was on the field, Falcons defensive coordinator, Mike Nolan was not afraid to walk him inside and let him cover from there.

Even while playing at normal depth, Ward was able to read the tight end on a crossing route from left to right, timing his arrival with that of the ball causing an incomplete pass. Ward was also able to show a physical side of the game with nice open field tackle on a receiver after a catch in the middle of the field. What I am looking forward to seeing is if Jimmie Ward can put himself in that mix with safeties like Ha-Ha Clinton-Dix and Calvin Pryor as we begin to build this draft board.

http://www.dallascowboys.com/news/article-BryanBroaddusBlog/Scout%E2%80%99s-Eye-Senior-Bowl-Observations-of-Donald--Ford--/fd3b253d-0c7e-452e-8db8-39c92f98d405
I've noticed Ward climbing the lists on various sites. He is now ranked second on the CBS prospect list at SS, behind only Bucannon; and ESPN has him listed 5th among all safeties. He is one of the shortest but is 5'10 on the ESPN list and 5'11" on CBS...so not that much shorter than most. Projected round on CBS is 2/3.
[ Edited by dtg_9er on Jan 28, 2014 at 7:27 AM ]
  • buck
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Originally posted by dtg_9er:
I've noticed Ward climbing the lists on various sites. He is now ranked second on the CBS prospect list at SS, behind only Bucannon; and ESPN has him listed 5th among all safeties. He is one of the shortest but is 5'10 on the ESPN list and 5'11" on CBS...so not that much shorter than most. Projected round on CBS is 2/3.

Now it is on to the combine.

I really want to see how he does in the defensive back drills at the combine.