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The Official Draft Two Offensive Linemen in the first round thread.

Originally posted by 9erred:
Webzoners need to read or re read The Winning Edge by Bill Walsh. He ranks what positions should be taken by rounds.

Left Tackles should be taken in round 1, Right tackles can be had in later rounds.

Guards should not be taken in the first few rounds.

1st round picks are reserved for DL or in the 3-4 rush OLB, shut down corner, WR, QB and Left tackle, note I did not say a right tackle.

I personally would have no problem with going for the best pass rusher at OLB and a shut down corner or FS in round 1, and a RT in round 2 or beyond.

I would say take a RT in this situation if only to finally get an fair anaylsis on Alex Smith. If we get a RT there's really no excuses left for him. No way we should address OL with both 1st rounders though.

OG is definitely not worthy of a #17 pick. Isn't the best Guard in this draft a mauler who still has to learn the technique of the position? Isn't that Baas' exact problem? Why would we replace Baas with mini-Baas? I can't see it happening with a mid-1st round pick, especially in this draft.

I could be wrong but in my opinion this draft is very deep at the 2nd and 3rd tier, Guard could be considered a need but is it important enough to pass on an impact player?

The last time we drafted for need was Kentwan Balmer. Iupati or any other Guard in this draft would also take a year or two to become productive.
[ Edited by foreign49er on Feb 10, 2010 at 9:17 AM ]
Originally posted by glorydayz:
Originally posted by English:
Originally posted by glorydayz:
So you would be pissed if we traded our two first rounders to move up to get Berry while drafting say Lupati in the second and moving him or Rachel to RT?

Flawed question IMO. Can't see Iupati lasting until the 2nd. And why move him to tackle? That's a no

How is this a flawed question? Iupati (as you spelled it, I have no idea what his name is) is not a sure first round pick unless he explodes at the combine.

So you believe we should move rachel to RT?

You may not have watched any of Iupati in college or in the Senior Bowl, but the guy is pretty much unstoppable at the guard position. He still does have a lot to learn, but his quick feet, along with his size at 6'5" 325 and long arms may also give him the ability to slide to RT some time in his career.

He is a sure fire, late 1st-round pick. Best guard prospect to come out in years.
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by ninertico:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
I just think it's important to note that in this last Super Bowl, neither the Colts or the Saints had a 1st round o-lineman as a starter. In fact, I think between the 2 teams, there's was maybe only one 2nd rounder (Saints RT Jon Stinchcomb), and that's about it. The rest of the guys on both teams were 4th-7th rounders, or even free agents.

Some might say, "well yah, because the Colts have Manning and the Saints have Brees as their respective QBs...they can get away with lesser "talent" on the o-line."

Precisely my point.

Until we get a great QB behind center, all this talk about o-lineman, taking 1 or 2 in the first round, we need a RT, an OG, etc., etc., etc., is meaningless. We can have a line full of 1st rounders and still not get anywhere without a great QB.

However, as recent (and our own past) history has shown, you can win a championship with lesser talent across the o-line, if (and only if) you have a great QB.

So go ahead and draft 1st round lineman until you're blue in the face, but don't expect much change...not until we address the most important part of the roster.

A franchise QB is needed.

Yours is a very respected opinion, but I disagree completely because this year we don't have the ability to draft a franchise QB worth it given where we are with Alex and there are many threads to cite so none needed for both sides. I think that Alex is the future especially in the immediate. The three powers, Scott, Mike and Jed believe he's the franchise QB...for now.

Now establishing that fact, we need to fill the RT position hands down which is the most glaring need and weakness on this team, no? Therefore one OL is needed. Why not a first round talent given where we are picking?

My point on Iupati in this draft is that some other good prospects are gone and the ones left wouldn't necessarily start because of the level of competition they would face at their respective positions. Iupati is hands down the best OG and would be a HUGE improvement to Baas, IMO.

And no, this thread is not meaningless.

Whoa tico, I never said this thread in particular was meaningless. My point was, the entire conversation about o-lineman (or any other position) really doesn't matter until we address the QB situation. Now, that doesn't mean we won't or shouldn't draft a RT or maybe even draft 2 lineman in the first round...it's all very possible. And me using the word meaningless was probably too strong. Of course we can/should talk about the other positions on the team.

But the larger point remains...regardless of what other positions we address, the one that matters most is QB, and until we fix that, we aren't going anywhere. So my post was not a condemnation of your opinion; it was more about putting things into perspective, and pointing out the rather obvious.

John - I would do whatever I could to trade for McNabb. Not that he will absolutely be the guaranteed answer, but he at least would give us a chance. Right now, with our QB situation, we have ZERO chance of making a playoff run...that's just the sad reality. Not only that, but a guy like McNabb would be a great mentor for the guy who I think at least has the physical tools to eventually (2-3 years down the road) be the guy...Nate Davis.

More so than any other move we could make this off-season, acquiring a QB of McNabb's caliber should be the priority. Now, I doubt our front office has the balls to make a move like that, so we'll have to stick with what we have.

Ghost, I somewhat agree with your opinion. If we take a look at our 2009 team, it was pretty evident that we needed to upgrade that RT position. Our guards needed to be a little more consistent and played better at season's end. We went 8-8 and beat the Cardinals twice. We're almost there. Alex may not be the answer to this team (I still believe that Nate Davis will be), but with our offense, Frank Gore will be the main focal point once again. He had a very difficult time rushing the ball with our o-line not getting any push but he was still able to go over 1000 yards and making the pro-bowl as an alternate. I'm not saying that we should draft two o-linemen necessarily, but I believe that it would help especially if we got two immediate starters like Bulaga and Iupati. Holes will be wider for Gore and Coffee to run through, and they should be able to give Alex more time in the pocket.

Ex. The Jets has an incredible o-line that basically got them in the playoffs along with a tough defense. That o-line allowed the Jets to lead the league in rushing. Mark Sanchez didn't have to do too much, but he was kept safe from too many hits. I think that's what Sing is going for.
[ Edited by SF69ers on Feb 10, 2010 at 9:09 AM ]
Originally posted by SF69ers:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by ninertico:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
I just think it's important to note that in this last Super Bowl, neither the Colts or the Saints had a 1st round o-lineman as a starter. In fact, I think between the 2 teams, there's was maybe only one 2nd rounder (Saints RT Jon Stinchcomb), and that's about it. The rest of the guys on both teams were 4th-7th rounders, or even free agents.

Some might say, "well yah, because the Colts have Manning and the Saints have Brees as their respective QBs...they can get away with lesser "talent" on the o-line."

Precisely my point.

Until we get a great QB behind center, all this talk about o-lineman, taking 1 or 2 in the first round, we need a RT, an OG, etc., etc., etc., is meaningless. We can have a line full of 1st rounders and still not get anywhere without a great QB.

However, as recent (and our own past) history has shown, you can win a championship with lesser talent across the o-line, if (and only if) you have a great QB.

So go ahead and draft 1st round lineman until you're blue in the face, but don't expect much change...not until we address the most important part of the roster.

A franchise QB is needed.

Yours is a very respected opinion, but I disagree completely because this year we don't have the ability to draft a franchise QB worth it given where we are with Alex and there are many threads to cite so none needed for both sides. I think that Alex is the future especially in the immediate. The three powers, Scott, Mike and Jed believe he's the franchise QB...for now.

Now establishing that fact, we need to fill the RT position hands down which is the most glaring need and weakness on this team, no? Therefore one OL is needed. Why not a first round talent given where we are picking?

My point on Iupati in this draft is that some other good prospects are gone and the ones left wouldn't necessarily start because of the level of competition they would face at their respective positions. Iupati is hands down the best OG and would be a HUGE improvement to Baas, IMO.

And no, this thread is not meaningless.

Whoa tico, I never said this thread in particular was meaningless. My point was, the entire conversation about o-lineman (or any other position) really doesn't matter until we address the QB situation. Now, that doesn't mean we won't or shouldn't draft a RT or maybe even draft 2 lineman in the first round...it's all very possible. And me using the word meaningless was probably too strong. Of course we can/should talk about the other positions on the team.

But the larger point remains...regardless of what other positions we address, the one that matters most is QB, and until we fix that, we aren't going anywhere. So my post was not a condemnation of your opinion; it was more about putting things into perspective, and pointing out the rather obvious.

John - I would do whatever I could to trade for McNabb. Not that he will absolutely be the guaranteed answer, but he at least would give us a chance. Right now, with our QB situation, we have ZERO chance of making a playoff run...that's just the sad reality. Not only that, but a guy like McNabb would be a great mentor for the guy who I think at least has the physical tools to eventually (2-3 years down the road) be the guy...Nate Davis.

More so than any other move we could make this off-season, acquiring a QB of McNabb's caliber should be the priority. Now, I doubt our front office has the balls to make a move like that, so we'll have to stick with what we have.

Ghost, I somewhat agree with your opinion. If we take a look at our 2009 team, it was pretty evident that we needed to upgrade that RT position. Our guards needed to be a little more consistent and played better at season's end. We went 8-8 and beat the Cardinals twice. We're almost there. Alex may not be the answer to this team (I still believe that Nate Davis will be), but with our offense, Frank Gore will be the main focal point once again. He had a very difficult time rushing the ball with our o-line not getting any push but he was still able to go over 1000 yards and making the pro-bowl as an alternate. I'm not saying that we should draft two o-linemen necessarily, but I believe that it would help especially if we got two immediate starters like Bulaga and Iupati. Holes will be wider for Gore and Coffee to run through, and they should be able to give Alex more time in the pocket.

Ex. The Jets has an incredible o-line that basically got them in the playoffs along with a tough defense. That o-line allowed the Jets to lead the league in rushing. Mark Sanchez didn't have to do too much, but he was kept safe from too many hits. I think that's what Sing is going for.

I agree with almost all of your post. The only reason I don't take a G is that Iupati looks like a raw mauler and we've already got two raw maulers starting. Another year in the system, another year of playing together, plus a new RT, new OL coach, and Ray Brown; it all adds up to giving Baas/Rachal one last shot to prove themselves.

I haven't seen many mock drafts (I try not to get into it until the combine) but would there be other talented players at #17 who could contribute straight away? Maybe a safety or corner? Another pass-rusher?
Originally posted by foreign49er:
Originally posted by SF69ers:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by ninertico:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
I just think it's important to note that in this last Super Bowl, neither the Colts or the Saints had a 1st round o-lineman as a starter. In fact, I think between the 2 teams, there's was maybe only one 2nd rounder (Saints RT Jon Stinchcomb), and that's about it. The rest of the guys on both teams were 4th-7th rounders, or even free agents.

Some might say, "well yah, because the Colts have Manning and the Saints have Brees as their respective QBs...they can get away with lesser "talent" on the o-line."

Precisely my point.

Until we get a great QB behind center, all this talk about o-lineman, taking 1 or 2 in the first round, we need a RT, an OG, etc., etc., etc., is meaningless. We can have a line full of 1st rounders and still not get anywhere without a great QB.

However, as recent (and our own past) history has shown, you can win a championship with lesser talent across the o-line, if (and only if) you have a great QB.

So go ahead and draft 1st round lineman until you're blue in the face, but don't expect much change...not until we address the most important part of the roster.

A franchise QB is needed.

Yours is a very respected opinion, but I disagree completely because this year we don't have the ability to draft a franchise QB worth it given where we are with Alex and there are many threads to cite so none needed for both sides. I think that Alex is the future especially in the immediate. The three powers, Scott, Mike and Jed believe he's the franchise QB...for now.

Now establishing that fact, we need to fill the RT position hands down which is the most glaring need and weakness on this team, no? Therefore one OL is needed. Why not a first round talent given where we are picking?

My point on Iupati in this draft is that some other good prospects are gone and the ones left wouldn't necessarily start because of the level of competition they would face at their respective positions. Iupati is hands down the best OG and would be a HUGE improvement to Baas, IMO.

And no, this thread is not meaningless.

Whoa tico, I never said this thread in particular was meaningless. My point was, the entire conversation about o-lineman (or any other position) really doesn't matter until we address the QB situation. Now, that doesn't mean we won't or shouldn't draft a RT or maybe even draft 2 lineman in the first round...it's all very possible. And me using the word meaningless was probably too strong. Of course we can/should talk about the other positions on the team.

But the larger point remains...regardless of what other positions we address, the one that matters most is QB, and until we fix that, we aren't going anywhere. So my post was not a condemnation of your opinion; it was more about putting things into perspective, and pointing out the rather obvious.

John - I would do whatever I could to trade for McNabb. Not that he will absolutely be the guaranteed answer, but he at least would give us a chance. Right now, with our QB situation, we have ZERO chance of making a playoff run...that's just the sad reality. Not only that, but a guy like McNabb would be a great mentor for the guy who I think at least has the physical tools to eventually (2-3 years down the road) be the guy...Nate Davis.

More so than any other move we could make this off-season, acquiring a QB of McNabb's caliber should be the priority. Now, I doubt our front office has the balls to make a move like that, so we'll have to stick with what we have.

Ghost, I somewhat agree with your opinion. If we take a look at our 2009 team, it was pretty evident that we needed to upgrade that RT position. Our guards needed to be a little more consistent and played better at season's end. We went 8-8 and beat the Cardinals twice. We're almost there. Alex may not be the answer to this team (I still believe that Nate Davis will be), but with our offense, Frank Gore will be the main focal point once again. He had a very difficult time rushing the ball with our o-line not getting any push but he was still able to go over 1000 yards and making the pro-bowl as an alternate. I'm not saying that we should draft two o-linemen necessarily, but I believe that it would help especially if we got two immediate starters like Bulaga and Iupati. Holes will be wider for Gore and Coffee to run through, and they should be able to give Alex more time in the pocket.

Ex. The Jets has an incredible o-line that basically got them in the playoffs along with a tough defense. That o-line allowed the Jets to lead the league in rushing. Mark Sanchez didn't have to do too much, but he was kept safe from too many hits. I think that's what Sing is going for.

I agree with almost all of your post. The only reason I don't take a G is that Iupati looks like a raw mauler and we've already got two raw maulers starting. Another year in the system, another year of playing together, plus a new RT, new OL coach, and Ray Brown; it all adds up to giving Baas/Rachal one last shot to prove themselves.

I haven't seen many mock drafts (I try not to get into it until the combine) but would there be other talented players at #17 who could contribute straight away? Maybe a safety or corner? Another pass-rusher?

In all honesty, I've been switching back and forth with OT & OG or Spiller & OT.

I'm leaning a little towards Spiller & Bulaga mainly because I'm convinced that we have a shot in selecting John Jerry in the 3rd round. Jerry is probably the 2nd best guard prospect IMO and he has played RT at Ole Miss.
Originally posted by Paul_Hofer:
Originally posted by tjd808185:
We're going to draft a tackle in the 1st that's pretty much a given. When it comes to drafting a guard in the 1st let me just say that chances are we're only missing out on prospect should we go in a different direction.

I know alot of people love Mike Iupati, but let's not pretend that we can't find a Pro Bowl guard or an instant starter should we wait to round 2 or 3 to address the interior line.

The problem with this idea is that we already have two 2nd rounders at guard in Baas and Rachal. And both were picked overall earlier than our #49 in the 2nd round this year. The second problem is that Baas may not stay with the team. The third problem is that free agency won't be so free this year.

All that tells you is we do a poor job at scouting, because every other team in the NFL can find starting guards outside the 1st round.

Baas will be a Niner next season. It makes no sense not tender him a contract next season.
Originally posted by SF69ers:
Originally posted by glorydayz:
Originally posted by English:
Originally posted by glorydayz:
So you would be pissed if we traded our two first rounders to move up to get Berry while drafting say Lupati in the second and moving him or Rachel to RT?

Flawed question IMO. Can't see Iupati lasting until the 2nd. And why move him to tackle? That's a no

How is this a flawed question? Iupati (as you spelled it, I have no idea what his name is) is not a sure first round pick unless he explodes at the combine.

So you believe we should move rachel to RT?

You may not have watched any of Iupati in college or in the Senior Bowl, but the guy is pretty much unstoppable at the guard position. He still does have a lot to learn, but his quick feet, along with his size at 6'5" 325 and long arms may also give him the ability to slide to RT some time in his career.

He is a sure fire, late 1st-round pick. Best guard prospect to come out in years.

He's only unstoppable if you have referees who refuse to call holding. He's definetily a mauler but he's far from perfect in passing situations.
[ Edited by tjd808185 on Feb 10, 2010 at 9:43 AM ]
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by SF69ers:
Originally posted by glorydayz:
Originally posted by English:
Originally posted by glorydayz:
So you would be pissed if we traded our two first rounders to move up to get Berry while drafting say Lupati in the second and moving him or Rachel to RT?

Flawed question IMO. Can't see Iupati lasting until the 2nd. And why move him to tackle? That's a no

How is this a flawed question? Iupati (as you spelled it, I have no idea what his name is) is not a sure first round pick unless he explodes at the combine.

So you believe we should move rachel to RT?

You may not have watched any of Iupati in college or in the Senior Bowl, but the guy is pretty much unstoppable at the guard position. He still does have a lot to learn, but his quick feet, along with his size at 6'5" 325 and long arms may also give him the ability to slide to RT some time in his career.

He is a sure fire, late 1st-round pick. Best guard prospect to come out in years.

He's only unstoppable if you have referees who refuse to call holding.

There is holding in every play in football. Iupati did get caught holding but he'll be receiving some of the best coaching when he gets to the NFL.

I still find it baffling that after one game where he didn't "dominate", people want to trash the player. Prior to the game, zoners were hailing him as our next Larry Allen. One game doesn't mean a thing.

Vlad Ducasse was starting to make some noise in this fan forum especially after the Shrine game. Then he comes to the Senior Bowl and pretty much bombs the whole week of practice. Ducasse and Iupati are both raw but have a load of potential. They played for teams that didn't have the highest level of competition so of course they had to get used to it.
Originally posted by SF69ers:
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by SF69ers:
Originally posted by glorydayz:
Originally posted by English:
Originally posted by glorydayz:
So you would be pissed if we traded our two first rounders to move up to get Berry while drafting say Lupati in the second and moving him or Rachel to RT?

Flawed question IMO. Can't see Iupati lasting until the 2nd. And why move him to tackle? That's a no

How is this a flawed question? Iupati (as you spelled it, I have no idea what his name is) is not a sure first round pick unless he explodes at the combine.

So you believe we should move rachel to RT?

You may not have watched any of Iupati in college or in the Senior Bowl, but the guy is pretty much unstoppable at the guard position. He still does have a lot to learn, but his quick feet, along with his size at 6'5" 325 and long arms may also give him the ability to slide to RT some time in his career.

He is a sure fire, late 1st-round pick. Best guard prospect to come out in years.

He's only unstoppable if you have referees who refuse to call holding.

There is holding in every play in football. Iupati did get caught holding but he'll be receiving some of the best coaching when he gets to the NFL.

I still find it baffling that after one game where he didn't "dominate", people want to trash the player. Prior to the game, zoners were hailing him as our next Larry Allen. One game doesn't mean a thing.

Vlad Ducasse was starting to make some noise in this fan forum especially after the Shrine game. Then he comes to the Senior Bowl and pretty much bombs the whole week of practice. Ducasse and Iupati are both raw but have a load of potential. They played for teams that didn't have the highest level of competition so of course they had to get used to it.

Here's the thing about Iupati. Any flaws that he had was hidden because he played against inferior competition. He was build up that he could play at all 5 positions and then gametime comes and he only looks comfortable at LG.

What it comes down to me is Iupati isn't a tempting enough of a guard to make me forget that only 1 interior lineman goes in the 1st round, and only 2 or 3 go before the 2nd round. The reality of the position is you can find potential pro bowlers and instant starters anywhere in the draft.
[ Edited by tjd808185 on Feb 10, 2010 at 10:04 AM ]
Originally posted by glorydayz:
Originally posted by English:
Originally posted by glorydayz:
So you would be pissed if we traded our two first rounders to move up to get Berry while drafting say Lupati in the second and moving him or Rachel to RT?

Flawed question IMO. Can't see Iupati lasting until the 2nd. And why move him to tackle? That's a no

How is this a flawed question? Iupati (as you spelled it, I have no idea what his name is) is not a sure first round pick unless he explodes at the combine.

So you believe we should move rachel to RT?

It was a flawed question because I can't see Iupati lasting to the 2nd. And no, I don't believe in moving Rachal to RT. We need to find out if he can play guard. But I have no confidence in Baas and we need a starting tackle, so drafting two O linemen in the first seems like a good option
Originally posted by foreign49er:
Originally posted by 9erred:
Webzoners need to read or re read The Winning Edge by Bill Walsh. He ranks what positions should be taken by rounds.

Left Tackles should be taken in round 1, Right tackles can be had in later rounds.

Guards should not be taken in the first few rounds.

1st round picks are reserved for DL or in the 3-4 rush OLB, shut down corner, WR, QB and Left tackle, note I did not say a right tackle.

I personally would have no problem with going for the best pass rusher at OLB and a shut down corner or FS in round 1, and a RT in round 2 or beyond.

I would say take a RT in this situation if only to finally get an fair anaylsis on Alex Smith. If we get a RT there's really no excuses left for him. No way we should address OL with both 1st rounders though.

OG is definitely not worthy of a #17 pick. Isn't the best Guard in this draft a mauler who still has to learn the technique of the position? Isn't that Baas' exact problem? Why would we replace Baas with mini-Baas? I can't see it happening with a mid-1st round pick, especially in this draft.

I could be wrong but in my opinion this draft is very deep at the 2nd and 3rd tier, Guard could be considered a need but is it important enough to pass on an impact player?

The last time we drafted for need was Kentwan Balmer. Iupati or any other Guard in this draft would also take a year or two to become productive.

Iupati would have immediate and profound impact playing at LOG. And yes, he's better than Baas. And yes, he need to improve on his technique at tackle and ROG. However, he's been seen as a potential Pro Bowl OG on the left side.

Graham, Thomas, D. Williams, Spiller or anyone at that 16/17 range will not have that kind of impact for except Spiller and Graham as I see them as improvements to our team.

In this scenario, Spiller is already gone and Iupati is BPA over Graham for now.

Iupati would have immediate impact. Wait until the Combine, man. Your eyes will be so open and you will need to pick up your jaw from the floor after you see this beast perform.

And another note...

I just started this thread to collect the opinions of our fellow zoners to get a sample. Of course this topic can be volatile because we all want the best for our team and two OL picks takes up two resources where one can be used else where.

It is that else where that I love! My man crush for both Spiller and Iupati are evident and I am yelling it from the Alps! But seriously, we have such a great situation for our first three picks.

Two offensive linemen in the first is but one scenario I would be happy to see.

Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by SF69ers:
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by SF69ers:
Originally posted by glorydayz:
Originally posted by English:
Originally posted by glorydayz:
So you would be pissed if we traded our two first rounders to move up to get Berry while drafting say Lupati in the second and moving him or Rachel to RT?

Flawed question IMO. Can't see Iupati lasting until the 2nd. And why move him to tackle? That's a no

How is this a flawed question? Iupati (as you spelled it, I have no idea what his name is) is not a sure first round pick unless he explodes at the combine.

So you believe we should move rachel to RT?

You may not have watched any of Iupati in college or in the Senior Bowl, but the guy is pretty much unstoppable at the guard position. He still does have a lot to learn, but his quick feet, along with his size at 6'5" 325 and long arms may also give him the ability to slide to RT some time in his career.

He is a sure fire, late 1st-round pick. Best guard prospect to come out in years.

He's only unstoppable if you have referees who refuse to call holding.

There is holding in every play in football. Iupati did get caught holding but he'll be receiving some of the best coaching when he gets to the NFL.

I still find it baffling that after one game where he didn't "dominate", people want to trash the player. Prior to the game, zoners were hailing him as our next Larry Allen. One game doesn't mean a thing.

Vlad Ducasse was starting to make some noise in this fan forum especially after the Shrine game. Then he comes to the Senior Bowl and pretty much bombs the whole week of practice. Ducasse and Iupati are both raw but have a load of potential. They played for teams that didn't have the highest level of competition so of course they had to get used to it.

Here's the thing about Iupati. Any flaws that he had was hidden because he played against inferior competition. He was build up that he could play at all 5 positions and then gametime comes and he only looks comfortable at LG.

What it comes down to me is Iupati isn't a tempting enough of a guard to make me forget that only 1 interior lineman goes in the 1st round, and only 2 or 3 go before the 2nd round. The reality of the position is you can find potential pro bowlers and instant starters anywhere in the draft.

At the Senior Bowl game itself, he saw significant time at both guard positions, the left side being his most comfortable side. There is no doubt in my mind that he would succeed at the right guard position as well if given more PT there. No one ever really said he could play all 5 positions. This is something we all assumed due to his size, quick feet, and 35 inch long arms. He practiced at the RT position and did very well keeping up with the speed of Graham and the bull rush of Alualu. Unfortunately, his Senior Bowl coaches didn't let him play at that position during the game. I guess we all need to wait until the combine to see how well he does.
Originally posted by SF69ers:
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by SF69ers:
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by SF69ers:
Originally posted by glorydayz:
Originally posted by English:
Originally posted by glorydayz:
So you would be pissed if we traded our two first rounders to move up to get Berry while drafting say Lupati in the second and moving him or Rachel to RT?

Flawed question IMO. Can't see Iupati lasting until the 2nd. And why move him to tackle? That's a no

How is this a flawed question? Iupati (as you spelled it, I have no idea what his name is) is not a sure first round pick unless he explodes at the combine.

So you believe we should move rachel to RT?

You may not have watched any of Iupati in college or in the Senior Bowl, but the guy is pretty much unstoppable at the guard position. He still does have a lot to learn, but his quick feet, along with his size at 6'5" 325 and long arms may also give him the ability to slide to RT some time in his career.

He is a sure fire, late 1st-round pick. Best guard prospect to come out in years.

He's only unstoppable if you have referees who refuse to call holding.

There is holding in every play in football. Iupati did get caught holding but he'll be receiving some of the best coaching when he gets to the NFL.

I still find it baffling that after one game where he didn't "dominate", people want to trash the player. Prior to the game, zoners were hailing him as our next Larry Allen. One game doesn't mean a thing.

Vlad Ducasse was starting to make some noise in this fan forum especially after the Shrine game. Then he comes to the Senior Bowl and pretty much bombs the whole week of practice. Ducasse and Iupati are both raw but have a load of potential. They played for teams that didn't have the highest level of competition so of course they had to get used to it.

Here's the thing about Iupati. Any flaws that he had was hidden because he played against inferior competition. He was build up that he could play at all 5 positions and then gametime comes and he only looks comfortable at LG.

What it comes down to me is Iupati isn't a tempting enough of a guard to make me forget that only 1 interior lineman goes in the 1st round, and only 2 or 3 go before the 2nd round. The reality of the position is you can find potential pro bowlers and instant starters anywhere in the draft.

At the Senior Bowl game itself, he saw significant time at both guard positions, the left side being his most comfortable side. There is no doubt in my mind that he would succeed at the right guard position as well if given more PT there. No one ever really said he could play all 5 positions. This is something we all assumed due to his size, quick feet, and 35 inch long arms. He practiced at the RT position and did very well keeping up with the speed of Graham and the bull rush of Alualu. Unfortunately, his Senior Bowl coaches didn't let him play at that position during the game. I guess we all need to wait until the combine to see how well he does.

Frickin' Mayock said it before the Senior Bowl, but still believes that this kid can play other positions given time. He does believe that Iupati is a Pro-Bowl type OG.



Oh wait, Mayock also has McCoy ahead of Suh...
Originally posted by ninertico:
Originally posted by SF69ers:
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by SF69ers:
Originally posted by tjd808185:
Originally posted by SF69ers:
Originally posted by glorydayz:
Originally posted by English:
Originally posted by glorydayz:
So you would be pissed if we traded our two first rounders to move up to get Berry while drafting say Lupati in the second and moving him or Rachel to RT?

Flawed question IMO. Can't see Iupati lasting until the 2nd. And why move him to tackle? That's a no

How is this a flawed question? Iupati (as you spelled it, I have no idea what his name is) is not a sure first round pick unless he explodes at the combine.

So you believe we should move rachel to RT?

You may not have watched any of Iupati in college or in the Senior Bowl, but the guy is pretty much unstoppable at the guard position. He still does have a lot to learn, but his quick feet, along with his size at 6'5" 325 and long arms may also give him the ability to slide to RT some time in his career.

He is a sure fire, late 1st-round pick. Best guard prospect to come out in years.

He's only unstoppable if you have referees who refuse to call holding.

There is holding in every play in football. Iupati did get caught holding but he'll be receiving some of the best coaching when he gets to the NFL.

I still find it baffling that after one game where he didn't "dominate", people want to trash the player. Prior to the game, zoners were hailing him as our next Larry Allen. One game doesn't mean a thing.

Vlad Ducasse was starting to make some noise in this fan forum especially after the Shrine game. Then he comes to the Senior Bowl and pretty much bombs the whole week of practice. Ducasse and Iupati are both raw but have a load of potential. They played for teams that didn't have the highest level of competition so of course they had to get used to it.

Here's the thing about Iupati. Any flaws that he had was hidden because he played against inferior competition. He was build up that he could play at all 5 positions and then gametime comes and he only looks comfortable at LG.

What it comes down to me is Iupati isn't a tempting enough of a guard to make me forget that only 1 interior lineman goes in the 1st round, and only 2 or 3 go before the 2nd round. The reality of the position is you can find potential pro bowlers and instant starters anywhere in the draft.

At the Senior Bowl game itself, he saw significant time at both guard positions, the left side being his most comfortable side. There is no doubt in my mind that he would succeed at the right guard position as well if given more PT there. No one ever really said he could play all 5 positions. This is something we all assumed due to his size, quick feet, and 35 inch long arms. He practiced at the RT position and did very well keeping up with the speed of Graham and the bull rush of Alualu. Unfortunately, his Senior Bowl coaches didn't let him play at that position during the game. I guess we all need to wait until the combine to see how well he does.

Frickin' Mayock said it before the Senior Bowl, but still believes that this kid can play other positions given time. He does believe that Iupati is a Pro-Bowl type OG.



Oh wait, Mayock also has McCoy ahead of Suh...

I guess he was looking at Iupati's potential. IMO, I see him as a guard and RT maybe in the future. Probably won't be able to play the LT or C spots.
Originally posted by 9erred:
Webzoners need to read or re read The Winning Edge by Bill Walsh. He ranks what positions should be taken by rounds.

Left Tackles should be taken in round 1, Right tackles can be had in later rounds.

Guards should not be taken in the first few rounds.

1st round picks are reserved for DL or in the 3-4 rush OLB, shut down corner, WR, QB and Left tackle, note I did not say a right tackle.

I personally would have no problem with going for the best pass rusher at OLB and a shut down corner or FS in round 1, and a RT in round 2 or beyond.

Bill Walsh had that philosophy in a different era of football, and I don't believe that opinion or strategy is still valid in todays NFL. Also lets not forget that Bill Walsh had one of, if not the best, offensive line coaches in the history of the NFL. It's ok to place lower importance of drafting linemen early when your oline coach can take a drunk bum out of the gutter on Monday morning and coach him up to perform well in time for the game on Sunday.


I get so sick and tired of people trying to tout Bill Walsh's ideals and strategies as gospel when they were applied to an era that is loooong gone. I mean I doubt anyone would care what Chuck Knoll felt about drafting linemen and in what round, nor should they as it is no longer applicable.


LOVE Bill Walsh. One of my all time favorite human beings. His tactics in draft strategy simply do not apply in THIS era of football with THIS coaching staff in place.