Please - no Glenn Coffee this year!

Originally posted by D-Money:

Originally posted by jimbagg:

Originally posted by valrod33:
Dont recall Glen Coffee ever being anything you mentioned on your checklist.

I hear you. None of us know what signals might have been overlooked by the Niners in the Coffee interviews and pre-draft investigation, or what questions that the Niners should have asked, but didn't. Since none of we webzoners get that opportunity to do an actual player interview, I'm trying to identify those things that an attentive, webzone observer might sniff.

Maybe one or more of these criteria would have tripped an alarm on Coffee (missionary, religious calling), maybe not. I'm wide-open to any suggestion of what other criteria might be added to my suggested screening, which might be even more effective in identifying "Coffee-itis", BEFORE the draft.

Not looking for a single "winner" here, more of a gradual compilation of players, in one place, who MIGHT be displaying something less than a 100% commitment to pro ball.

Religious- we drafted this guy in the second round a while back Raheem or something (help) a lb that was Muslim and he couldn't drink water because he was fasting during training camp. He kept getting hurt and fatigued every year. He was evetually cut and you have to believe it's because he had no energy due to the heat/ workouts compromising with his religious beliefs.
Also napoleon Kaufman retired way earlier due to god's calling.
Should it knock guys down teams draft boards for there beliefs. If I'm a GM, I'd have to answer yes, but I still don't know how or if you could even find this info during pre draft interviews.

That knocks out, just generally speaking, a good majority of the african american athletes. Not saying other races aren't predominately religious, but black guys especially from the south are usually pretty religious.(baptist)

Is it really a knock on them? Like any of the other assessments, there are amazing players who just are in love with God too. Certainly enough to outweigh the guys who drop out to answer a "higher calling".

One could argue that young guys like Vick who get in trouble with the law, wouldn't have had they been super religious. In the plaxico case, would you rather have your players walking around with glocks or bibles?

Just saying there could be benefits to a more mature/religious young athlete.

The league should take away our third round draft choice in 2011.... as a courtesy to Niners' fans. Since 2006, here is the master list of "stars":

2006- Brandon Williams
2007- Jason Hill, Ray McDonald
2008- Reggie Smith
2009- Glen Coffee
2010- Navarro Bowman

So, the next time you hear a Niners' fan say, "Trade down and pick up an extra third", all you have to do is show him this mind-altering list. YIKES!!!

You never know where a person's breaking point is. Obviously as the level of competition increases it is harder to maintain one's elite status. Some guys skate all the way through college with natural ability with out every working hard, when they have to work hard to keep up they sulk and quit. Hard to pick these guys out unless you watched them in practice day in and day out.

As a Bama fan I hated the Glenn Coffee pick.

Harder to predict than picking a sleeper-stud in the draft.

Nobody truly knows whats in a man's soul, anybody can fool anybody during an interview.

Originally posted by MadDog49er:
The league should take away our third round draft choice in 2011.... as a courtesy to Niners' fans. Since 2006, here is the master list of "stars":

2006- Brandon Williams
2007- Jason Hill, Ray McDonald
2008- Reggie Smith
2009- Glen Coffee
2010- Navarro Bowman

So, the next time you hear a Niners' fan say, "Trade down and pick up an extra third", all you have to do is show him this mind-altering list. YIKES!!!

The jury is still out on Bowman, I wouldnt say he's a bust this early. Gotta give the kid 3 years to prove himself.

When baby Jesus tell you to leave...you leave

Originally posted by jimbagg:
Don't know how Coffee fooled the Niners during his pre-draft contact, regarding his lack of commitment to pro football. But, I sure don't ever want to see the club waste another draft pick in such fashion.

Therefore, I dedicate this thread to the webzone compiling a list of draft-eligible players, who might fall into the Glen Coffee-like mode. These are players who might pass the "look" test, but who don't pass the "smell" or motivation tests. No, we aren't privy to the face-to-face interviews, nor can we interview the player's college coaches on this matter, but the webzone has its share of knowledgeable observers. Who are the noteworthy, potential draftees who display one or more of the following:

take plays off,
play soft on occasion,
use minor injuries as an excuse to miss practices or even games,
are rumored to lack teammate respect, display prima-dona behavior
are rumored to interview poorly,
have already developed outside business interests (music, clothes, missionary, etc)

The obvious starting point for me is the 'icon" himself, Cam Newton. Feel free to add to this list, especially if you live in a college town, where you have had the ability to observe a particular athlete throughout his college career, and where you have had the ability to hear the rumors circulating around the community.

None of your questions would have caught Coffee. He was fine in all those ways. You missed the important question that SHOULD have been asked. Which is, Do you love to play the game of football?

Originally posted by D-Money:

Originally posted by jimbagg:

Originally posted by valrod33:
Dont recall Glen Coffee ever being anything you mentioned on your checklist.

I hear you. None of us know what signals might have been overlooked by the Niners in the Coffee interviews and pre-draft investigation, or what questions that the Niners should have asked, but didn't. Since none of we webzoners get that opportunity to do an actual player interview, I'm trying to identify those things that an attentive, webzone observer might sniff.

Maybe one or more of these criteria would have tripped an alarm on Coffee (missionary, religious calling), maybe not. I'm wide-open to any suggestion of what other criteria might be added to my suggested screening, which might be even more effective in identifying "Coffee-itis", BEFORE the draft.

Not looking for a single "winner" here, more of a gradual compilation of players, in one place, who MIGHT be displaying something less than a 100% commitment to pro ball.

Religious- we drafted this guy in the second round a while back Raheem or something (help) a lb that was Muslim and he couldn't drink water because he was fasting during training camp. He kept getting hurt and fatigued every year. He was evetually cut and you have to believe it's because he had no energy due to the heat/ workouts compromising with his religious beliefs.
Also napoleon Kaufman retired way earlier due to god's calling.
Should it knock guys down teams draft boards for there beliefs. If I'm a GM, I'd have to answer yes, but I still don't know how or if you could even find this info during pre draft interviews.

I believe that you are referring to Saleem Rasheed, a 3rd ound pick in 2002. Rasheed was a devout Muslim, who refused all food and water during the Ramadan season, which affected his strength, stamina and durability. Rasheed was a star SEC LB at Alabama, as I recall. He didn't lack commitment to pro ball, but it's importance was subservient to other more profound priorities in his life. Not saying that he made a wrong decision (I applaud his religious dedication), but, if you are the Niner GM, would you spend a 3rd round pick on someone, who clearly had higher priorities than pro ball?

I believe that a club's picks in the first 3 rounds should be rock solid guys, destined for at least 5-7 year careers. Take your risks in Round 4 or later.

Here's another from the wayback machine. In Round 2 of the 1984 draft, the venerable Bill Walsh selected TE John Frank from Ohio State. Frank was a brilliant guy, who told teams up front that he wouldn't play pro ball for long, as he wanted to attend med school. Frank did as promised. He played only a few years for the Niners (in stellar fashion), then went off to med school and has become a renowned physician. Walsh clearly felt that spending a #2 on such a short-timer was worth it. But that was a different era, when Eddie D could and would go out and buy whatever Bill Walsh wanted (Like Russ Francis and Charle Young as other TE's). Would spending a #2 pick on such a short-timer be wise in today's NFL?

And then there is the aforementioned Rashaun Woods, the #1 pick in 2004. Woods wasn't so much a bust on the talent front, as a bust on the motivational front. His passion was fishin', not receivin'. He let minor injuries stall his career and didn't seem too upset that he flopped. BTW, there was a second motivational question mark in that same draft, 3rd rounder Derrick Hamilton, who suffered from the same affliction. This surely was the draft that got Donahue fired, and rightly so. Just want to believe that the club has learned from these past mistakes. Even with new people making the decisions, ignoring the mistakes of the past, will doom the club to repeating those same mistakes.

So keep the tread going here, if someone sees a TOP 100 prospect, who might be questionable on the motivation and commitment front.

Originally posted by MadDog49er:
The league should take away our third round draft choice in 2011.... as a courtesy to Niners' fans. Since 2006, here is the master list of "stars":

2006- Brandon Williams
2007- Jason Hill, Ray McDonald
2008- Reggie Smith
2009- Glen Coffee
2010- Navarro Bowman

So, the next time you hear a Niners' fan say, "Trade down and pick up an extra third", all you have to do is show him this mind-altering list. YIKES!!!

Williams is the only guy on that list I had reservations about. Smith and McDonald are at least serviceable at their positions, Hill should still be with the team but for Singletary's misjudgement and Bowman was a rookie who shows promise. If Smith and Bowman do not improve this year then you may have a point.

But, if you look round by round, the draft is a crapshoot in the first and second rounds, and down hill afterwards...could it be our organization?

Draft list

Edit: Now I'm really depressed--after looking at the drafts over the last decade. Seeing Smiley gone, Kosier doing well in Dallas, and even Brandon Lloyd tearing it up (one year wonder?). Good grief! We have selected a lot of dead wood!

[ Edited by dtg_9er on Mar 22, 2011 at 15:44:53 ]