QB Projection Thread (3/30/11)

Originally posted by Frisco69ers:

Originally posted by SF69ers:

Originally posted by Frisco69ers:

Originally posted by valrod33:
didnt teeohh already create a thread like this?

Frisco69ers > Teeohh

SF69ers > Frisco69ers

This post assumes that teams who likely aren't able to secure a QB in the early 1st will just sit back and let a QB fall to them in the 2nd. I highly doubt that happens, especially if the CBA hasn't been settled by draft time.

Truth is, these teams (49ers, Titans, Redskins, Vikings, Miami and possibly even teams like Cincy and Arizona who might miss out on Gabbert/Newton) will be fighting like hell to get back in to the late 1st so they can get the guy they want.

Point being, the market will be super hot for QBs that have even the slightest potential as a starter in the NFL, so our best bet is to trade back a little at #7 and get the guy we want early, or just outright pick that guy at #7 and not f**k around.

you think taking dalton or ponder in the top half of the draft would be a smart decision? Man this draft is going to be crazy

Originally posted by teeohh:
you think taking dalton or ponder in the top half of the draft would be a smart decision? Man this draft is going to be crazy

i wouldnt be mad if we traded back into the first to take wither one of those guys

Originally posted by teeohh:
you think taking dalton or ponder in the top half of the draft would be a smart decision? Man this draft is going to be crazy

Dalton, no...Ponder...it might have to come to that.

Teams shouldn't make a habit of reaching for need, but these are extraordinary circumstances which will not likely happen again for quite some time. Point being, teams out of necessity will reach for positions of need, or they could be left without talent (quality or otherwise) at critical positions (like QB).

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
This post assumes that teams who likely aren't able to secure a QB in the early 1st will just sit back and let a QB fall to them in the 2nd. I highly doubt that happens, especially if the CBA hasn't been settled by draft time.

Truth is, these teams (49ers, Titans, Redskins, Vikings, Miami and possibly even teams like Cincy and Arizona who might miss out on Gabbert/Newton) will be fighting like hell to get back in to the late 1st so they can get the guy they want.

Point being, the market will be super hot for QBs that have even the slightest potential as a starter in the NFL, so our best bet is to trade back a little at #7 and get the guy we want early, or just outright pick that guy at #7 and not f**k around.

Finally someone talking some sense!

Everyone here seems to think that Harbaugh has some kind of super power that will allow him to draft a stud QB that no one else will be targeting. He will probably be great at coaching whichever QB we get. But we have to assume that any QB Harbaugh likes, other teams will like also.

If we get our future starting QB in this draft no one will be upset no matter how high he's drafted. Even if it's something that sounds totally crazy right now, like Kaepernick at #7. If it works out, it won't be a reach.

Originally posted by TheFunkyChicken:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
This post assumes that teams who likely aren't able to secure a QB in the early 1st will just sit back and let a QB fall to them in the 2nd. I highly doubt that happens, especially if the CBA hasn't been settled by draft time.

Truth is, these teams (49ers, Titans, Redskins, Vikings, Miami and possibly even teams like Cincy and Arizona who might miss out on Gabbert/Newton) will be fighting like hell to get back in to the late 1st so they can get the guy they want.

Point being, the market will be super hot for QBs that have even the slightest potential as a starter in the NFL, so our best bet is to trade back a little at #7 and get the guy we want early, or just outright pick that guy at #7 and not f**k around.

Finally someone talking some sense!

Everyone here seems to think that Harbaugh has some kind of super power that will allow him to draft a stud QB that no one else will be targeting. He will probably be great at coaching whichever QB we get. But we have to assume that any QB Harbaugh likes, other teams will like also.

If we get our future starting QB in this draft no one will be upset no matter how high he's drafted. Even if it's something that sounds totally crazy right now, like Kaepernick at #7. If it works out, it won't be a reach.

Btw, IMO the players (specifically, this free agent class) have more to gain by having free agency AFTER the draft, knowing teams will likely be more aggressive going after veterans to fill their positions of need (even if they drafted for those positions) as opposed to relying on rookies to step in and play immediately...so I don't see a real motivation from the players side to get the new CBA done anytime soon.

Originally posted by TheFunkyChicken:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
This post assumes that teams who likely aren't able to secure a QB in the early 1st will just sit back and let a QB fall to them in the 2nd. I highly doubt that happens, especially if the CBA hasn't been settled by draft time.

Truth is, these teams (49ers, Titans, Redskins, Vikings, Miami and possibly even teams like Cincy and Arizona who might miss out on Gabbert/Newton) will be fighting like hell to get back in to the late 1st so they can get the guy they want.

Point being, the market will be super hot for QBs that have even the slightest potential as a starter in the NFL, so our best bet is to trade back a little at #7 and get the guy we want early, or just outright pick that guy at #7 and not f**k around.

Finally someone talking some sense!

Everyone here seems to think that Harbaugh has some kind of super power that will allow him to draft a stud QB that no one else will be targeting. He will probably be great at coaching whichever QB we get. But we have to assume that any QB Harbaugh likes, other teams will like also.

If we get our future starting QB in this draft no one will be upset no matter how high he's drafted. Even if it's something that sounds totally crazy right now, like Kaepernick at #7. If it works out, it won't be a reach.

Completely Agree! Wherever Gabbert and Newton Fall it will create a frenzy after that. Teams will have to move around but may decide that the cost isn't worth it. they may also see someone on their board that might not have been there because of all the QB's being taken. I also think that this years QB class has a chance to be special. A lot of people keep saying that its a bad year but you have Gabbert as a potential overall #1, same with Newton for those teams that see that Vick/Tebow/all around talent in him. Then it looks like a drop off but Locker was last years projected #1, Mallett had high projections before this year and still lit up the SEC, Ponder is rising fast and possibly into the 1st round. Dalton and Kaepernick are rising as well. Some of these guys could get drafted by playoff teams and sit and gain experince like Rodgers did in Green Bay. I don't know but in my eyes I like the potential in a lot of them...

We are also in the situation of putting in a new (old) system, so regardless who we draft they will not participate in any OTA's and will probably have a very short training camp. I would not reach and make a need pick, since it won't be much if any help to us. Hang on and wait to see which vet we can get (Kolb, Palmer, Alex, Bulger) who will be NFL-ready right away. Trade down in the first or move up our second-round pick to the end of the first round to take someone, but don't use the #7 pick on the third qb taken.

Originally posted by rapid4:
We are also in the situation of putting in a new (old) system, so regardless who we draft they will not participate in any OTA's and will probably have a very short training camp. I would not reach and make a need pick, since it won't be much if any help to us. Hang on and wait to see which vet we can get (Kolb, Palmer, Alex, Bulger) who will be NFL-ready right away. Trade down in the first or move up our second-round pick to the end of the first round to take someone, but don't use the #7 pick on the third qb taken.

Disagree that you don't at least strongly consider taking the QB you want at #7. Sure, our first attempt should be to move back a little, get some value for that pick then grab Locker, Ponder or Kap (if those are the guys JH likes) in the middle of the 1st. It might not seem like great value right now, but as they grow and learn the game, the initial perception of "reaching" for these guys goes away.

NFL draft value is all about perception, until you hit the field and perform. So if you believe in a guy and you think (with your coaching), you can turn him into a winner, you take that guy and screw what OTHER people think. Yes, you try and get "value" where you can, but the REAL value will come when that guy puts on the uniform and begins to win games for you, regardless of where he was drafted or where other teams slotted him.

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:

Originally posted by rapid4:
We are also in the situation of putting in a new (old) system, so regardless who we draft they will not participate in any OTA's and will probably have a very short training camp. I would not reach and make a need pick, since it won't be much if any help to us. Hang on and wait to see which vet we can get (Kolb, Palmer, Alex, Bulger) who will be NFL-ready right away. Trade down in the first or move up our second-round pick to the end of the first round to take someone, but don't use the #7 pick on the third qb taken.

Disagree that you don't at least strongly consider taking the QB you want at #7. Sure, our first attempt should be to move back a little, get some value for that pick then grab Locker, Ponder or Kap (if those are the guys JH likes) in the middle of the 1st. It might not seem like great value right now, but as they grow and learn the game, the initial perception of "reaching" for these guys goes away.

NFL draft value is all about perception, until you hit the field and perform. So if you believe in a guy and you think (with your coaching), you can turn him into a winner, you take that guy and screw what OTHER people think. Yes, you try and get "value" where you can, but the REAL value will come when that guy puts on the uniform and begins to win games for you, regardless of where he was drafted or where other teams slotted him.

The Chiefs took Tyson Jackson 2 years ago a lot earlier than he was projected but it's who they liked so value/ projections didn't mean crap. Now the Chiefs got a pretty good D and Jackson and Dorsey hold down that front four.

[ Edited by jacklegniner on Mar 30, 2011 at 15:25:20 ]

Originally posted by jacklegniner:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:

Originally posted by rapid4:
We are also in the situation of putting in a new (old) system, so regardless who we draft they will not participate in any OTA's and will probably have a very short training camp. I would not reach and make a need pick, since it won't be much if any help to us. Hang on and wait to see which vet we can get (Kolb, Palmer, Alex, Bulger) who will be NFL-ready right away. Trade down in the first or move up our second-round pick to the end of the first round to take someone, but don't use the #7 pick on the third qb taken.

Disagree that you don't at least strongly consider taking the QB you want at #7. Sure, our first attempt should be to move back a little, get some value for that pick then grab Locker, Ponder or Kap (if those are the guys JH likes) in the middle of the 1st. It might not seem like great value right now, but as they grow and learn the game, the initial perception of "reaching" for these guys goes away.

NFL draft value is all about perception, until you hit the field and perform. So if you believe in a guy and you think (with your coaching), you can turn him into a winner, you take that guy and screw what OTHER people think. Yes, you try and get "value" where you can, but the REAL value will come when that guy puts on the uniform and begins to win games for you, regardless of where he was drafted or where other teams slotted him.

The Chiefs took Tyson Jackson 2 years ago a lot earlier than he was projected but it's who they liked so value/ projections didn't mean crap. Now the Chiefs got a pretty good D and Jackson and Dorsey hold down that front four.

good point

Originally posted by jacklegniner:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:

Originally posted by rapid4:
We are also in the situation of putting in a new (old) system, so regardless who we draft they will not participate in any OTA's and will probably have a very short training camp. I would not reach and make a need pick, since it won't be much if any help to us. Hang on and wait to see which vet we can get (Kolb, Palmer, Alex, Bulger) who will be NFL-ready right away. Trade down in the first or move up our second-round pick to the end of the first round to take someone, but don't use the #7 pick on the third qb taken.

Disagree that you don't at least strongly consider taking the QB you want at #7. Sure, our first attempt should be to move back a little, get some value for that pick then grab Locker, Ponder or Kap (if those are the guys JH likes) in the middle of the 1st. It might not seem like great value right now, but as they grow and learn the game, the initial perception of "reaching" for these guys goes away.

NFL draft value is all about perception, until you hit the field and perform. So if you believe in a guy and you think (with your coaching), you can turn him into a winner, you take that guy and screw what OTHER people think. Yes, you try and get "value" where you can, but the REAL value will come when that guy puts on the uniform and begins to win games for you, regardless of where he was drafted or where other teams slotted him.

The Chiefs took Tyson Jackson 2 years ago a lot earlier than he was projected but it's who they liked so value/ projections didn't mean crap. Now the Chiefs got a pretty good D and Jackson and Dorsey hold down that front four.

Actually Jackson is still developing and has not made Pioli look genius just yet.

But I agree with GoFD's initial post. And I think New England at 33 could be sitting on a gold mine of a pick for QB hungry teams. Between Thursday when round 1 ends and Friday when round 2 begins they should field a lot of phone calls for that pick from at least a few QB needy teams as well as a couple other teams looking to grab another position player who may have slid out of the first.

Originally posted by TheFunkyChicken:

Everyone here seems to think that Harbaugh has some kind of super power that will allow him to draft a stud QB that no one else will be targeting. He will probably be great at coaching whichever QB we get. But we have to assume that any QB Harbaugh likes, other teams will like also.

If we get our future starting QB in this draft no one will be upset no matter how high he's drafted. Even if it's something that sounds totally crazy right now, like Kaepernick at #7. If it works out, it won't be a reach.

Actually, there've been several times when Harbaugh's estimation of QBs coming out of college have run very counter to the conventional wisdom, and in retrospect he's been spot on about the achievers and the flame-outs. With the caveat that past performance does not guarantee future results, my hunch is that he has a couple of players slotted in spots very different from where anyone else will draft them.

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:

Originally posted by TheFunkyChicken:

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
This post assumes that teams who likely aren't able to secure a QB in the early 1st will just sit back and let a QB fall to them in the 2nd. I highly doubt that happens, especially if the CBA hasn't been settled by draft time.

Truth is, these teams (49ers, Titans, Redskins, Vikings, Miami and possibly even teams like Cincy and Arizona who might miss out on Gabbert/Newton) will be fighting like hell to get back in to the late 1st so they can get the guy they want.

Point being, the market will be super hot for QBs that have even the slightest potential as a starter in the NFL, so our best bet is to trade back a little at #7 and get the guy we want early, or just outright pick that guy at #7 and not f**k around.

Finally someone talking some sense!

Everyone here seems to think that Harbaugh has some kind of super power that will allow him to draft a stud QB that no one else will be targeting. He will probably be great at coaching whichever QB we get. But we have to assume that any QB Harbaugh likes, other teams will like also.

If we get our future starting QB in this draft no one will be upset no matter how high he's drafted. Even if it's something that sounds totally crazy right now, like Kaepernick at #7. If it works out, it won't be a reach.

Btw, IMO the players (specifically, this free agent class) have more to gain by having free agency AFTER the draft, knowing teams will likely be more aggressive going after veterans to fill their positions of need (even if they drafted for those positions) as opposed to relying on rookies to step in and play immediately...so I don't see a real motivation from the players side to get the new CBA done anytime soon.

That's an interesting and logical line of reasoning. The players union realizes the FA demand will be heightened by having the draft occur after the draft. Until players start missing organized team activities as part of their contracts, they have no motivation to sign.