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Final Bowl Week Prospect Watch: (1/4 - 1/7)

Originally posted by TX9R:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by TX9R:
So Thomas' size scares people off, but Arenas is no problem. He looked even smaller? How's he gonna cover most NFL WRs, he's maybe 5'7. Do you take a guy in the 2nd strictly as a returner?

I wouldn't draft Arenas with the intention of starting him at CB...maybe a dime back. But his value would be in the return game.....personally I have other people in mind to fit that role.

And how everyone forgets how Arenas was burned by Shipley for a TD, twice I think.

But some make it like being 5'10" as a Safety won't work in the NFL when some of the best are that height. But whatever that's their opinion, I'll stick with my guns that I'd still hope we get Thomas in the 1st, shoot if we got him in the 2nd it would be a steal.

Arenas is about the exact same height as Thomas is, maybe half an inch shorter -- completely irrelevant. Arenas was not burned twice. #23 (can't remember the name) got burned as he and SS Justin Woodall were out of position on the 2nd TD. Anyone trying to imply that Arenas is a poor player or had a poor game doesn't know what the heck they're talking about. Arenas was outstanding and has been so all year. (5 interceptions, 12 TFL, 5 sacks) Then tack on his incredible PR/KR numbers, with 7 return TDs, and you've got yourself a day one talent.

Earl Thomas is not his listed 5-10; he's just under 5-9 or so. But I'm not worried about height with safeties, the concern is whether or not they can make plays in all ways. Does Thomas have any glaring weakness? Yes, yes he does, and it's tackling in general and playing the run. Fantastic in coverage, but poor in run support. 65 tackles all year. Not surprising for a 5-9 190 pound safety.

Lets compare SS Earl Thomas' numbers to middle rounder SS Kyle McCarthy of Notre Dame.

Thomas: 65 tackles, 4.5 TFL, 8 INT
McCarthy: 101 tackles, 3 TFL, 5 INT (in two less games).

Hopefully this helps to further explain why Thomas is not a first-rounder right now in my eyes.

I get your reasoning, but that's a poor comparison. ND's front 7 is terrible, so that guy HAS to make all the tackles, wheras Texas it outstanding. Tackles for a FS are an overrated stat completely dependant on the guys in front of him. Personally I hope Thomas stays another year, he's a playmaker.

Well, Thomas and McCarthy both play SS. I understand the point, however, but I'm not sure that's necessarily the case.

Example:

Nebraska has an oustanding DL and corners with guys like Suh and Amukamura. SS Larry Asante still had 79 tackles. Georgia Tech has Derrick Morgan up front, and FS Morgan Burnett had 85 tackles (4 for loss). Both more than Thomas.

[ Edited by OnTheClock on Jan 8, 2010 at 11:11:38 ]
Member Milestone: This is post number 1,800 for Hopper.
Lol at downgrading Thomas to a 2nd round pick because Texas front seven was horrible against the run last night. The Niners need Thomas for his coverage skills more than his run support.

[ Edited by Hopper on Jan 8, 2010 at 12:28:05 ]
Originally posted by Hopper:
Lol at downgrading Campbell to a 2nd round pick because Texas front seven was horrible against the run last night. The Niners need Campbell for coverage skills more than his run support.

Who's Campbell?
sorry, meant Thomas.
Originally posted by Hopper:
sorry, meant Thomas.

Originally posted by GoFD74:
Originally posted by jta854:
Originally posted by rtj03:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Ninefan56:
Now that the BCS game is about over, who are the players that improved their status and why, and who are those who dropped in their status and why? Also who would be players that we would look at?

Gainers:
DT Lamarr Houston - continued to play hard and was the one guy to consistently get pressure. Beat Mike Johnson badly several times early on.
WR Shipley - Even without their QB, has played extremely well. Two TDs.
CB Arenas - Sure he got beat once on the double-move, but never judge someone on one play. He had one bad play, the entire rest of the game he had/has been very good out there.
ILB McClain - solid all game long. A mistake being offsides, but that's about the only negative you can take from McClain tonight.

Losers:
S Earl Thomas - not physical enough, didn't make a peep in the game.
DT Terrance Cody - simply a situational player, falls deeper into the 2nd round.
SS Woodall - Blown coverages. Woodall may have to move to OLB in the Pro's.

Static (non-moving):
OLB Sergio Kindle - Did some good things, but not enough to really make any significant movement.
OG Mike Johnson - Got beat some early on, but bounce back with some outstanding blocks to even things out.

"OLB Sergio Kindle - Did some good things, but not enough to really make any significant movement."

Kindle had a good night and I bet his stock is up after this game.

Kindle looks like a possible “Manny Lawson 2.0.” I have said all season that I think he is overrated as a 3-4 OLB. He is a great athlete, and has ideal measurable, although he doesn’t look like he is 255lb. When I watch him rush the passer he seems to use only his speed and quickness, never any pass rush moves. He is a good enough athlete to be successful in the NFL, but I’m not wild about drafting Kindle to help with our pass rush.

The big difference between Manny and Kindle is that of "quick-twitch." Manny is a great athlete and amazingly fast in a straight-line for someone with his size...but he's not very quick in terms of change-of-direction (which is critical for LBs). He actually struggled a bit at his combine with the LB drills, and his ability to cover is a bit over-hyped. Manny is getting better with each year, but his lack of quickness (there's a difference between being fast and quick) does hurt him.

Kindle though is an explosive, "quick-twitch" athlete and former high school RB (rushed for over 8000 yards) who should be able to make a very smooth transition to NFL OLB...in fact, I think he'll be better playing in space at the pro level than he was in college going up against guys 50-75 lbs bigger than him on every down.

I agree with everything you said. But my point was that I don't think Kindle is going to be able to get past an NFL tackle once they get their hands on him. At Texas he seems to blow past the tackles, I don't think he will be able to do that in the NFL with out some moves.
Originally posted by jta854:
Originally posted by GoFD74:
Originally posted by jta854:
Originally posted by rtj03:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Ninefan56:
Now that the BCS game is about over, who are the players that improved their status and why, and who are those who dropped in their status and why? Also who would be players that we would look at?

Gainers:
DT Lamarr Houston - continued to play hard and was the one guy to consistently get pressure. Beat Mike Johnson badly several times early on.
WR Shipley - Even without their QB, has played extremely well. Two TDs.
CB Arenas - Sure he got beat once on the double-move, but never judge someone on one play. He had one bad play, the entire rest of the game he had/has been very good out there.
ILB McClain - solid all game long. A mistake being offsides, but that's about the only negative you can take from McClain tonight.

Losers:
S Earl Thomas - not physical enough, didn't make a peep in the game.
DT Terrance Cody - simply a situational player, falls deeper into the 2nd round.
SS Woodall - Blown coverages. Woodall may have to move to OLB in the Pro's.

Static (non-moving):
OLB Sergio Kindle - Did some good things, but not enough to really make any significant movement.
OG Mike Johnson - Got beat some early on, but bounce back with some outstanding blocks to even things out.

"OLB Sergio Kindle - Did some good things, but not enough to really make any significant movement."

Kindle had a good night and I bet his stock is up after this game.

Kindle looks like a possible “Manny Lawson 2.0.” I have said all season that I think he is overrated as a 3-4 OLB. He is a great athlete, and has ideal measurable, although he doesn’t look like he is 255lb. When I watch him rush the passer he seems to use only his speed and quickness, never any pass rush moves. He is a good enough athlete to be successful in the NFL, but I’m not wild about drafting Kindle to help with our pass rush.

The big difference between Manny and Kindle is that of "quick-twitch." Manny is a great athlete and amazingly fast in a straight-line for someone with his size...but he's not very quick in terms of change-of-direction (which is critical for LBs). He actually struggled a bit at his combine with the LB drills, and his ability to cover is a bit over-hyped. Manny is getting better with each year, but his lack of quickness (there's a difference between being fast and quick) does hurt him.

Kindle though is an explosive, "quick-twitch" athlete and former high school RB (rushed for over 8000 yards) who should be able to make a very smooth transition to NFL OLB...in fact, I think he'll be better playing in space at the pro level than he was in college going up against guys 50-75 lbs bigger than him on every down.

I agree with everything you said. But my point was that I don't think Kindle is going to be able to get past an NFL tackle once they get their hands on him. At Texas he seems to blow past the tackles, I don't think he will be able to do that in the NFL with out some moves.

I didn't realize that was your point, but I tend to agree with that...at least initially. He'll be handled pretty good by most OTs for the first part of his career until he bulks up and learns better technique. But the one thing that he can count on is being able to beat NFL OTs around the corner...so more than likely, teams will bring him in initially on passing downs or later in the game to provide a speed rush (which is how we probably should've played Manny too when he first came up, btw).

That probably means he'll be a late 1st (for teams like the Pats that can afford to develop him) or an early-to-mid 2nd rounder.
Originally posted by Hopper:
Lol at downgrading Thomas to a 2nd round pick because Texas front seven was horrible against the run last night. The Niners need Thomas for his coverage skills more than his run support.

Thomas was never downgraded. He is still who I thought he was. However, he did not shine last night.
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Hopper:
Lol at downgrading Thomas to a 2nd round pick because Texas front seven was horrible against the run last night. The Niners need Thomas for his coverage skills more than his run support.

Thomas was never downgraded. He is still who I thought he was. However, he did not shine last night.



Some thoughts on the Alabama-Texas game on the prospects. I thought a lot of players had mixed performances. Here are my observations below:

Sergio Kindle- Played a solid game overall, especially when he has an open shot to the QB. Really has some brilliant short area quickness, which is really critical in sacking the QB. Needs to work on getting to the QB in a variety of ways. Doesn't run through, or under tackles very well at this stage. Simply a burner from the outside. But, I have to say, he looks a LOT better than many of the other OLB prospects for the NFL: Lang, Norwood, Young, Selvie. He's got an NFL body already.

Jordan Shipley: I think the best comparison for Jordan Shipley is OSU grad, Anthony Gonzalez, who has a fairly thin build, but is quick and fearless across the middle. Just seems to "GET IT". I think he is a solid number 2 WR for a team in the NFL, and will have a lengthy career. He did drop a few balls last night, which was uncharacteristic for him.

Mike Johnson- A solid run blocking job throughout the game, but struggled with Houston on at least two passing downs, and just did not look nearly as athletic as a prospect like Mike Iupati. I graded Kyle Calloway of Iowa better than the Alabama guard. Johnson appears to be a mid-late third rounder at best.

Javier (Don't Call Me Gilbert) Arenas- took a few bad angles during the game, and was lit up by Shipley for one TD. However, catches 2 INT's, and appears to be a guy who simply needs to be coached up to gamble less. I saw the same issue with Aaron Ross in college. I think he's a solid nickle corner at the NFL level, and a very good PR. Probably fits in that late-second, early-third area.

Earl Thomas- Solid in pass coverage, which is his forte. Finally had the chance to play run defense after a long year of pass-happy Big 12 opponents, and quite frankly, did not measure up. Lost the ball on the long TD run, which saw the RB blow right past him. Missed a few other tackles. He is very aggressive in run support as he approaches the ball carrier, but is so small, that I feel he is going to get slaughtered in the NFL. I think the T.O.'s, Calvin Johnson's, Andre Johnson's, Larry Fitzgerald's are going to run right over him at the next level. His body is not ready for Sunday's and free safeties in the NFL must do more than simply cover the back end of the secondary. With that in mind, I would never grade him as a first round talent, even though he has a great chance of being selecting in the first 32 players.

Terrence Cody- Beauty is in the eye of the beholder with Cody. To me, he's simply a toilet clogger. A very good toilet clogger, but a toilet clogger nonetheless. But, I still would not be surprised if a late first round team picks him up to replace one of their old warhorse 3-4 NT's. Since the NFL is moving away from the running game, I think his value is less than from two years ago. However, these fat-arsed toilet cloggers seem to play for 500 years, so you are getting good long-range value.


Rolando McClain- The best player on the field on Thursday. Has very few holes in his game, and I would be surprised if he falls past the 15th pick in the draft if he comes out. Just a superb performance. Clearly a better player than Spikes and the lost of other MLB prospects in the draft. Very little bust potential.

[ Edited by MadDog49er on Jan 8, 2010 at 18:23:24 ]
  • Kolohe
  • Hall of Fame
  • Posts: 31,252
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Ninefan56:
Now that the BCS game is about over, who are the players that improved their status and why, and who are those who dropped in their status and why? Also who would be players that we would look at?

Gainers:
DT Lamarr Houston - continued to play hard and was the one guy to consistently get pressure. Beat Mike Johnson badly several times early on.
WR Shipley - Even without their QB, has played extremely well. Two TDs.
CB Arenas - Sure he got beat once on the double-move, but never judge someone on one play. He had one bad play, the entire rest of the game he had/has been very good out there.
ILB McClain - solid all game long. A mistake being offsides, but that's about the only negative you can take from McClain tonight.

Losers:
S Earl Thomas - not physical enough, didn't make a peep in the game.
DT Terrance Cody - simply a situational player, falls deeper into the 2nd round.
SS Woodall - Blown coverages. Woodall may have to move to OLB in the Pro's.

Static (non-moving):
OLB Sergio Kindle - Did some good things, but not enough to really make any significant movement.
OG Mike Johnson - Got beat some early on, but bounce back with some outstanding blocks to even things out.

I wouldn't say "Loser", its not his fault Bama ran the ball 90% of the time with Ingram and Richardson, who Thomas made a nice open field tackle on 3rd and 2. And not physical enough, dude was throwing his body AT the RB's, he could be blamed for miss tackles, but not physical enough C'mon.

Same goes with Cody, Bama knew Texas would pass more so they went with more of a pass rushing front.

We saw two different things last night. Sure, Thomas is not at fault for the fact that Alabama didn't pass much, but it's going to take more than one good tackle in a game to make people believe you have first round talent. Thomas plays Strong Safety for Texas -- Other guys like T.J. Ward, Reshad Jones, Kam Chancellor, even Larry Asante and Kyle McCarthy consistently make noise in both facets of the game no matter what the run-pass ratio. As I said before, Thomas' "ballhawk" status and him getting a bunch of interceptions is not enough.

He lost ground as far as the "1st round" standard that many around here place on him. If he was expected to play like a 2nd rounder or later, that'd be totally different, and I would not classify him as one of the "Losers" of the game. Hope that makes sense.

As far as Cody, that absolutely proves my point. He can't play on every down, and he'll be virtually useless against most passing teams in the league, and in such a pass-happy league these days, would that not concern you? You don't want to spend a 1st on a situational player like that.

So let me get this straight, your going to base one game with an opposing QB passing for only 11 times. BTW Thomas had more than 1 tackle, went head to head with Ingram in the 2nd quarter. In that game and lined up at SS and FS, but due to his cover skills, IMO, he'll be a FS in the NFL.

Oh and BTW Thomas has the same amount of tackles than both TJ Ward and Kam Chancellor, but more solo tackles than Chancellor.

Kolohe! Ward and Chancellor are both 2nd and 3rd round prospects, respectively, and that's the thing -- that's exactly how I see Thomas (2nd, not 3rd, to be clear here). Even Kansas' Darrell Stuckey had 93 tackles, 3.5 TFL and a sack. I'm sure Thomas likely will be a FS when he comes to the NFL, but he should go back to school for one more year and with another good one, he'd probably vault himself into the late 1st to early 2nd.

Regardless of your's or anyone else's draft grades on here, you stated that the Safeties you mentioned make noise regardless of pass vs. run ratio, and that's why I compared the stats. But from the times I've seen him play hes made some pretty solid hits, and in no way would I judge him off this game. Its like after this one game you gave a full college career assessment on Earl Thomas, if you've ever done a scouting report on him in the past I apologize, but that's just the feeling I get.

BTW where did you get 5'9" from?? On the official UT site he's listed at 5'10", regardless he'll probably measure in at 5'9" and 3/8 at the Combine.
Originally posted by MadDog49er:

Rolando McClain- The best player on the field on Thursday. Has very few holes in his game, and I would be surprised if he falls past the 15th pick in the draft if he comes out. Just a superb performance. Clearly a better player than Spikes and the lost of other MLB prospects in the draft. Very little bust potential.

Watching McClain was like watching Patrick Willis...amazingly similar.
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Ninefan56:
Now that the BCS game is about over, who are the players that improved their status and why, and who are those who dropped in their status and why? Also who would be players that we would look at?

Gainers:
DT Lamarr Houston - continued to play hard and was the one guy to consistently get pressure. Beat Mike Johnson badly several times early on.
WR Shipley - Even without their QB, has played extremely well. Two TDs.
CB Arenas - Sure he got beat once on the double-move, but never judge someone on one play. He had one bad play, the entire rest of the game he had/has been very good out there.
ILB McClain - solid all game long. A mistake being offsides, but that's about the only negative you can take from McClain tonight.

Losers:
S Earl Thomas - not physical enough, didn't make a peep in the game.
DT Terrance Cody - simply a situational player, falls deeper into the 2nd round.
SS Woodall - Blown coverages. Woodall may have to move to OLB in the Pro's.

Static (non-moving):
OLB Sergio Kindle - Did some good things, but not enough to really make any significant movement.
OG Mike Johnson - Got beat some early on, but bounce back with some outstanding blocks to even things out.

I wouldn't say "Loser", its not his fault Bama ran the ball 90% of the time with Ingram and Richardson, who Thomas made a nice open field tackle on 3rd and 2. And not physical enough, dude was throwing his body AT the RB's, he could be blamed for miss tackles, but not physical enough C'mon.

Same goes with Cody, Bama knew Texas would pass more so they went with more of a pass rushing front.

We saw two different things last night. Sure, Thomas is not at fault for the fact that Alabama didn't pass much, but it's going to take more than one good tackle in a game to make people believe you have first round talent. Thomas plays Strong Safety for Texas -- Other guys like T.J. Ward, Reshad Jones, Kam Chancellor, even Larry Asante and Kyle McCarthy consistently make noise in both facets of the game no matter what the run-pass ratio. As I said before, Thomas' "ballhawk" status and him getting a bunch of interceptions is not enough.

He lost ground as far as the "1st round" standard that many around here place on him. If he was expected to play like a 2nd rounder or later, that'd be totally different, and I would not classify him as one of the "Losers" of the game. Hope that makes sense.

As far as Cody, that absolutely proves my point. He can't play on every down, and he'll be virtually useless against most passing teams in the league, and in such a pass-happy league these days, would that not concern you? You don't want to spend a 1st on a situational player like that.

So let me get this straight, your going to base one game with an opposing QB passing for only 11 times. BTW Thomas had more than 1 tackle, went head to head with Ingram in the 2nd quarter. In that game and lined up at SS and FS, but due to his cover skills, IMO, he'll be a FS in the NFL.

Oh and BTW Thomas has the same amount of tackles than both TJ Ward and Kam Chancellor, but more solo tackles than Chancellor.

Kolohe! Ward and Chancellor are both 2nd and 3rd round prospects, respectively, and that's the thing -- that's exactly how I see Thomas (2nd, not 3rd, to be clear here). Even Kansas' Darrell Stuckey had 93 tackles, 3.5 TFL and a sack. I'm sure Thomas likely will be a FS when he comes to the NFL, but he should go back to school for one more year and with another good one, he'd probably vault himself into the late 1st to early 2nd.

Regardless of your's or anyone else's draft grades on here, you stated that the Safeties you mentioned make noise regardless of pass vs. run ratio, and that's why I compared the stats. But from the times I've seen him play hes made some pretty solid hits, and in no way would I judge him off this game. Its like after this one game you gave a full college career assessment on Earl Thomas, if you've ever done a scouting report on him in the past I apologize, but that's just the feeling I get.

BTW where did you get 5'9" from?? On the official UT site he's listed at 5'10", regardless he'll probably measure in at 5'9" and 3/8 at the Combine.

I automatically take an inch off, because there were virtually no players that measured "as high" or higher than their listed heights. Plus, just guesstimating, that's what he looks like too, so..

By the way, Thomas is entering the draft.... Canada has the news first. http://www.tsn.ca/ncaa/story/?id=305322.

Thomas did the same thing last night that I've seen him do at various points during the season. I currently reside in Texas right in the heart of Longhorn nation, really, and get to see plenty of Earl Thomas. Thomas has been inconsistent in run support. It's not to say he can't get better or is terrible, he's just not fantastic. His lack of prototypical size does hurt him some as well, but thanks to his sensational coverage ability, field awareness, and hands, his stock is very high. He's simply stellar in that regard. But that's not enough for me to grade him a 1st, and as a result, all this put together is why he grades out to me as a early to middle 2nd rounder.

Make no mistake, Thomas is a very good player, but he's not perfect. I do not aim to take anything away from him, but in terms of talent, you know what I think. However, in terms of projecting where he'll go -- I think a team will indeed bite in the first, pending a horrific combine. In such a pass-oriented league, a player with his skills offers a slightly higher value now.

Just to add, a team who already has a great, run-stopping, big, heavy-hitting safety on their squad could certainly use Thomas as a nice complement to them.

[ Edited by OnTheClock on Jan 8, 2010 at 21:40:23 ]
  • Kolohe
  • Hall of Fame
  • Posts: 31,252
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Ninefan56:
Now that the BCS game is about over, who are the players that improved their status and why, and who are those who dropped in their status and why? Also who would be players that we would look at?

Gainers:
DT Lamarr Houston - continued to play hard and was the one guy to consistently get pressure. Beat Mike Johnson badly several times early on.
WR Shipley - Even without their QB, has played extremely well. Two TDs.
CB Arenas - Sure he got beat once on the double-move, but never judge someone on one play. He had one bad play, the entire rest of the game he had/has been very good out there.
ILB McClain - solid all game long. A mistake being offsides, but that's about the only negative you can take from McClain tonight.

Losers:
S Earl Thomas - not physical enough, didn't make a peep in the game.
DT Terrance Cody - simply a situational player, falls deeper into the 2nd round.
SS Woodall - Blown coverages. Woodall may have to move to OLB in the Pro's.

Static (non-moving):
OLB Sergio Kindle - Did some good things, but not enough to really make any significant movement.
OG Mike Johnson - Got beat some early on, but bounce back with some outstanding blocks to even things out.

I wouldn't say "Loser", its not his fault Bama ran the ball 90% of the time with Ingram and Richardson, who Thomas made a nice open field tackle on 3rd and 2. And not physical enough, dude was throwing his body AT the RB's, he could be blamed for miss tackles, but not physical enough C'mon.

Same goes with Cody, Bama knew Texas would pass more so they went with more of a pass rushing front.

We saw two different things last night. Sure, Thomas is not at fault for the fact that Alabama didn't pass much, but it's going to take more than one good tackle in a game to make people believe you have first round talent. Thomas plays Strong Safety for Texas -- Other guys like T.J. Ward, Reshad Jones, Kam Chancellor, even Larry Asante and Kyle McCarthy consistently make noise in both facets of the game no matter what the run-pass ratio. As I said before, Thomas' "ballhawk" status and him getting a bunch of interceptions is not enough.

He lost ground as far as the "1st round" standard that many around here place on him. If he was expected to play like a 2nd rounder or later, that'd be totally different, and I would not classify him as one of the "Losers" of the game. Hope that makes sense.

As far as Cody, that absolutely proves my point. He can't play on every down, and he'll be virtually useless against most passing teams in the league, and in such a pass-happy league these days, would that not concern you? You don't want to spend a 1st on a situational player like that.

So let me get this straight, your going to base one game with an opposing QB passing for only 11 times. BTW Thomas had more than 1 tackle, went head to head with Ingram in the 2nd quarter. In that game and lined up at SS and FS, but due to his cover skills, IMO, he'll be a FS in the NFL.

Oh and BTW Thomas has the same amount of tackles than both TJ Ward and Kam Chancellor, but more solo tackles than Chancellor.

Kolohe! Ward and Chancellor are both 2nd and 3rd round prospects, respectively, and that's the thing -- that's exactly how I see Thomas (2nd, not 3rd, to be clear here). Even Kansas' Darrell Stuckey had 93 tackles, 3.5 TFL and a sack. I'm sure Thomas likely will be a FS when he comes to the NFL, but he should go back to school for one more year and with another good one, he'd probably vault himself into the late 1st to early 2nd.

Regardless of your's or anyone else's draft grades on here, you stated that the Safeties you mentioned make noise regardless of pass vs. run ratio, and that's why I compared the stats. But from the times I've seen him play hes made some pretty solid hits, and in no way would I judge him off this game. Its like after this one game you gave a full college career assessment on Earl Thomas, if you've ever done a scouting report on him in the past I apologize, but that's just the feeling I get.

BTW where did you get 5'9" from?? On the official UT site he's listed at 5'10", regardless he'll probably measure in at 5'9" and 3/8 at the Combine.

I automatically take an inch off, because there were virtually no players that measured "as high" or higher than their listed heights. Plus, just guesstimating, that's what he looks like too, so..

By the way, Thomas is entering the draft.... Canada has the news first. http://www.tsn.ca/ncaa/story/?id=305322.

Thomas did the same thing last night that I've seen him do at various points during the season. I currently reside in Texas right in the heart of Longhorn nation, really, and get to see plenty of Earl Thomas. Thomas has been inconsistent in run support. It's not to say he can't get better or is terrible, he's just not fantastic. His lack of prototypical size does hurt him some as well, but thanks to his sensational coverage ability, field awareness, and hands, his stock is very high. He's simply stellar in that regard. But that's not enough for me to grade him a 1st, and as a result, all this put together is why he grades out to me as a early to middle 2nd rounder.

Make no mistake, Thomas is a very good player, but he's not perfect. I do not aim to take anything away from him, but in terms of talent, you know what I think. However, in terms of projecting where he'll go -- I think a team will indeed bite in the first, pending a horrific combine. In such a pass-oriented league, a player with his skills offers a slightly higher value now.

Seen your link in the other thread, damn you go deep for news and info!!!

As for Thomas we'll just have to wait and see on how his Combine numbers come out to be. But IMO he's exactly what we need in a FS, one word, ballhawk. Would love to see him and Goldson lining up together. But then again, I'm also hoping if we miss on Thomas we target Morgan Burnett....again if he declares. This all came about once I knew Eric Berry would be out of reach. Gotta look for happiness somewhere else.
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by Ninefan56:
Now that the BCS game is about over, who are the players that improved their status and why, and who are those who dropped in their status and why? Also who would be players that we would look at?

Gainers:
DT Lamarr Houston - continued to play hard and was the one guy to consistently get pressure. Beat Mike Johnson badly several times early on.
WR Shipley - Even without their QB, has played extremely well. Two TDs.
CB Arenas - Sure he got beat once on the double-move, but never judge someone on one play. He had one bad play, the entire rest of the game he had/has been very good out there.
ILB McClain - solid all game long. A mistake being offsides, but that's about the only negative you can take from McClain tonight.

Losers:
S Earl Thomas - not physical enough, didn't make a peep in the game.
DT Terrance Cody - simply a situational player, falls deeper into the 2nd round.
SS Woodall - Blown coverages. Woodall may have to move to OLB in the Pro's.

Static (non-moving):
OLB Sergio Kindle - Did some good things, but not enough to really make any significant movement.
OG Mike Johnson - Got beat some early on, but bounce back with some outstanding blocks to even things out.

I wouldn't say "Loser", its not his fault Bama ran the ball 90% of the time with Ingram and Richardson, who Thomas made a nice open field tackle on 3rd and 2. And not physical enough, dude was throwing his body AT the RB's, he could be blamed for miss tackles, but not physical enough C'mon.

Same goes with Cody, Bama knew Texas would pass more so they went with more of a pass rushing front.

We saw two different things last night. Sure, Thomas is not at fault for the fact that Alabama didn't pass much, but it's going to take more than one good tackle in a game to make people believe you have first round talent. Thomas plays Strong Safety for Texas -- Other guys like T.J. Ward, Reshad Jones, Kam Chancellor, even Larry Asante and Kyle McCarthy consistently make noise in both facets of the game no matter what the run-pass ratio. As I said before, Thomas' "ballhawk" status and him getting a bunch of interceptions is not enough.

He lost ground as far as the "1st round" standard that many around here place on him. If he was expected to play like a 2nd rounder or later, that'd be totally different, and I would not classify him as one of the "Losers" of the game. Hope that makes sense.

As far as Cody, that absolutely proves my point. He can't play on every down, and he'll be virtually useless against most passing teams in the league, and in such a pass-happy league these days, would that not concern you? You don't want to spend a 1st on a situational player like that.

So let me get this straight, your going to base one game with an opposing QB passing for only 11 times. BTW Thomas had more than 1 tackle, went head to head with Ingram in the 2nd quarter. In that game and lined up at SS and FS, but due to his cover skills, IMO, he'll be a FS in the NFL.

Oh and BTW Thomas has the same amount of tackles than both TJ Ward and Kam Chancellor, but more solo tackles than Chancellor.

Kolohe! Ward and Chancellor are both 2nd and 3rd round prospects, respectively, and that's the thing -- that's exactly how I see Thomas (2nd, not 3rd, to be clear here). Even Kansas' Darrell Stuckey had 93 tackles, 3.5 TFL and a sack. I'm sure Thomas likely will be a FS when he comes to the NFL, but he should go back to school for one more year and with another good one, he'd probably vault himself into the late 1st to early 2nd.

Regardless of your's or anyone else's draft grades on here, you stated that the Safeties you mentioned make noise regardless of pass vs. run ratio, and that's why I compared the stats. But from the times I've seen him play hes made some pretty solid hits, and in no way would I judge him off this game. Its like after this one game you gave a full college career assessment on Earl Thomas, if you've ever done a scouting report on him in the past I apologize, but that's just the feeling I get.

BTW where did you get 5'9" from?? On the official UT site he's listed at 5'10", regardless he'll probably measure in at 5'9" and 3/8 at the Combine.

I automatically take an inch off, because there were virtually no players that measured "as high" or higher than their listed heights. Plus, just guesstimating, that's what he looks like too, so..

By the way, Thomas is entering the draft.... Canada has the news first. http://www.tsn.ca/ncaa/story/?id=305322.

Thomas did the same thing last night that I've seen him do at various points during the season. I currently reside in Texas right in the heart of Longhorn nation, really, and get to see plenty of Earl Thomas. Thomas has been inconsistent in run support. It's not to say he can't get better or is terrible, he's just not fantastic. His lack of prototypical size does hurt him some as well, but thanks to his sensational coverage ability, field awareness, and hands, his stock is very high. He's simply stellar in that regard. But that's not enough for me to grade him a 1st, and as a result, all this put together is why he grades out to me as a early to middle 2nd rounder.

Make no mistake, Thomas is a very good player, but he's not perfect. I do not aim to take anything away from him, but in terms of talent, you know what I think. However, in terms of projecting where he'll go -- I think a team will indeed bite in the first, pending a horrific combine. In such a pass-oriented league, a player with his skills offers a slightly higher value now.

Seen your link in the other thread, damn you go deep for news and info!!!

As for Thomas we'll just have to wait and see on how his Combine numbers come out to be. But IMO he's exactly what we need in a FS, one word, ballhawk. Would love to see him and Goldson lining up together. But then again, I'm also hoping if we miss on Thomas we target Morgan Burnett....again if he declares. This all came about once I knew Eric Berry would be out of reach. Gotta look for happiness somewhere else.

I bet you we target Reshad Jones of Georgia. And I hope we do. Almost came out as a sophomore, but this year he was ready.

Jones had 4 picks, 73 tackles, 4.5 TFL, 1 FF -- Very good numbers for an SS.