There are 102 users in the forums

Remember
Not a member? Register Now!

Wide Receiver Class of 2014

  • sfout
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 6,345
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
I appreciate the support. You've listed many of the reasons why I have some of these players higher than other. Major tools + potential + evidence of development are big-time reasons to rate a guy like Bryant a little higher than some might. You CANNOT judge a player on production itself, and production to begin with has to be taken into context as well with consideration for other factors.

I am not a big fan of Beckham. I understand he is a good return man, but I see several issues with him: poor ball-security, inconsistent hands, lack of physicality compared to many of the other wideouts in this class. I see a receiver who flashes every once in a while some ability -- but NFL-caliber ability? I'm really not sure. I see a player who I have concerns would never become a legitimate starter at the pro level and could struggle with consistency if he doesn't develop in several areas.

After Watkins, I think Lee has the next-best open-field moves. Benjamin I feel has the highest upside in this WR class. I personally feel Moncrief is the most underrated prospect in this class right now and to me is one of the most polished receivers after Watkins -- he and Robinson are very close in my opinion. After the top 5, I see issues and limitations with the rest of the bunch, but all have the ability to be good with development.

You're welcome OTC. I'm looking forward to more analysis from you over the next few months.
Originally posted by sfout:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
I appreciate the support. You've listed many of the reasons why I have some of these players higher than other. Major tools + potential + evidence of development are big-time reasons to rate a guy like Bryant a little higher than some might. You CANNOT judge a player on production itself, and production to begin with has to be taken into context as well with consideration for other factors.

I am not a big fan of Beckham. I understand he is a good return man, but I see several issues with him: poor ball-security, inconsistent hands, lack of physicality compared to many of the other wideouts in this class. I see a receiver who flashes every once in a while some ability -- but NFL-caliber ability? I'm really not sure. I see a player who I have concerns would never become a legitimate starter at the pro level and could struggle with consistency if he doesn't develop in several areas.

After Watkins, I think Lee has the next-best open-field moves. Benjamin I feel has the highest upside in this WR class. I personally feel Moncrief is the most underrated prospect in this class right now and to me is one of the most polished receivers after Watkins -- he and Robinson are very close in my opinion. After the top 5, I see issues and limitations with the rest of the bunch, but all have the ability to be good with development.

You're welcome OTC. I'm looking forward to more analysis from you over the next few months.

Wow OTC, I'm not sure what you don't see in Beckham. Whatever struggles he had with drops/ball security primarily happened in his first few years, but this year he largely put that behind him and turned in one of the greatest seasons ever for an offensive player at LSU (set a Tigers record in 2013 for all-purpose yardage in a season). Yes, numbers aren't everything, but when you consider that he plays in a pro-style offense, against mostly pro-caliber talent in the SEC, production does become an important factor

What I like most of all about Beckham is that he's willing to put in the hard work to fix the areas he was weak in (specifically drops, which were more about concentration than anything, because he has ridiculous hands, and shoring up his route-running). Not to mention, he's been remarkably consistent since his first year, catching at least 40 passes in every season.

He's still pretty raw, I'll give you that, but he's got as much natural tools to work with as any WR in this draft. You combine that with actual production, the level of competition he faced and excelled against, his experience in a pro system and his proven ability to correct his weaknesses, I see not only a NFL starter but a future playmaker with an upside of a Victor Cruz. At the very least, IMO he's Golden Tate without the douchbaggery.
[ Edited by GhostofFredDean74 on Feb 4, 2014 at 11:25 AM ]
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by sfout:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
I appreciate the support. You've listed many of the reasons why I have some of these players higher than other. Major tools + potential + evidence of development are big-time reasons to rate a guy like Bryant a little higher than some might. You CANNOT judge a player on production itself, and production to begin with has to be taken into context as well with consideration for other factors.

I am not a big fan of Beckham. I understand he is a good return man, but I see several issues with him: poor ball-security, inconsistent hands, lack of physicality compared to many of the other wideouts in this class. I see a receiver who flashes every once in a while some ability -- but NFL-caliber ability? I'm really not sure. I see a player who I have concerns would never become a legitimate starter at the pro level and could struggle with consistency if he doesn't develop in several areas.

After Watkins, I think Lee has the next-best open-field moves. Benjamin I feel has the highest upside in this WR class. I personally feel Moncrief is the most underrated prospect in this class right now and to me is one of the most polished receivers after Watkins -- he and Robinson are very close in my opinion. After the top 5, I see issues and limitations with the rest of the bunch, but all have the ability to be good with development.

You're welcome OTC. I'm looking forward to more analysis from you over the next few months.

Wow OTC, I'm not sure what you don't see in Beckham. Whatever struggles he had with drops/ball security primarily happened in his first few years, but this year he largely put that behind him and turned in one of the greatest seasons ever for an offensive player at LSU (set a Tigers record in 2013 for all-purpose yardage in a season). Yes, numbers aren't everything, but when you consider that he plays in a pro-style offense, against mostly pro-caliber talent in the SEC, production does become an important factor

What I like most of all about Beckham is that he's willing to put in the hard work to fix the areas he was weak in (specifically drops, which were more about concentration than anything, because he has ridiculous hands, and shoring up his route-running). Not to mention, he's been remarkably consistent since his first year, catching at least 40 passes in every season.

He's still pretty raw, I'll give you that, but he's got as much natural tools to work with as any WR in this draft. You combine that with actual production, the level of competition he faced and excelled against, his experience in a pro system and his proven ability to correct his weaknesses, I see not only a NFL starter but a future playmaker along the lines of a Victor Cruz.

Ghost, I'm not sure what it is, but my eyes and my gut just aren't giving me the best feeling on him. I still see his raw potential, which is why he's in my top 10, but I just do not value him that highly, especially compared to some. Maybe I just haven't reviewed enough of Beckham yet. But right now, despite the numbers, I just don't see a player that will be immediately good, much less dominant. I will be doing much more research on all these prospects so you never know, I may bump him up a little, but right now he's pretty set where I value him. Your edit on him potentially being a Golden Tate type is kind of where I see him -- good game here, disappear there. I just am not very comfortable with the player, and feel uneasy about his ability to be a consistent producer in the NFL.
[ Edited by OnTheClock on Feb 4, 2014 at 11:30 AM ]
when i look at the list of receivers and who the niners would have a realistic chance in taking, i hope we come away with at least 1 or 2 of the following:

  1. Jarvis Landry
  2. Jordan Matthews
  3. Brandin Cooks
  4. Odell Beckham, Jr.
  5. Kelvin Benjamin
  6. Allen Robinson
  7. Davante Adams
  8. Donte Moncrief
  9. Martavis Bryant
  10. Josh Huff
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by sfout:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
I appreciate the support. You've listed many of the reasons why I have some of these players higher than other. Major tools + potential + evidence of development are big-time reasons to rate a guy like Bryant a little higher than some might. You CANNOT judge a player on production itself, and production to begin with has to be taken into context as well with consideration for other factors.

I am not a big fan of Beckham. I understand he is a good return man, but I see several issues with him: poor ball-security, inconsistent hands, lack of physicality compared to many of the other wideouts in this class. I see a receiver who flashes every once in a while some ability -- but NFL-caliber ability? I'm really not sure. I see a player who I have concerns would never become a legitimate starter at the pro level and could struggle with consistency if he doesn't develop in several areas.

After Watkins, I think Lee has the next-best open-field moves. Benjamin I feel has the highest upside in this WR class. I personally feel Moncrief is the most underrated prospect in this class right now and to me is one of the most polished receivers after Watkins -- he and Robinson are very close in my opinion. After the top 5, I see issues and limitations with the rest of the bunch, but all have the ability to be good with development.

You're welcome OTC. I'm looking forward to more analysis from you over the next few months.

Wow OTC, I'm not sure what you don't see in Beckham. Whatever struggles he had with drops/ball security primarily happened in his first few years, but this year he largely put that behind him and turned in one of the greatest seasons ever for an offensive player at LSU (set a Tigers record in 2013 for all-purpose yardage in a season). Yes, numbers aren't everything, but when you consider that he plays in a pro-style offense, against mostly pro-caliber talent in the SEC, production does become an important factor

What I like most of all about Beckham is that he's willing to put in the hard work to fix the areas he was weak in (specifically drops, which were more about concentration than anything, because he has ridiculous hands, and shoring up his route-running). Not to mention, he's been remarkably consistent since his first year, catching at least 40 passes in every season.

He's still pretty raw, I'll give you that, but he's got as much natural tools to work with as any WR in this draft. You combine that with actual production, the level of competition he faced and excelled against, his experience in a pro system and his proven ability to correct his weaknesses, I see not only a NFL starter but a future playmaker along the lines of a Victor Cruz.

Ghost, I'm not sure what it is, but my eyes and my gut just aren't giving me the best feeling on him. I still see his raw potential, which is why he's in my top 10, but I just do not value him that highly, especially compared to some. Maybe I just haven't reviewed enough of Beckham yet. But right now, despite the numbers, I just don't see a player that will be immediately good, much less dominant. I will be doing much more research on all these prospects so you never know, I may bump him up a little, but right now he's pretty set where I value him. Your edit on him potentially being a Golden Tate type is kind of where I see him -- good game here, disappear there. I just am not very comfortable with the player, and feel uneasy about his ability to be a consistent producer in the NFL.

Beauty is definitely in the eye of the beholder, particularly when it comes to WRs.

And if Beckham delivered similar production to Tate, I wouldn't be mad at all especially knowing how little Seattle throws the ball.
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
After reviewing hours of some of the top prospects again, I've reshuffled my WR board. New top 10 before the combine:

1. Sammy Watkins
2. Donte Moncrief
3. Kelvin Benjamin
4. Marqise Lee
5. Allen Robinson
6. Jarvis Landry
7. Mike Evans
8. Brandin Cooks
9. Martavis Bryant
10. Odell Beckham

Since WRs are deep this year, what are the odds that one or two of these guys might make it to the end of the 2nd round when the 49ers pick again? If one or two of these guys can drop that far, wouldn't it be wiser to draft S or CB earlier, especially if one of the premier guys in the DB falls within reach of this team's grasp?

I'm guessing it's all going to come down to who stays and who leaves, which we don't know yet. I can also see 49ers going WR first if their number 1 guy on their board is within reach in the first round. Honestly, I'm torn against going DB first or WR. I'm leaning towards CB in the first round because I don't see Brown or Rogers coming back and might need a starter or at the very least will be playing much more than a WR. I just don't see they letting Boldin walk considering how much Kaepernick has depended on him.
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by sfout:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
I appreciate the support. You've listed many of the reasons why I have some of these players higher than other. Major tools + potential + evidence of development are big-time reasons to rate a guy like Bryant a little higher than some might. You CANNOT judge a player on production itself, and production to begin with has to be taken into context as well with consideration for other factors.

I am not a big fan of Beckham. I understand he is a good return man, but I see several issues with him: poor ball-security, inconsistent hands, lack of physicality compared to many of the other wideouts in this class. I see a receiver who flashes every once in a while some ability -- but NFL-caliber ability? I'm really not sure. I see a player who I have concerns would never become a legitimate starter at the pro level and could struggle with consistency if he doesn't develop in several areas.

After Watkins, I think Lee has the next-best open-field moves. Benjamin I feel has the highest upside in this WR class. I personally feel Moncrief is the most underrated prospect in this class right now and to me is one of the most polished receivers after Watkins -- he and Robinson are very close in my opinion. After the top 5, I see issues and limitations with the rest of the bunch, but all have the ability to be good with development.

You're welcome OTC. I'm looking forward to more analysis from you over the next few months.

Wow OTC, I'm not sure what you don't see in Beckham. Whatever struggles he had with drops/ball security primarily happened in his first few years, but this year he largely put that behind him and turned in one of the greatest seasons ever for an offensive player at LSU (set a Tigers record in 2013 for all-purpose yardage in a season). Yes, numbers aren't everything, but when you consider that he plays in a pro-style offense, against mostly pro-caliber talent in the SEC, production does become an important factor

What I like most of all about Beckham is that he's willing to put in the hard work to fix the areas he was weak in (specifically drops, which were more about concentration than anything, because he has ridiculous hands, and shoring up his route-running). Not to mention, he's been remarkably consistent since his first year, catching at least 40 passes in every season.

He's still pretty raw, I'll give you that, but he's got as much natural tools to work with as any WR in this draft. You combine that with actual production, the level of competition he faced and excelled against, his experience in a pro system and his proven ability to correct his weaknesses, I see not only a NFL starter but a future playmaker along the lines of a Victor Cruz.

Ghost, I'm not sure what it is, but my eyes and my gut just aren't giving me the best feeling on him. I still see his raw potential, which is why he's in my top 10, but I just do not value him that highly, especially compared to some. Maybe I just haven't reviewed enough of Beckham yet. But right now, despite the numbers, I just don't see a player that will be immediately good, much less dominant. I will be doing much more research on all these prospects so you never know, I may bump him up a little, but right now he's pretty set where I value him. Your edit on him potentially being a Golden Tate type is kind of where I see him -- good game here, disappear there. I just am not very comfortable with the player, and feel uneasy about his ability to be a consistent producer in the NFL.

Beauty is definitely in the eye of the beholder, particularly when it comes to WRs.

And if Beckham delivered similar production to Tate, I wouldn't be mad at all especially knowing how little Seattle throws the ball.

Isn't that the truth? We'll see what happens, but I just hope we get someone who can be a big-time contributor and soon-to-be starter for us. Now of course if we don't get Boldin back, that "soon-to-be" turns into "immediate" for us.
Originally posted by sacleads:
Since WRs are deep this year, what are the odds that one or two of these guys might make it to the end of the 2nd round when the 49ers pick again? If one or two of these guys can drop that far, wouldn't it be wiser to draft S or CB earlier, especially if one of the premier guys in the DB falls within reach of this team's grasp?

I'm guessing it's all going to come down to who stays and who leaves, which we don't know yet. I can also see 49ers going WR first if their number 1 guy on their board is within reach in the first round. Honestly, I'm torn against going DB first or WR. I'm leaning towards CB in the first round because I don't see Brown or Rogers coming back and might need a starter or at the very least will be playing much more than a WR. I just don't see they letting Boldin walk considering how much Kaepernick has depended on him.

I have to believe at least one of them makes it to the end of the 2nd. Although, if you're the 49ers, you have to consider how much drop-off you're getting.

I don't believe the 49ers HAVE to get a receiver in the 1st. There's a great chance an awesome player will drop to the 2nd because there are so many other players at other positions that other teams are looking for. But after what happened this year after losing just ONE of our starting WR's, there's no way they could be so foolish as to go into 2014 without a talented player waiting in the wings in case something happens (Patton has promise, but is still unproven, we can't take that risk).

In my opinion, it would be extremely unwise for the 49ers to not take a WR by the end of round 2, considering the wealth of talent available. It would be downright ASININE if they did not take one by the 3rd round.
OTC what's your view on moncrief? I'm also very high on him and like you thinks he's VERY underrated. He reminds me of Josh Gordon. I have a feeling that after the combine he will start moving up draft boards a lot.
I could see Mike Evans slipping through the cracks into the bottom third of the first round. Trading up 8 or so spots to get him wouldn't be a bad idea. Gotta put these picks to use!
  • buck
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 12,012
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
After reviewing hours of some of the top prospects again, I've reshuffled my WR board. New top 10 before the combine:

1. Sammy Watkins
2. Donte Moncrief
3. Kelvin Benjamin
4. Marqise Lee
5. Allen Robinson
6. Jarvis Landry
7. Mike Evans
8. Brandin Cooks
9. Martavis Bryant
10. Odell Beckham

Interesting. What rounds do see these guys being drafted in?

Who gets drafted in the first and second rounds?
As much talk as I've heard about us needing a speed WR I think we need one that can get us 7 in the red zone. This is the area of the field that has absolutely killed us and it is high time we get someone that requires a double down there so at a minimum we can scheme others wide open. Yes speed can kill but we are getting in scoring position as is. We need someone to get us 7!
  • xcfan
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 1,984
why is josh huff virtually ignored in this draft? draftniks seem to think he's not a top-100 guy. i think his package translates well to the nfl. fast, strong, confident; plays with toughness like an alpha dog. once he absorbs a nfl offense, he'll make plays. if you drafted him in the 2nd, you'd get a good return on investment. what's with all the reports knocking him into the 3rd and 4th round? he's gonna play a long time.
  • xcfan
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 1,984
why is josh huff virtually ignored in this draft? draftniks seem to think he's not a top-100 guy. i think his package translates well to the nfl. fast, strong, confident; plays with toughness like an alpha dog. once he absorbs a nfl offense, he'll make plays. if you drafted him in the 2nd, you'd get a good return on investment. what's with all the reports knocking him into the 3rd and 4th round? he's gonna play a long time.
Originally posted by xcfan:
why is josh huff virtually ignored in this draft? draftniks seem to think he's not a top-100 guy. i think his package translates well to the nfl. fast, strong, confident; plays with toughness like an alpha dog. once he absorbs a nfl offense, he'll make plays. if you drafted him in the 2nd, you'd get a good return on investment. what's with all the reports knocking him into the 3rd and 4th round? he's gonna play a long time.

I agree he is gonna be a very good player. I just think draftniks don't view him as a sexy pick because he won't run a sub 4.4 forty or blow you away with his measurables.