If I was GM trade scenario for Kevin Kolb

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by Travisty13:
1. Kolb sucks.
2. The draft value chart is not actually used by NFL teams. Its an out of date, pointless chart.
3. I'm glad you are not our GM

And you know this, how???

Updating the NFL Draft Trade Value Chart

Quote:
First, the economics of draft picks has changed drastically over the years. The value of picks at the top of the drafts have diminished as the salary cap costs have risen.

For example, the number one overall pick in the 2008 draft, Jake Long, received a contract making him one of the highest paid offensive tackles without ever playing a down. The salary cap era also increased the value of the later round picks as well because those players are less expensive than veterans.

Secondly, the players at the top of the draft only hold a lofty value if the players available in those slots are worth the value.

The bold mainly says "The TVC is out of date. The value it says a pick is, doesn't equal it's true value".
The TVC is just a guideline. It's not gospel. For example last year. To move up from the 13th pick to #11, we traded our 5th Rd. pick #113 for (TVC value:68) to move up, which is a TVC difference of 100 points. So the real value, determined by Denver, to be 68 points. But according to the "TVC" we should have probably given them our #113, #224 pick (valued:2;Phillip Adams) and either/or #173 (valued:22.8;Anthony Dixon) or #182 (valued 18.6;Nate Byham).
So that means the TVC is off. Ironically, Phillip Adams, pick #224 is the lowest and last value of TVC at a value of 2. So how much is George Selvie, picked 2 picks later, valued? Comp. picks have thrown this chart off.

Understanding True Trade Value

Quote:
Myth 3: "The Trade Value Chart"

One of the dumbest things that I have ever seen in regards to the draft is the Trade Value Chart (TVC). If you don't know about it is essentially a chart of values for each pick in the draft that was invented by Jimmy Johnson a while ago. Essentially if you want to trade for the 8th overall pick (which is worth 1,400 points) then you will have to accumulate enough combination of draft picks/player to hit 1,400. So if you are picking 20th and want to move to 8th you have to theoretically pay with your 1st, 2nd and 3rd round picks to equal 1,400. When was the last time that you heard about a team trading their 1st, 2nd and 3rd rounders to move up that high? There is a reason, and that is because it is ridiculous.

Trading for a draft pick is a sellers market. Economics 101, price is reflective of supply and demand. Saying the #7 pick is worth 1500 points, is just a guideline. Not a reflection of it's true value. So saying we can put together picks of #7, #45, and #76, and we will get the eagles #23, #54, #85 and Kevin Kolb. Our 3 picks equal 2160, the Eagles 3 picks equal 1285. A difference of 875 points, according to the TVC. That would give Kevin Kolb a value of 875 points or equivalent of the #19 pick.

But again, if he's viewed by another team at more value (lets say the Cardinals), and they trade the #5 pick for Kolb, that would value him at 1700. Therefore you can't make an argue including players/picks into a trade and say it'll work because of the TVC says so.

Taking what TexasNiner says:

Originally posted by TexasNiner:
Also, you can't just add the "chart value" of the moves up and think the total is equal to a pick of that "value".

That would be like you telling me you want $100 to sell something and I offer you $30 cash, a baseball card worth $50 and a coupon that saves you $20. Sure, there might be $100 of "value" there, but it's not the same as $100.

Again its about supply and demand. The Eagles hold the cards when determining the value of Kolb. Not us, "the buyers". So therefore the TVC is pointless in this.

FYI: Sorry for the loooooonnng post.

[ Edited by Travisty13 on Mar 19, 2011 at 01:37:13 ]

Originally posted by Travisty13:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by Travisty13:
1. Kolb sucks.
2. The draft value chart is not actually used by NFL teams. Its an out of date, pointless chart.
3. I'm glad you are not our GM

And you know this, how???

Updating the NFL Draft Trade Value Chart

Quote:
First, the economics of draft picks has changed drastically over the years. The value of picks at the top of the drafts have diminished as the salary cap costs have risen.

For example, the number one overall pick in the 2008 draft, Jake Long, received a contract making him one of the highest paid offensive tackles without ever playing a down. The salary cap era also increased the value of the later round picks as well because those players are less expensive than veterans.

Secondly, the players at the top of the draft only hold a lofty value if the players available in those slots are worth the value.

The bold mainly says "The TVC is out of date. The value it says a pick is, doesn't equal it's true value".
The TVC is just a guideline. It's not gospel. For example last year. To move up from the 13th pick to #11, we traded our 5th Rd. pick #113 for (TVC value:68) to move up, which is a TVC difference of 100 points. So the real value, determined by Denver, to be 68 points. But according to the "TVC" we should have probably given them our #113, #224 pick (valued:2;Phillip Adams) and either/or #173 (valued:22.8;Anthony Dixon) or #182 (valued 18.6;Nate Byham).
So that means the TVC is off. Ironically, Phillip Adams, pick #224 is the lowest and last value of TVC at a value of 2. So how much is George Selvie, picked 2 picks later, valued? Comp. picks have thrown this chart off.

Understanding True Trade Value

Quote:
Myth 3: "The Trade Value Chart"

One of the dumbest things that I have ever seen in regards to the draft is the Trade Value Chart (TVC). If you don't know about it is essentially a chart of values for each pick in the draft that was invented by Jimmy Johnson a while ago. Essentially if you want to trade for the 8th overall pick (which is worth 1,400 points) then you will have to accumulate enough combination of draft picks/player to hit 1,400. So if you are picking 20th and want to move to 8th you have to theoretically pay with your 1st, 2nd and 3rd round picks to equal 1,400. When was the last time that you heard about a team trading their 1st, 2nd and 3rd rounders to move up that high? There is a reason, and that is because it is ridiculous.

Trading for a draft pick is a sellers market. Economics 101, price is reflective of supply and demand. Saying the #7 pick is worth 1500 points, is just a guideline. Not a reflection of it's true value. So saying we can put together picks of #7, #45, and #76, and we will get the eagles #23, #54, #85 and Kevin Kolb. Our 3 picks equal 2160, the Eagles 3 picks equal 1285. A difference of 875 points, according to the TVC. That would give Kevin Kolb a value of 875 points or equivalent of the #19 pick.

But again, if he's viewed by another team at more value (lets say the Cardinals), and they trade the #5 pick for Kolb, that would value him at 1700. Therefore you can't make an argue including players/picks into a trade and say it'll work because of the TVC says so.

Taking what TexasNiner says:

Originally posted by TexasNiner:
Also, you can't just add the "chart value" of the moves up and think the total is equal to a pick of that "value".

That would be like you telling me you want $100 to sell something and I offer you $30 cash, a baseball card worth $50 and a coupon that saves you $20. Sure, there might be $100 of "value" there, but it's not the same as $100.

Again its about supply and demand. The Eagles hold the cards when determining the value of Kolb. Not us, "the buyers". So therefore the TVC is pointless in this.

FYI: Sorry for the loooooonnng post.

Quote:
ESPN.com has the draft value chart many NFL teams use to help determine what's a fair trade. Of course, teams may give a little or get a little to make deals happen. But this should give you a general idea of what teams are thinking.

Link

Quote:
Looking at teams that pick in various spots throughout the second round -- as well as at the top of Round 3 -- here are five moves that would make sense. These proposed trades are based on the traditional draft value chart that most teams use.

Link

Given Kolb was a 2nd rd pick and has had an up and down career w/Eagles, I wouldn't give anything higher than a 2nd rd pick for him. I'm sure Andy Reid's already chuckling to himself...let the bidding begin. Some foolheardy team may give up a 1st rounder or multiple picks...and if so, then let 'em have him.

Originally posted by CorvaNinerFan:
Given Kolb was a 2nd rd pick and has had an up and down career w/Eagles, I wouldn't give anything higher than a 2nd rd pick for him. I'm sure Andy Reid's already chuckling to himself...let the bidding begin. Some foolheardy team may give up a 1st rounder or multiple picks...and if so, then let 'em have him.

would u give a 2nd for alex? they both have same career passer rating despite eagles having better coach, better WR, better o line consistant system

kolb isnt just not worth anything more than a 3rd

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Quote:
ESPN.com has the draft value chart many NFL teams use to help determine what's a fair trade. Of course, teams may give a little or get a little to make deals happen. But this should give you a general idea of what teams are thinking.

Link

Quote:
Looking at teams that pick in various spots throughout the second round -- as well as at the top of Round 3 -- here are five moves that would make sense. These proposed trades are based on the traditional draft value chart that most teams use.

Link

The first quote you gave says "It's just a general idea", like I had mentioned, it's just a guideline. It's not accurate. Also, it says "many" teams use it. Not "all" teams. How do we know that us and the eagles aren't one of the few teams that don't use it. It's not a basis to propose a trade. How many times do you hear about a team trading up, and asked why they made the trade their answer was "well if you look at the TVC, you can see what got heck of a deal" never. Cause it's not the law by which trades are made. Again it's just a guideline. It's still out of date. And not as accurate as it's made out to be by media and message board types.

Kevin Kolb to the niner zone reminds me of the definition of an expert. That's a consultant from out of town.

This guy in the past 49ers offense would make AS look like an expert.

Originally posted by Travisty13:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by Travisty13:
1. Kolb sucks.
2. The draft value chart is not actually used by NFL teams. Its an out of date, pointless chart.
3. I'm glad you are not our GM

And you know this, how???

Updating the NFL Draft Trade Value Chart

Quote:
First, the economics of draft picks has changed drastically over the years. The value of picks at the top of the drafts have diminished as the salary cap costs have risen.

For example, the number one overall pick in the 2008 draft, Jake Long, received a contract making him one of the highest paid offensive tackles without ever playing a down. The salary cap era also increased the value of the later round picks as well because those players are less expensive than veterans.

Secondly, the players at the top of the draft only hold a lofty value if the players available in those slots are worth the value.

The bold mainly says "The TVC is out of date. The value it says a pick is, doesn't equal it's true value".
The TVC is just a guideline. It's not gospel. For example last year. To move up from the 13th pick to #11, we traded our 5th Rd. pick #113 for (TVC value:68) to move up, which is a TVC difference of 100 points. So the real value, determined by Denver, to be 68 points. But according to the "TVC" we should have probably given them our #113, #224 pick (valued:2;Phillip Adams) and either/or #173 (valued:22.8;Anthony Dixon) or #182 (valued 18.6;Nate Byham).
So that means the TVC is off. Ironically, Phillip Adams, pick #224 is the lowest and last value of TVC at a value of 2. So how much is George Selvie, picked 2 picks later, valued? Comp. picks have thrown this chart off.

Understanding True Trade Value

Quote:
Myth 3: "The Trade Value Chart"

One of the dumbest things that I have ever seen in regards to the draft is the Trade Value Chart (TVC). If you don't know about it is essentially a chart of values for each pick in the draft that was invented by Jimmy Johnson a while ago. Essentially if you want to trade for the 8th overall pick (which is worth 1,400 points) then you will have to accumulate enough combination of draft picks/player to hit 1,400. So if you are picking 20th and want to move to 8th you have to theoretically pay with your 1st, 2nd and 3rd round picks to equal 1,400. When was the last time that you heard about a team trading their 1st, 2nd and 3rd rounders to move up that high? There is a reason, and that is because it is ridiculous.

Trading for a draft pick is a sellers market. Economics 101, price is reflective of supply and demand. Saying the #7 pick is worth 1500 points, is just a guideline. Not a reflection of it's true value. So saying we can put together picks of #7, #45, and #76, and we will get the eagles #23, #54, #85 and Kevin Kolb. Our 3 picks equal 2160, the Eagles 3 picks equal 1285. A difference of 875 points, according to the TVC. That would give Kevin Kolb a value of 875 points or equivalent of the #19 pick.

But again, if he's viewed by another team at more value (lets say the Cardinals), and they trade the #5 pick for Kolb, that would value him at 1700. Therefore you can't make an argue including players/picks into a trade and say it'll work because of the TVC says so.

Taking what TexasNiner says:

Originally posted by TexasNiner:
Also, you can't just add the "chart value" of the moves up and think the total is equal to a pick of that "value".

That would be like you telling me you want $100 to sell something and I offer you $30 cash, a baseball card worth $50 and a coupon that saves you $20. Sure, there might be $100 of "value" there, but it's not the same as $100.

Again its about supply and demand. The Eagles hold the cards when determining the value of Kolb. Not us, "the buyers". So therefore the TVC is pointless in this.

FYI: Sorry for the loooooonnng post.

Actually, we traded Denver our 4th rounder to move up.we gave up the 5th for Ginn
And I do agee that the TVC is what one makes it, not written is stone.

[ Edited by highway49 on Mar 19, 2011 at 15:50:37 ]

Originally posted by highway49:

Originally posted by Travisty13:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by Travisty13:
1. Kolb sucks.
2. The draft value chart is not actually used by NFL teams. Its an out of date, pointless chart.
3. I'm glad you are not our GM

And you know this, how???

Updating the NFL Draft Trade Value Chart

Quote:
First, the economics of draft picks has changed drastically over the years. The value of picks at the top of the drafts have diminished as the salary cap costs have risen.

For example, the number one overall pick in the 2008 draft, Jake Long, received a contract making him one of the highest paid offensive tackles without ever playing a down. The salary cap era also increased the value of the later round picks as well because those players are less expensive than veterans.

Secondly, the players at the top of the draft only hold a lofty value if the players available in those slots are worth the value.

The bold mainly says "The TVC is out of date. The value it says a pick is, doesn't equal it's true value".
The TVC is just a guideline. It's not gospel. For example last year. To move up from the 13th pick to #11, we traded our 5th Rd. pick #113 for (TVC value:68) to move up, which is a TVC difference of 100 points. So the real value, determined by Denver, to be 68 points. But according to the "TVC" we should have probably given them our #113, #224 pick (valued:2;Phillip Adams) and either/or #173 (valued:22.8;Anthony Dixon) or #182 (valued 18.6;Nate Byham).
So that means the TVC is off. Ironically, Phillip Adams, pick #224 is the lowest and last value of TVC at a value of 2. So how much is George Selvie, picked 2 picks later, valued? Comp. picks have thrown this chart off.

Understanding True Trade Value

Quote:
Myth 3: "The Trade Value Chart"

One of the dumbest things that I have ever seen in regards to the draft is the Trade Value Chart (TVC). If you don't know about it is essentially a chart of values for each pick in the draft that was invented by Jimmy Johnson a while ago. Essentially if you want to trade for the 8th overall pick (which is worth 1,400 points) then you will have to accumulate enough combination of draft picks/player to hit 1,400. So if you are picking 20th and want to move to 8th you have to theoretically pay with your 1st, 2nd and 3rd round picks to equal 1,400. When was the last time that you heard about a team trading their 1st, 2nd and 3rd rounders to move up that high? There is a reason, and that is because it is ridiculous.

Trading for a draft pick is a sellers market. Economics 101, price is reflective of supply and demand. Saying the #7 pick is worth 1500 points, is just a guideline. Not a reflection of it's true value. So saying we can put together picks of #7, #45, and #76, and we will get the eagles #23, #54, #85 and Kevin Kolb. Our 3 picks equal 2160, the Eagles 3 picks equal 1285. A difference of 875 points, according to the TVC. That would give Kevin Kolb a value of 875 points or equivalent of the #19 pick.

But again, if he's viewed by another team at more value (lets say the Cardinals), and they trade the #5 pick for Kolb, that would value him at 1700. Therefore you can't make an argue including players/picks into a trade and say it'll work because of the TVC says so.

Taking what TexasNiner says:

Originally posted by TexasNiner:
Also, you can't just add the "chart value" of the moves up and think the total is equal to a pick of that "value".

That would be like you telling me you want $100 to sell something and I offer you $30 cash, a baseball card worth $50 and a coupon that saves you $20. Sure, there might be $100 of "value" there, but it's not the same as $100.

Again its about supply and demand. The Eagles hold the cards when determining the value of Kolb. Not us, "the buyers". So therefore the TVC is pointless in this.

FYI: Sorry for the loooooonnng post.

Actually, we traded Denver our 4th rounder to move up.we gave up the 5th for Ginn
And I do agee that the TVC is what one makes it, not written is stone.

My apologizes, but #113 is still the same value according to the TVC. Yeah, what bugs me is people saying a trade can go down because the TVC says so. Like you said, it can be interrupted in any way for a trade.

Originally posted by Travisty13:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Quote:
ESPN.com has the draft value chart many NFL teams use to help determine what's a fair trade. Of course, teams may give a little or get a little to make deals happen. But this should give you a general idea of what teams are thinking.

Link

Quote:
Looking at teams that pick in various spots throughout the second round -- as well as at the top of Round 3 -- here are five moves that would make sense. These proposed trades are based on the traditional draft value chart that most teams use.

Link

The first quote you gave says "It's just a general idea", like I had mentioned, it's just a guideline. It's not accurate. Also, it says "many" teams use it. Not "all" teams. How do we know that us and the eagles aren't one of the few teams that don't use it. It's not a basis to propose a trade. How many times do you hear about a team trading up, and asked why they made the trade their answer was "well if you look at the TVC, you can see what got heck of a deal" never. Cause it's not the law by which trades are made. Again it's just a guideline. It's still out of date. And not as accurate as it's made out to be by media and message board types.

Your ignoring the fact that sources other than the Bleacher report has said, teams use the TVC to determine a fair trade. I'm just going by from what you stated earlier that teams don't use it anymore, and you still haven't provided a link saying they don't. If the TVC is a guideline, then that should be an indication that teams do in fact use the TVC.

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by Travisty13:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Quote:
ESPN.com has the draft value chart many NFL teams use to help determine what's a fair trade. Of course, teams may give a little or get a little to make deals happen. But this should give you a general idea of what teams are thinking.

Link

Quote:
Looking at teams that pick in various spots throughout the second round -- as well as at the top of Round 3 -- here are five moves that would make sense. These proposed trades are based on the traditional draft value chart that most teams use.

Link

The first quote you gave says "It's just a general idea", like I had mentioned, it's just a guideline. It's not accurate. Also, it says "many" teams use it. Not "all" teams. How do we know that us and the eagles aren't one of the few teams that don't use it. It's not a basis to propose a trade. How many times do you hear about a team trading up, and asked why they made the trade their answer was "well if you look at the TVC, you can see what got heck of a deal" never. Cause it's not the law by which trades are made. Again it's just a guideline. It's still out of date. And not as accurate as it's made out to be by media and message board types.

Your ignoring the fact that sources other than the Bleacher report has said, teams use the TVC to determine a fair trade. I'm just going by from what you stated earlier that teams don't use it anymore, and you still haven't provided a link saying they don't. If the TVC is a guideline, then that should be an indication that teams do in fact use the TVC.

The 2nd link I provided has no association with Bleacher Report. If you google Trade Value Chart, the only website that speaks so highly of it still is ESPN (which is one of your links) and you provided a Gil Brandt link which is a Jimmy Johnson and Cowboy fanboy. Coincidentally, the TVC originated from the Cowboys's Jimmy Johnson era. So of course Brandt would still be talking about it. You've yet to provide a link saying its still in effect. With the inflation of rookie salaries, the scale is off. Therefore my point was "it is out of date". You can't base your trades on it, just because it was used in the mid-90s. Draft picks vary in value. Its not set in stone. Again, we both can a agree it can be used as a guideline, not the true value of a draft pick.

The Bills don't seem to put much stock into the TVC as everyone else does. Again, they just seem to use it as a guideline. Not the rule.http://sportifi.com/news/Bills-not-big-on-draft-value-chart-824125.html

Quote:
We do look at it, but I don’t,” said Nix. ”Somebody else does and tells me. Who knows whether it’s good or not. It’s probably a good thing to start with and then you decide what the value of the guy you’ve got and where you go with it.

Chief's Scott Pioli isn't a big fan neither.
http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?p=6697085

Quote:
Chiefs GM Scott Pioli Says Trade Chart Is Outdated

by Joel Thorman on Apr 22, 2010 1:00 PM PDT in 2010 Draft 88 comments, 88 new

We've talked on occasion about the trade value chart. It's essentially a chart developed years ago that gives a point value for each draft pick and outlines what's needed to make a trade.

It used to be the way trades were facilitated in the NFL.

However, as Chiefs GM Scott Pioli explained today on KCChiefs.com, the financial ramifications of a top pick are not reflected in the chart.

"Everyone has a trade value sheet," he said. "Years ago, I remember when I first was in draft rooms, watching people with the numbers and going down the list saying 'If we trade this pick, it gives us X points, and then they'll give us Y and Z but those are still 200 points behind where we want to be.'

"Conceptually," he continued, "that was a great idea in the past. In recent years, the trade charts never took into account the cost of picks from a financial standpoint. That was something that was missing."

Pioli says he tried to create a new chart while in New England with the finances accurately reflected in the point value of each pick but ultimately couldn't come up with a chart that works.

"You can look at different models and systems but at the end of the day you have to sit there and think, 'How much do we want that player?'"

Pioli was part of the Patriots that made 29 trades with draft picks and nearly two-thirds of the league so make no bones about it - he likes to make trades.

"I love to trade because I think it creates opportunity."

Now, about that trade partner....

[ Edited by Travisty13 on Mar 19, 2011 at 21:13:24 ]

Originally posted by Travisty13:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by Travisty13:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Quote:
ESPN.com has the draft value chart many NFL teams use to help determine what's a fair trade. Of course, teams may give a little or get a little to make deals happen. But this should give you a general idea of what teams are thinking.

Link

Quote:
Looking at teams that pick in various spots throughout the second round -- as well as at the top of Round 3 -- here are five moves that would make sense. These proposed trades are based on the traditional draft value chart that most teams use.

Link

The first quote you gave says "It's just a general idea", like I had mentioned, it's just a guideline. It's not accurate. Also, it says "many" teams use it. Not "all" teams. How do we know that us and the eagles aren't one of the few teams that don't use it. It's not a basis to propose a trade. How many times do you hear about a team trading up, and asked why they made the trade their answer was "well if you look at the TVC, you can see what got heck of a deal" never. Cause it's not the law by which trades are made. Again it's just a guideline. It's still out of date. And not as accurate as it's made out to be by media and message board types.

Your ignoring the fact that sources other than the Bleacher report has said, teams use the TVC to determine a fair trade. I'm just going by from what you stated earlier that teams don't use it anymore, and you still haven't provided a link saying they don't. If the TVC is a guideline, then that should be an indication that teams do in fact use the TVC.

The 2nd link I provided has no association with Bleacher Report. If you google Trade Value Chart, the only website that speaks so highly of it still is ESPN (which is one of your links) and you provided a Gil Brandt link which is a Jimmy Johnson and Cowboy fanboy. Coincidentally, the TVC originated from the Cowboys's Jimmy Johnson era. So of course Brandt would still be talking about it. You've yet to provide a link saying its still in effect. With the inflation of rookie salaries, the scale is off. Therefore my point was "it is out of date". You can't base your trades on it, just because it was used in the mid-90s. Draft picks vary in value. Its not set in stone. Again, we both can a agree it can be used as a guideline, not the true value of a draft pick.

Wow so your calling my links bias towards the TVC, what the.....BTW, the links were in reference to just last season and the season before.

My goodness is it so hard to say, I was wrong and that teams still use a TVC.

Its not like we had out awards to the people who get the most arguments right.

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by Travisty13:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by Travisty13:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Quote:
ESPN.com has the draft value chart many NFL teams use to help determine what's a fair trade. Of course, teams may give a little or get a little to make deals happen. But this should give you a general idea of what teams are thinking.

Link

Quote:
Looking at teams that pick in various spots throughout the second round -- as well as at the top of Round 3 -- here are five moves that would make sense. These proposed trades are based on the traditional draft value chart that most teams use.

Link

The first quote you gave says "It's just a general idea", like I had mentioned, it's just a guideline. It's not accurate. Also, it says "many" teams use it. Not "all" teams. How do we know that us and the eagles aren't one of the few teams that don't use it. It's not a basis to propose a trade. How many times do you hear about a team trading up, and asked why they made the trade their answer was "well if you look at the TVC, you can see what got heck of a deal" never. Cause it's not the law by which trades are made. Again it's just a guideline. It's still out of date. And not as accurate as it's made out to be by media and message board types.

Your ignoring the fact that sources other than the Bleacher report has said, teams use the TVC to determine a fair trade. I'm just going by from what you stated earlier that teams don't use it anymore, and you still haven't provided a link saying they don't. If the TVC is a guideline, then that should be an indication that teams do in fact use the TVC.

The 2nd link I provided has no association with Bleacher Report. If you google Trade Value Chart, the only website that speaks so highly of it still is ESPN (which is one of your links) and you provided a Gil Brandt link which is a Jimmy Johnson and Cowboy fanboy. Coincidentally, the TVC originated from the Cowboys's Jimmy Johnson era. So of course Brandt would still be talking about it. You've yet to provide a link saying its still in effect. With the inflation of rookie salaries, the scale is off. Therefore my point was "it is out of date". You can't base your trades on it, just because it was used in the mid-90s. Draft picks vary in value. Its not set in stone. Again, we both can a agree it can be used as a guideline, not the true value of a draft pick.

Wow so your calling my links bias towards the TVC, what the.....BTW, the links were in reference to just last season and the season before.

My goodness is it so hard to say, I was wrong and that teams still use a TVC.

Its not like we had out awards to the people who get the most arguments right.

So what have i been getting in the mail every week???

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by Travisty13:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by Travisty13:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Quote:
ESPN.com has the draft value chart many NFL teams use to help determine what's a fair trade. Of course, teams may give a little or get a little to make deals happen. But this should give you a general idea of what teams are thinking.

Link

Quote:
Looking at teams that pick in various spots throughout the second round -- as well as at the top of Round 3 -- here are five moves that would make sense. These proposed trades are based on the traditional draft value chart that most teams use.

Link

The first quote you gave says "It's just a general idea", like I had mentioned, it's just a guideline. It's not accurate. Also, it says "many" teams use it. Not "all" teams. How do we know that us and the eagles aren't one of the few teams that don't use it. It's not a basis to propose a trade. How many times do you hear about a team trading up, and asked why they made the trade their answer was "well if you look at the TVC, you can see what got heck of a deal" never. Cause it's not the law by which trades are made. Again it's just a guideline. It's still out of date. And not as accurate as it's made out to be by media and message board types.

Your ignoring the fact that sources other than the Bleacher report has said, teams use the TVC to determine a fair trade. I'm just going by from what you stated earlier that teams don't use it anymore, and you still haven't provided a link saying they don't. If the TVC is a guideline, then that should be an indication that teams do in fact use the TVC.

The 2nd link I provided has no association with Bleacher Report. If you google Trade Value Chart, the only website that speaks so highly of it still is ESPN (which is one of your links) and you provided a Gil Brandt link which is a Jimmy Johnson and Cowboy fanboy. Coincidentally, the TVC originated from the Cowboys's Jimmy Johnson era. So of course Brandt would still be talking about it. You've yet to provide a link saying its still in effect. With the inflation of rookie salaries, the scale is off. Therefore my point was "it is out of date". You can't base your trades on it, just because it was used in the mid-90s. Draft picks vary in value. Its not set in stone. Again, we both can a agree it can be used as a guideline, not the true value of a draft pick.

Wow so your calling my links bias towards the TVC, what the.....BTW, the links were in reference to just last season and the season before.

My goodness is it so hard to say, I was wrong and that teams still use a TVC.

Its not like we had out awards to the people who get the most arguments right.

Kolohe, I've actually quite enjoyed this debate about the TVC. Lol. But I'll give in and say it. You are correct, some teams do still refer to the TVC when making a trade. But you have to agree, it is out of date. But see, this is why the WZ is great. In a Kolb thread, we didn't debate if he was good or bad or merited any of our picks. We debated the TVC thoroughly and from both sides. So I tip my hat to you. Good job man.
Fyi, I hope that isn't taken in a sarcastic way. Its not meant to be at all.

Originally posted by Travisty13:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by Travisty13:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Originally posted by Travisty13:

Originally posted by Kolohe:

Quote:
ESPN.com has the draft value chart many NFL teams use to help determine what's a fair trade. Of course, teams may give a little or get a little to make deals happen. But this should give you a general idea of what teams are thinking.

Link

Quote:
Looking at teams that pick in various spots throughout the second round -- as well as at the top of Round 3 -- here are five moves that would make sense. These proposed trades are based on the traditional draft value chart that most teams use.

Link

The first quote you gave says "It's just a general idea", like I had mentioned, it's just a guideline. It's not accurate. Also, it says "many" teams use it. Not "all" teams. How do we know that us and the eagles aren't one of the few teams that don't use it. It's not a basis to propose a trade. How many times do you hear about a team trading up, and asked why they made the trade their answer was "well if you look at the TVC, you can see what got heck of a deal" never. Cause it's not the law by which trades are made. Again it's just a guideline. It's still out of date. And not as accurate as it's made out to be by media and message board types.

Your ignoring the fact that sources other than the Bleacher report has said, teams use the TVC to determine a fair trade. I'm just going by from what you stated earlier that teams don't use it anymore, and you still haven't provided a link saying they don't. If the TVC is a guideline, then that should be an indication that teams do in fact use the TVC.

The 2nd link I provided has no association with Bleacher Report. If you google Trade Value Chart, the only website that speaks so highly of it still is ESPN (which is one of your links) and you provided a Gil Brandt link which is a Jimmy Johnson and Cowboy fanboy. Coincidentally, the TVC originated from the Cowboys's Jimmy Johnson era. So of course Brandt would still be talking about it. You've yet to provide a link saying its still in effect. With the inflation of rookie salaries, the scale is off. Therefore my point was "it is out of date". You can't base your trades on it, just because it was used in the mid-90s. Draft picks vary in value. Its not set in stone. Again, we both can a agree it can be used as a guideline, not the true value of a draft pick.

Wow so your calling my links bias towards the TVC, what the.....BTW, the links were in reference to just last season and the season before.

My goodness is it so hard to say, I was wrong and that teams still use a TVC.

Its not like we had out awards to the people who get the most arguments right.

Kolohe, I've actually quite enjoyed this debate about the TVC. Lol. But I'll give in and say it. You are correct, some teams do still refer to the TVC when making a trade. But you have to agree, it is out of date. But see, this is why the WZ is great. In a Kolb thread, we didn't debate if he was good or bad or merited any of our picks. We debated the TVC thoroughly and from both sides. So I tip my hat to you. Good job man.
Fyi, I hope that isn't taken in a sarcastic way. Its not meant to be at all.

Wow the bigger man.^^^^

......I was wrong.

And no, that also wasn't a sarcastic remark.