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Rumor about 49ers trying to trade to top 15.

Star is my number one choice if we're trading up. I didn't think we a had chance in hell to get him three months ago. But if he falls out of the top ten we have the ammunition to go get him.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Why would we trade all the way up to trump the Rams to get a micro-WR? We have a ton of those guys and don't use them in a Harvin-like way under Roman. We could use Williams, Jenkins, James, Hunter, heck, even Manningham out of the Q formation and move them around, all over the field Amendola-style...but we don't. We run a more straight-forward power type offense and as a result (blocking), 3 of these small guys were injured. With the addition of Boldin and Lockette and his run at bigger, taller and more physical CB's (and his own words), Baalke seems to be looking for bigger bodies for a number of reasons.

Comparing Tavon Austin to Kyle Williams just because they're both small is kind of misguided. We don't have anyone remotely similar to Austin in terms of ability.
Star or Sheldon would be great.
Originally posted by JamesGatz83:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Why would we trade all the way up to trump the Rams to get a micro-WR? We have a ton of those guys and don't use them in a Harvin-like way under Roman. We could use Williams, Jenkins, James, Hunter, heck, even Manningham out of the Q formation and move them around, all over the field Amendola-style...but we don't. We run a more straight-forward power type offense and as a result (blocking), 3 of these small guys were injured. With the addition of Boldin and Lockette and his run at bigger, taller and more physical CB's (and his own words), Baalke seems to be looking for bigger bodies for a number of reasons.

Comparing Tavon Austin to Kyle Williams just because they're both small is kind of misguided. We don't have anyone remotely similar to Austin in terms of ability.

Both extremely quick, shifty, great hands, have speed, knack for getting open, dangerous in the open field, can be lined up anywhere, etc. Harvin is like this as well...so is Amendola. And Wes Welker. The point though is that, respectively, the Vikings, Rams and Patriots actually use them this way. Hell, in fact, the Rams had only ONE playmaker on offense and Fischer used Amendola so effectively they tied us and beat us in this fashion. Roman doesn't do this even though we certainly, IMHO, have similar weapons. So now, will the Bronco's use Welker the same way? Will the Pats use Amendola the same way? Will Seattle use Harvin the same way? We'll see...maybe the bigger question is, esp. given we run a lot of Q formations, why didn't (or doesn't) Roman employ similar mismatch creations? We even had a 4.2 Ginn (not the best example of course by WHEN he had the ball in his hands he could be dangerous) but we used him on fly-sweeps, end-arounds, fakes, etc. two years ago. And then, aside from the pitch-fail, never used him again. Why? Is Austin THAT much of a threat, above what we already have, to throw away all those draft picks in a year where there is so much deep talent for our needs between rounds 2-4? If you think so, I'd love to hear rationale on it. And I mean that in the most respectful way...
Originally posted by NC49erfan82:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Yeah, who is so special we'd need to trade up and throw those top picks away? Trading back makes more sense given who we need and how deep this draft is. We need DE, FS, NT, TE, WR, etc. Next year is the year we most likely pick up a first round WR...and I'm sure we'll get another in FA as well. We will get one this year as well but it will be a developmental guy with a ton of upside/great size/measurables, etc.

Same way I feel. I do not believe no player in the first round is worth trading up for. So much value everywhere between rounds 2-4.

I'm with you guys on the value. I think its as simple as ppl saying "they don't have room for all their draft picks" & connecting the dots from there. Trading up seems logical from that standpoint. I'm still not clear if there's anything more to these rumors than that.
Originally posted by Overkill:
Originally posted by NC49erfan82:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Yeah, who is so special we'd need to trade up and throw those top picks away? Trading back makes more sense given who we need and how deep this draft is. We need DE, FS, NT, TE, WR, etc. Next year is the year we most likely pick up a first round WR...and I'm sure we'll get another in FA as well. We will get one this year as well but it will be a developmental guy with a ton of upside/great size/measurables, etc.

Same way I feel. I do not believe no player in the first round is worth trading up for. So much value everywhere between rounds 2-4.

I'm with you guys on the value. I think its as simple as ppl saying "they don't have room for all their draft picks" & connecting the dots from there. Trading up seems logical from that standpoint. I'm still not clear if there's anything more to these rumors than that.

That and we all know Baalke is a master of creating smoke screens around this time and keeping everything close to the vest. And in saying that, Baalke is also a master of shocking the hell out of us too so you can't even dismiss this trade rumor either. Keep an open mind...
  • buck
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Originally posted by NCommand:
Both extremely quick, shifty, great hands, have speed, knack for getting open, dangerous in the open field, can be lined up anywhere, etc. Harvin is like this as well...so is Amendola. And Wes Welker. The point though is that, respectively, the Vikings, Rams and Patriots actually use them this way. Hell, in fact, the Rams had only ONE playmaker on offense and Fischer used Amendola so effectively they tied us and beat us in this fashion. Roman doesn't do this even though we certainly, IMHO, have similar weapons. So now, will the Bronco's use Welker the same way? Will the Pats use Amendola the same way? Will Seattle use Harvin the same way? We'll see...maybe the bigger question is, esp. given we run a lot of Q formations, why didn't (or doesn't) Roman employ similar mismatch creations? We even had a 4.2 Ginn (not the best example of course by WHEN he had the ball in his hands he could be dangerous) but we used him on fly-sweeps, end-arounds, fakes, etc. two years ago. And then, aside from the pitch-fail, never used him again. Why? Is Austin THAT much of a threat, above what we already have, to throw away all those draft picks in a year where there is so much deep talent for our needs between rounds 2-4? If you think so, I'd love to hear rationale on it. And I mean that in the most respectful way...

I think that you are overstating the case for Kyle Williams. He just has not been productive enough to warrant the the praise.
If shariff floyd starts dropping to 11 i would make a move and i would also make a move on kawaan short in the 2nd,so, what i am saying is my 3 favs are:
1. S. Floyd
2. T. Eifert
3. K. Short
Originally posted by buck:
I think that you are overstating the case for Kyle Williams. He just has not been productive enough to warrant the the praise.

He's a good little player...just caught between two completely different offenses. He went from focusing on crack-back blocks to running sideline routes against the Bears. He's a versatile guy...but he is just as versatile as many players we already have on our team as noted before: Hunter, James, Manningham, etc. Roman finally started to run VD out of the Q formation and had success. You don't think we can run these (aforementioned guys) out of this formation and be even more effective?

This is from the slot. Imagine the confusion he'd create with he and VD, Gore or Hunter/James out of the Q, lined up right next to CK.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap2000000098085/Kaepernick-to-Williams-for-57-yds
[ Edited by NCommand on Apr 22, 2013 at 9:39 AM ]
I wouldn't be shocked if the 49ers trade up to get Richardson if he's around at 13-14 (there's a rumor the Jets are thinking of trading down too but most teams are). I like Richardson more than Floyd for the 49ers, because Floyd has very short arms which would make it tough for him to play as a 3-4 DE and he doesn't have the bulk to play NT. Richardson could play 3-4 DE and move inside in the nickle with 34 1/2 inch arms (slightly longer than J.J. Watt's for comparison). I think Baalke values arm length a lot which is why he chose Aldon Smith when Smith wasn't being mocked that high (35 3/8 arms which are massive).

I'm a little surprised more people aren't mocking Richardson in the top 10 after he ran in the 4.8's at his Pro Day. 30 reps on the bench press with long arms is also impressive - the 49ers could view Richardson as a future replacement for Justin Smith since his arms allow him to play stronger than he is (which is quite strong) and he's a high-motor player who could rotate with other guys while building his stamina.
TYLER EIFERT!!!
Seems like a good year to trade up, teams in the early teens are needing draft picks and we got 13. Hopefully we can leverage two teams against each other and not have to pay full value for a trade.
  • buck
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 8,526
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by buck:
I think that you are overstating the case for Kyle Williams. He just has not been productive enough to warrant the the praise.

He's a good little player...just caught between two completely different offenses. He went from focusing on crack-back blocks to running sideline routes against the Bears. He's a versatile guy...but he is just as versatile as many players we already have on our team as noted before: Hunter, James, Manningham, etc. Roman finally started to run VD out of the Q formation and had success. You don't think we can run these (aforementioned guys) out of this formation and be even more effective?

This is from the slot. Imagine the confusion he'd create with he and VD, Gore or Hunter/James out of the Q, lined up right next to CK.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap2000000098085/Kaepernick-to-Williams-for-57-yds

I still think you are overstating his case.

Williams has played in the NFL for three years.

He has 35 receptions for 461 yards and 4 scores.
He has rushed 6 times for 53 yards.

Perhaps, he will prove to be more productive, but that can not be taken for granted.
[ Edited by buck on Apr 22, 2013 at 9:59 AM ]
The draft is so deep at defensive lineman and I think some good players will fall because of that. Unless there is a guy they love, I don't know if they'll have to trade up to get a good player. Very interested to see how they handle the first few rounds this year.
Originally posted by buck:
I still think you are overstating his case.

Williams has played in the NFL for three years.

He has 35 receptions for 461 yards and 4 scores.
He has rushed 6 times for 53 yards.

Perhaps, he will prove to be more productive, but that can not be taken for granted.

Agreed! Which was my point. It doesn't mean he can't produce like a Amendola/Welker as it is more HOW we have used him in the past and more recently under Roman (until he got hurt on a crack-back block). I highlighted him as just an example of being a versatile guy we don't use much....yet. Like how we could have been using James and Hunter more like Sproles. But we don't. Like how we had all this talent already on the team pre-Harbaugh but it took HarBaalke to 1) recognize it and 2) take advantage of it.

Roman will have his first offseason with CK and this offense together so while you feel I am overvaluing Williams and his abilities a bit, I'm willing to hold judgement and say "I think he could be used in this manner but we just haven't yet...hopefully Roman will this year with a full offseason."
[ Edited by NCommand on Apr 22, 2013 at 10:12 AM ]
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