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FS Kenny Vaccaro in the 1st?

Originally posted by Wrathman:
D Line should be first priority.

Assuming the value is there at DL, THIS. NYG have a mess of average players in their secondary, but they are always competitive because they have a stable of pass rushers, inside and out.
Originally posted by WRATHman44:
Originally posted by Wrathman:
D Line should be first priority.

Assuming the value is there at DL, THIS. NYG have a mess of average players in their secondary, but they are always competitive because they have a stable of pass rushers, inside and out.

I would agree, but what could change the equation is the signing of a quality veteran DE to back-up Justin and RayMac. What I mean is, if they sign someone who can provide an immediate impact as part of a rotation, that approach might be even better for THIS YEAR rather than using a high pick on a d-lineman. The vet doesn't have to be an every-down player; they just need to step in and be effective for 10-15 plays a game or if one of our guys goes down for a period of time. That could be anyone from Cullen Jenkins, Richard Seymour, Randy Starks, Jason Jones, Derek Landri or even a Desmond Bryant (don't care about his recent run in with the law). This becomes even more doable from a cap perspective if we trade Alex, release Akers and don't re-sign Goldson (all of which seem pretty likely at this point).

Point being, more than likely, anyone drafted at #31 is going to take a little time to acclimate and won't necessarily (or at least automatically) be an effective rotational player in this lineup. So the veteran signing might be the way to go, freeing the team up to address the secondary with high picks, then use later picks to get a young development-type of 3-4 DE.
[ Edited by GhostofFredDean74 on Feb 26, 2013 at 10:40 AM ]
Lets assume that we will loose ALL of our impending FAs. It sounds very likely that Goldson will follow the money, D. Walker's hands are suspect and his size is not ideal for a TE, and Soap is aging and overpaid for how many snaps he gets.

With that assumption, here are our top needs by priority:

1) FS - Trenton Robinson may step up in his 2nd year and fill this need. But right now, he is an unknown.

2) TE - Our offense depends on having 2 pass catching TEs. Without a good replacement for Walker, many of our formations will be limited.

3) DL - I expect RJF to be resigned to fill in at NT. But regardless, we need a big powerful DL to rotate in and take over as a starter soon.

4) CB - Rogers is overpaid and aging. We need to inject this under-performing group with some young talent ASAP.


There is also the question of value. This draft should be deep with safeties. We'd probably get better value by picking a DL or CB in the 1st and taking a FS or TE in the 2nd.
  • HERN
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 367
Matt Elam reminds me of Earl Thomas, we need to draft this guy with our first pick. Vaccaro seems to stiff.
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
I would agree, but what could change the equation is the signing of a quality veteran DE to back-up Justin and RayMac. What I mean is, if they sign someone who can provide an immediate impact as part of a rotation, that approach might be even better for THIS YEAR rather than using a high pick on a d-lineman. The vet doesn't have to be an every-down player; they just need to step in and be effective for 10-15 plays a game or if one of our guys goes down for a period of time. That could be anyone from Cullen Jenkins, Richard Seymour, Randy Starks, Jason Jones, Derek Landri or even a Desmond Bryant (don't care about his recent run in with the law). This becomes even more doable from a cap perspective if we trade Alex, release Akers and don't re-sign Goldson (all of which seem pretty likely at this point).

Point being, more than likely, anyone drafted at #31 is going to take a little time to acclimate and won't necessarily (or at least automatically) be an effective rotational player in this lineup. So the veteran signing might be the way to go, freeing the team up to address the secondary with high picks, then use later picks to get a young development-type of 3-4 DE.
this is exactly what i've been thinking. Revamping the secondary is critical. Just like in 1981 a new group of players, well coached, could be a big step forward. Goldson wanting $, whitner not good enough in coverage, rodgers and culliver being given some competition, these are all concerns thad could be solved with at least 3 new db's drafted. also bargain shop free agent db's - balke is good at this. then big competition in training camp.
the league figured out how to attack the 9er pass defense at the end of last year. i think we've got to change or we'll be falling behind.
Originally posted by HERN:
Matt Elam reminds me of Earl Thomas, we need to draft this guy with our first pick. Vaccaro seems to stiff.

How so? From what I've seen and been hearing, Elam is more of a prototypical SS (Whitner-like) while Earl Thomas is more of a centerfield, ball hawking FS, which is what I've been hearing about Vaccaro
Originally posted by Cooper22:
How so? From what I've seen and been hearing, Elam is more of a prototypical SS (Whitner-like) while Earl Thomas is more of a centerfield, ball hawking FS, which is what I've been hearing about Vaccaro

This. Not sure what he's seeing in Elam to equate with Earl Thomas. I'd say Phillip Thomas is more akin to Earl Thomas.
  • HERN
  • Veteran
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Originally posted by Cooper22:
How so? From what I've seen and been hearing, Elam is more of a prototypical SS (Whitner-like) while Earl Thomas is more of a centerfield, ball hawking FS, which is what I've been hearing about Vaccaro

I was reffering to his size, not necessarily the skill set.
Not happening...or at least bear this in mind. Niners haven't drafted a S of any kind in 1st rd since '92, and that was Dana Hall, who had some good years w/SF. I seriously doubt it'll happen this draft...I get that Vaccaro is a stud...so are CB's like Milliner and Trufant. But, the BL is the defense starts up front...and that's where I want to see Baalke get serious. Beef that group up, then worry about the secondary. Why? The bigger and badder our DL is, the less pressure there'll be on the secondary and also more opportunities for AS and Brooks to put serious heat on the QB. It all works together, but the DL is truly the key to it all.
I would love him in the 1st
  • kush
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Top 15 pick
Originally posted by blm7754:
Lets assume that we will loose ALL of our impending FAs. It sounds very likely that Goldson will follow the money, D. Walker's hands are suspect and his size is not ideal for a TE, and Soap is aging and overpaid for how many snaps he gets.

With that assumption, here are our top needs by priority:

1) FS - Trenton Robinson may step up in his 2nd year and fill this need. But right now, he is an unknown.

2) TE - Our offense depends on having 2 pass catching TEs. Without a good replacement for Walker, many of our formations will be limited.

3) DL - I expect RJF to be resigned to fill in at NT. But regardless, we need a big powerful DL to rotate in and take over as a starter soon.

4) CB - Rogers is overpaid and aging. We need to inject this under-performing group with some young talent ASAP.


There is also the question of value. This draft should be deep with safeties. We'd probably get better value by picking a DL or CB in the 1st and taking a FS or TE in the 2nd.


I hope to god that RJF is not our new starting NT. he is a backup at best
Originally posted by JustinNiner:
I hope to god that RJF is not our new starting NT. he is a backup at best

Well, our NT only plays 30% of the snaps.... so it's not like he'd be a full time starter. Perhaps we keep him and draft a replacement. DL is a tough position to get up to speed with in the NFL. It would be unwise to depend on a rookie to come in and start day 1. Keeping RJF gives us some flexibility and experienced depth.

I don't think we can expect an instant upgrade to our starting DL with draft picks. Young guys need to get stronger and improve technique to succeed in the NFL at DL. They can't do that in just a few months.
Originally posted by blm7754:
Well, our NT only plays 30% of the snaps.... so it's not like he'd be a full time starter. Perhaps we keep him and draft a replacement. DL is a tough position to get up to speed with in the NFL. It would be unwise to depend on a rookie to come in and start day 1. Keeping RJF gives us some flexibility and experienced depth.

I don't think we can expect an instant upgrade to our starting DL with draft picks. Young guys need to get stronger and improve technique to succeed in the NFL at DL. They can't do that in just a few months.

How do you know that? Because Soap only played 30% of the snaps? You ever think if they had a better NT they might utilize him a little more often? Its faulty logic to look at one year and go "well, we can get by with a s**t NT because he doesn't play many snaps." This stuff is fluid and all depends on the quality of the personnel available.
Originally posted by Wrathman:
D Line should be first priority.

best player available. That's how SMART teams remain successful.