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OFFICIAL Senior Bowl 2010

Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Notes:

- Wayne State's Joique Bell has not disappointed. He's a one-cut and go, no-nonsense runner who won't dance around in the backfield. He reportedly has been doing very well in pass protection and with his size and speed, I expect Bell to go perhaps in the middle rounds. Did not drop any passes that hit his hands.

- WR Taylor Price had an easy pass dropped. Price has inconsistent hands, and this is likely why he'll go in the later rounds despite his speed.

- Graham? Iupati? Both have yet to experience a "bad day."

- Syd'Quan Thompson should not be drafted any higher than the 4th. He doesn't strike me as one of the "tough, thick" small guys, but as a player who will simply be overpowered in the NFL even by other similar-sized players. He cannot play press coverage, and has not been displaying great recovery speed. His only positive asset is a quick break on the ball on shorter routes. That's great, but if he's constantly giving up big plays, he won't last long in the NFL.

- Jacoby Ford made some beautiful adjustments to make some nice catches and displayed good speed and sensational quickness off the snap to beat Kyle Wilson in one-on-one drills.

- I like OLB Koa Misi the more I see him play. He's dropped weight so he's much quicker now, yet still plays with great leverage and has a heck of an initial pop to knock linemen off balance. A great 3-4 OLB prospect in the middle rounds.

- DT Cam Thomas looks like he's really been working at his technique. The only question for him is endurance, as in many games this season he did appear to wear down towards the end. I suppose it's not all that surprising, considering his size. But Thomas has been showing good strength as well as a powerful rip move to break through the grasp of interior linemen.

Ford looks great, I hoped he would slide to the 2nd but I doubt that happens now.

Murphy is VERY physical and looks like a solid CB

Mays is....well......should be a LB

Allen looks good at FS

Iupati was outstanding today. Only issue I can see is he doesn't seem 100% comfortable alone at the edge. With some coaching and time I think he can move to RT easily...not sure about LT.

Thompson doesn't have the top end speed, once he gets hit with a go route he cant keep up.

Cox is looking good.

Dex will be a 2nd round lock.

Wang looked pretty good today. I'm not sure if he's quick enough for LT but he moves pretty well.

Graham was fantastic...only time I saw him get stopped was against Iupati.

Something is up with Cooper, he looks like Braylon Edwards.

Arenas wont be able to match up well with any WR's in the NFL. Looking at him compared to every WR he looks to short and I doubt his vert will be good enough to go up after the ball.

Murphy is practically an Al Harris clone. Now, he has a huge propensity to gamble and is probably going to be beat quite a bit early in his career biting on pump-fakes, unless he can be coached to play more disciplined. 2nd-3rd round projection right now.

If he was sitting in the 3rd I would love to pull the trigger, the kid is violent. And my gf lil sis goes to USF sooooooooo......she can pull some strings since she knows some of the players and could get me some cool s**t.

I agree with Murphy looking really good & I think he is the kind of physical corner Singletary wants out there playing press coverage.
Originally posted by tohara3:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Notes:

- Wayne State's Joique Bell has not disappointed. He's a one-cut and go, no-nonsense runner who won't dance around in the backfield. He reportedly has been doing very well in pass protection and with his size and speed, I expect Bell to go perhaps in the middle rounds. Did not drop any passes that hit his hands.

- WR Taylor Price had an easy pass dropped. Price has inconsistent hands, and this is likely why he'll go in the later rounds despite his speed.

- Graham? Iupati? Both have yet to experience a "bad day."

- Syd'Quan Thompson should not be drafted any higher than the 4th. He doesn't strike me as one of the "tough, thick" small guys, but as a player who will simply be overpowered in the NFL even by other similar-sized players. He cannot play press coverage, and has not been displaying great recovery speed. His only positive asset is a quick break on the ball on shorter routes. That's great, but if he's constantly giving up big plays, he won't last long in the NFL.

- Jacoby Ford made some beautiful adjustments to make some nice catches and displayed good speed and sensational quickness off the snap to beat Kyle Wilson in one-on-one drills.

- I like OLB Koa Misi the more I see him play. He's dropped weight so he's much quicker now, yet still plays with great leverage and has a heck of an initial pop to knock linemen off balance. A great 3-4 OLB prospect in the middle rounds.

- DT Cam Thomas looks like he's really been working at his technique. The only question for him is endurance, as in many games this season he did appear to wear down towards the end. I suppose it's not all that surprising, considering his size. But Thomas has been showing good strength as well as a powerful rip move to break through the grasp of interior linemen.

Ford looks great, I hoped he would slide to the 2nd but I doubt that happens now.

Murphy is VERY physical and looks like a solid CB

Mays is....well......should be a LB

Allen looks good at FS

Iupati was outstanding today. Only issue I can see is he doesn't seem 100% comfortable alone at the edge. With some coaching and time I think he can move to RT easily...not sure about LT.

Thompson doesn't have the top end speed, once he gets hit with a go route he cant keep up.

Cox is looking good.

Dex will be a 2nd round lock.

Wang looked pretty good today. I'm not sure if he's quick enough for LT but he moves pretty well.

Graham was fantastic...only time I saw him get stopped was against Iupati.

Something is up with Cooper, he looks like Braylon Edwards.

Arenas wont be able to match up well with any WR's in the NFL. Looking at him compared to every WR he looks to short and I doubt his vert will be good enough to go up after the ball.

Murphy is practically an Al Harris clone. Now, he has a huge propensity to gamble and is probably going to be beat quite a bit early in his career biting on pump-fakes, unless he can be coached to play more disciplined. 2nd-3rd round projection right now.

If he was sitting in the 3rd I would love to pull the trigger, the kid is violent. And my gf lil sis goes to USF sooooooooo......she can pull some strings since she knows some of the players and could get me some cool s**t.

I agree with Murphy looking really good & I think he is the kind of physical corner Singletary wants out there playing press coverage.

It's possible he could be there in the 3rd. It all depends on how the chips fall. But the first 3 rounds will be loaded with defensive back talent. On my talent-tier board, these are the following players that fall between the 1st and 2nd alone. Nine players.

Patrick Robinson, Florida State
Joe Haden, Florida*
Donovan Warren, Michigan*
Perrish Cox, Oklahoma St.
Brandon Ghee, Wake Forest
Dominique Franks, Oklahoma*
Kareem Jackson, Alabama*
Devin McCourty, Rutgers
Kyle Wilson, Boise St.

If you notice, I grade Murphy as a 3rd round talent -- but on the high end -- mainly because of his lack of discipline. I think he needs a little coaching, but would put up competition immediately.

Others with 3rd round grades include Lindley, Spievey, Thurmond, Arenas and Brian Jackson.
[ Edited by OnTheClock on Jan 27, 2010 at 5:06 PM ]
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by tohara3:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Notes:

- Wayne State's Joique Bell has not disappointed. He's a one-cut and go, no-nonsense runner who won't dance around in the backfield. He reportedly has been doing very well in pass protection and with his size and speed, I expect Bell to go perhaps in the middle rounds. Did not drop any passes that hit his hands.

- WR Taylor Price had an easy pass dropped. Price has inconsistent hands, and this is likely why he'll go in the later rounds despite his speed.

- Graham? Iupati? Both have yet to experience a "bad day."

- Syd'Quan Thompson should not be drafted any higher than the 4th. He doesn't strike me as one of the "tough, thick" small guys, but as a player who will simply be overpowered in the NFL even by other similar-sized players. He cannot play press coverage, and has not been displaying great recovery speed. His only positive asset is a quick break on the ball on shorter routes. That's great, but if he's constantly giving up big plays, he won't last long in the NFL.

- Jacoby Ford made some beautiful adjustments to make some nice catches and displayed good speed and sensational quickness off the snap to beat Kyle Wilson in one-on-one drills.

- I like OLB Koa Misi the more I see him play. He's dropped weight so he's much quicker now, yet still plays with great leverage and has a heck of an initial pop to knock linemen off balance. A great 3-4 OLB prospect in the middle rounds.

- DT Cam Thomas looks like he's really been working at his technique. The only question for him is endurance, as in many games this season he did appear to wear down towards the end. I suppose it's not all that surprising, considering his size. But Thomas has been showing good strength as well as a powerful rip move to break through the grasp of interior linemen.

Ford looks great, I hoped he would slide to the 2nd but I doubt that happens now.

Murphy is VERY physical and looks like a solid CB

Mays is....well......should be a LB

Allen looks good at FS

Iupati was outstanding today. Only issue I can see is he doesn't seem 100% comfortable alone at the edge. With some coaching and time I think he can move to RT easily...not sure about LT.

Thompson doesn't have the top end speed, once he gets hit with a go route he cant keep up.

Cox is looking good.

Dex will be a 2nd round lock.

Wang looked pretty good today. I'm not sure if he's quick enough for LT but he moves pretty well.

Graham was fantastic...only time I saw him get stopped was against Iupati.

Something is up with Cooper, he looks like Braylon Edwards.

Arenas wont be able to match up well with any WR's in the NFL. Looking at him compared to every WR he looks to short and I doubt his vert will be good enough to go up after the ball.

Murphy is practically an Al Harris clone. Now, he has a huge propensity to gamble and is probably going to be beat quite a bit early in his career biting on pump-fakes, unless he can be coached to play more disciplined. 2nd-3rd round projection right now.

If he was sitting in the 3rd I would love to pull the trigger, the kid is violent. And my gf lil sis goes to USF sooooooooo......she can pull some strings since she knows some of the players and could get me some cool s**t.

I agree with Murphy looking really good & I think he is the kind of physical corner Singletary wants out there playing press coverage.

It's possible he could be there in the 3rd. It all depends on how the chips fall. But the first 3 rounds will be loaded with defensive back talent. On my talent-tier board, these are the following players that fall between the 1st and 2nd alone. Nine players.

Patrick Robinson, Florida State
Joe Haden, Florida*
Donovan Warren, Michigan*
Perrish Cox, Oklahoma St.
Brandon Ghee, Wake Forest
Dominique Franks, Oklahoma*
Kareem Jackson, Alabama*
Devin McCourty, Rutgers
Kyle Wilson, Boise St.

If you notice, I grade Murphy as a 3rd round talent -- but on the high end -- mainly because of his lack of discipline. I think he needs a little coaching, but would put up competition immediately.

Others with 3rd round grades include Lindley, Spievey, Thurmond, Arenas and Brian Jackson.

How come Jackson and McCourty aren't playing in the senior bowl? IIRC they played in the shrine game but I could be wrong.
Originally posted by WillistheWall:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by tohara3:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
Notes:

- Wayne State's Joique Bell has not disappointed. He's a one-cut and go, no-nonsense runner who won't dance around in the backfield. He reportedly has been doing very well in pass protection and with his size and speed, I expect Bell to go perhaps in the middle rounds. Did not drop any passes that hit his hands.

- WR Taylor Price had an easy pass dropped. Price has inconsistent hands, and this is likely why he'll go in the later rounds despite his speed.

- Graham? Iupati? Both have yet to experience a "bad day."

- Syd'Quan Thompson should not be drafted any higher than the 4th. He doesn't strike me as one of the "tough, thick" small guys, but as a player who will simply be overpowered in the NFL even by other similar-sized players. He cannot play press coverage, and has not been displaying great recovery speed. His only positive asset is a quick break on the ball on shorter routes. That's great, but if he's constantly giving up big plays, he won't last long in the NFL.

- Jacoby Ford made some beautiful adjustments to make some nice catches and displayed good speed and sensational quickness off the snap to beat Kyle Wilson in one-on-one drills.

- I like OLB Koa Misi the more I see him play. He's dropped weight so he's much quicker now, yet still plays with great leverage and has a heck of an initial pop to knock linemen off balance. A great 3-4 OLB prospect in the middle rounds.

- DT Cam Thomas looks like he's really been working at his technique. The only question for him is endurance, as in many games this season he did appear to wear down towards the end. I suppose it's not all that surprising, considering his size. But Thomas has been showing good strength as well as a powerful rip move to break through the grasp of interior linemen.

Ford looks great, I hoped he would slide to the 2nd but I doubt that happens now.

Murphy is VERY physical and looks like a solid CB

Mays is....well......should be a LB

Allen looks good at FS

Iupati was outstanding today. Only issue I can see is he doesn't seem 100% comfortable alone at the edge. With some coaching and time I think he can move to RT easily...not sure about LT.

Thompson doesn't have the top end speed, once he gets hit with a go route he cant keep up.

Cox is looking good.

Dex will be a 2nd round lock.

Wang looked pretty good today. I'm not sure if he's quick enough for LT but he moves pretty well.

Graham was fantastic...only time I saw him get stopped was against Iupati.

Something is up with Cooper, he looks like Braylon Edwards.

Arenas wont be able to match up well with any WR's in the NFL. Looking at him compared to every WR he looks to short and I doubt his vert will be good enough to go up after the ball.

Murphy is practically an Al Harris clone. Now, he has a huge propensity to gamble and is probably going to be beat quite a bit early in his career biting on pump-fakes, unless he can be coached to play more disciplined. 2nd-3rd round projection right now.

If he was sitting in the 3rd I would love to pull the trigger, the kid is violent. And my gf lil sis goes to USF sooooooooo......she can pull some strings since she knows some of the players and could get me some cool s**t.

I agree with Murphy looking really good & I think he is the kind of physical corner Singletary wants out there playing press coverage.

It's possible he could be there in the 3rd. It all depends on how the chips fall. But the first 3 rounds will be loaded with defensive back talent. On my talent-tier board, these are the following players that fall between the 1st and 2nd alone. Nine players.

Patrick Robinson, Florida State
Joe Haden, Florida*
Donovan Warren, Michigan*
Perrish Cox, Oklahoma St.
Brandon Ghee, Wake Forest
Dominique Franks, Oklahoma*
Kareem Jackson, Alabama*
Devin McCourty, Rutgers
Kyle Wilson, Boise St.

If you notice, I grade Murphy as a 3rd round talent -- but on the high end -- mainly because of his lack of discipline. I think he needs a little coaching, but would put up competition immediately.

Others with 3rd round grades include Lindley, Spievey, Thurmond, Arenas and Brian Jackson.

How come Jackson and McCourty aren't playing in the senior bowl? IIRC they played in the shrine game but I could be wrong.

McCourty is there. They talked about him today, there was brief footage of him.

Jackson was indeed at the Shrine game -- you didn't hear his name called much, and I think that's a good thing. That tells me throws weren't directed at his guy, and he wasn't getting beat. Stephan Virgil, on the other hand, was often out of position.
[ Edited by OnTheClock on Jan 27, 2010 at 5:15 PM ]
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by blizzuntz:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by blizzuntz:
Tebow

Whoever saw him taking snaps from under center and still wants to draft him with a 1st is

Really? One practice, the first day of practice no less, and you're ready to draw conclusions about his ability to take a snap from center?

I agree that Tebow isn't 1st round material, but dude, that's pretty lame.

You are agreeing with me yet I am lame

regardless, Tebow is going to be a project at the QB position. Our team can't afford a project 1st round pick for a while.

He is better suited to be groomed on the sidelines on a team that can afford to wait, a team with few holes

I'll break it down for you, since two things can be equally true.

1.) I agree that Tebow isn't 1st round material.

AND

2.) Nobody in their right mind makes a draft status assessment based on one all-star practice, much less what happens on the 1st day of that practice.

So my point was, I agreed that Tebow isn't a 1st round QB, but not because of what happened during the first session at the Senior Bowl practices. That's literally meaningless.

OK

Tim Tebow wasnt 1st round material before or after the practice
Originally posted by blizzuntz:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by blizzuntz:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by blizzuntz:
Tebow

Whoever saw him taking snaps from under center and still wants to draft him with a 1st is

Really? One practice, the first day of practice no less, and you're ready to draw conclusions about his ability to take a snap from center?

I agree that Tebow isn't 1st round material, but dude, that's pretty lame.

You are agreeing with me yet I am lame

regardless, Tebow is going to be a project at the QB position. Our team can't afford a project 1st round pick for a while.

He is better suited to be groomed on the sidelines on a team that can afford to wait, a team with few holes

I'll break it down for you, since two things can be equally true.

1.) I agree that Tebow isn't 1st round material.

AND

2.) Nobody in their right mind makes a draft status assessment based on one all-star practice, much less what happens on the 1st day of that practice.

So my point was, I agreed that Tebow isn't a 1st round QB, but not because of what happened during the first session at the Senior Bowl practices. That's literally meaningless.

OK

Tim Tebow wasnt 1st round material before or after the practice

You don't get it, do you? I can only explain things, I can't make you understand.

IMO, in your opinion and in the opinion of many, Tebow was not a 1st round pick before or after the senior bowl practices. His performance on the first day has/had nothing to do with his overall evaluation...that is my point. For you to bring that up as some type of "proof" or "example" or "reason" or whatever is and was lame, since it has/had nothing to do with his draft status. He could've handled each and every snap perfectly, and it wouldn't have changed his status one bit. That literally means nothing, which is what I'm trying to explain to you.

Btw, anybody coming into the senior bowl practices this year who thought Tebow was 1st round material was delusional in the first place. The entire year, he's regressed on many fronts, and his weaknesses have really been exposed without many of the weapons he had in prior years. I still think he can play QB in the NFL eventually, but it won't be anytime soon, and it won't be as a 1st round pick.
Originally posted by ninertico:
Originally posted by BrianGO:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Some notes:

* Mike Iupati- A fair number of sites with draft guys on the ground are mentioning that Iupati is the best OL at the Senior Bowl. He is dominant at guard, but his size, arm length and quickness is something teams are looking at in a transition to either LT or RT. Now, he was destroyed in one of the LT drills, but this is a guy who has not been coached up at the position, and I believe some team will find he simply needs to work on his technique. He's not a waist bender, so that is something teams are very interested to observe. Many teams, including the Cowboys, are taking a long, long look.

To me, this has been the choice for some time now, whether he plays RT, RG, LG. I can really care less. When did this team have a dominant, superstar OL? Make the pick at 13, play him anywhere, and move onto the 16th/17th selection.

* Kyle Wilson and Perrish Cox are stealing the show at CB. Both appear to be late first, early second rounders, which is a shame. I do not think either will be on the board when the Niners make their pick in the second round.

* Jon Asamoah of Illinois is such a terrific athlete. This guy is money, and he should be there when the Niners pick in the second round. Imagine how much more athletic we would be replacing Baas and Snyder with Iupati and Asamoah.

* This is the time of the year where the men are separated from the boys. I have loved Brandon Graham for a long time, and he is a STUD football player. He can run around, through, underneath OT's all day long.

Thanks for the analysis.

Iupati is great but I think we need to understand that he is a guard and not a tackle, center etc.

I don't think one should automatically assume that he can play anywhere on the line simply because he is such a great athlete.

I think it is better to understand that he is a guard and if we draft him he will play guard. I would much rather draft Trent Williams as our RT, then hope that Iupati can play better then Trent Williams at RT.

With that understanding in mind, I think our most glaring need is RT, not guard. Therefore, it should be our primary concern at the draft. Therefore, we should only draft Iupati if we have already drafted our RT before.

Williams at 13 and Iupati at 16/17 could work. And then we can get our return man in the second.

If we draft Iupati at 13, Trent Williams and all the top OT prospects could easily be gone by pick 16/17. I don't think a Pro-Bowl guard is worth the risk.

MadDog, thanks for the analysis, too. I appreciate it as always and agree wholeheartedly on your position on Iupati.

And B, you would pigeon-toe Iupati just as an OG therefore not deserving of a mid-first round grade?

I am just as excited as MadDog about Iupati...again like so many others, he has that "IT" factor. If, and a big if, he was need to play OT on the RT, I am sure Mr. Solari can help him out. For now, stick him at LOG from day one and have Baas and Rachal battle for the next spot. Then, stick a nice ROT prospect in like Calloway, for example, who impressed me at the Shrine game. Great value, IMO.

To dovetail into the thread's essence, I just saw the North practice. I came away impressed with Iupati even more because he had never played LOT and was willing to try. For the first time in practice, give the guy a break. He can be coached, you could see the eagerness to do what it takes...man, I can see Solari lickin' his chops...I know I would...sorry for the digression, but he just is "IT" in OL. Would you spend #13 for Larry Allen? You know you would.

Heck, he may be taken by Carroll at #14, but I really think they would take a solid LOT prospect at that spot instead.

Because of that wonderful extra first round pick, we have the ability to do some great things for this team.

OL, IMO, must be two of the top four picks in this draft, two. One of the other two picks will be a RS with value at either WR/RB, both or a CB, IMO. The other will be either secondary or pass rusher.

At least, that is what I hope for now a days.


If I knew Iupati was the next Larry Allen, I would draft him with the #1 OVERALL pick in the draft. Larry Allen is the best OLman to ever play the game, and one of the top 5 football players of all time.
Larry Allen had a kind of raw strength and leverage that few human beings on the planet Earth possess. Does Iupati have that kind of strength?

Don't get me wrong, Iupati is great, I just think he's a LITTLE overrated on this board. About 3 or 4 slots overrated.

If we miss out on Williams or Bulaga, who are we going to draft at RT? Ciron "fat ass" Black? Is Tony Pashos going to give Alex Smith time? Time is the thing that many on this board suggest is the one thing holding Alex Smith back...
"Smith doesn't have enough time."
"Our line gives Smith only 2.5 milliseconds to throw a pass."
"Our line sucks."
"If Smith had time he would be great." etc...

The level of RT talent drops dramatically after Bulaga and Williams. So we're going to miss out on those players so we can draft a guard at 13 who most scouts put at around 20+?

If we miss out on this chance at drafting a RT, when are we going to get another chance? Free agency? Next year?

This draft is a PERFECT draft for RT in the first round with Bulaga and Williams, especially Williams.

Would you rather have an All-Pro RT or an All-Pro LG? Williams will be a great RT, Iupati MIGHT be a great RT.

We have needed a RT SO badly for SO many years, and we're going to risk it because we don't want to lose a guard who most believe will be available at the 17/16 slot anyway?

Is David Baas so bad (did he even allow a sack last season?) that we have to risk losing our PRIME opportunity to draft a quality, perhaps Pro-Bowl RT, which we have been in DESPERATE need of for almost an entire DECADE?

Williams at 13, Iupati at 16/17 sounds good to me. And in the epic disaster where Iupati is picked at 15, we can get Spiller at 16/17 and draft a darn good guard in the second round.
[ Edited by BrianGO on Jan 27, 2010 at 11:45 PM ]
Originally posted by BrianGO:
Originally posted by ninertico:
Originally posted by BrianGO:
Originally posted by MadDog49er:
Some notes:

* Mike Iupati- A fair number of sites with draft guys on the ground are mentioning that Iupati is the best OL at the Senior Bowl. He is dominant at guard, but his size, arm length and quickness is something teams are looking at in a transition to either LT or RT. Now, he was destroyed in one of the LT drills, but this is a guy who has not been coached up at the position, and I believe some team will find he simply needs to work on his technique. He's not a waist bender, so that is something teams are very interested to observe. Many teams, including the Cowboys, are taking a long, long look.

To me, this has been the choice for some time now, whether he plays RT, RG, LG. I can really care less. When did this team have a dominant, superstar OL? Make the pick at 13, play him anywhere, and move onto the 16th/17th selection.

* Kyle Wilson and Perrish Cox are stealing the show at CB. Both appear to be late first, early second rounders, which is a shame. I do not think either will be on the board when the Niners make their pick in the second round.

* Jon Asamoah of Illinois is such a terrific athlete. This guy is money, and he should be there when the Niners pick in the second round. Imagine how much more athletic we would be replacing Baas and Snyder with Iupati and Asamoah.

* This is the time of the year where the men are separated from the boys. I have loved Brandon Graham for a long time, and he is a STUD football player. He can run around, through, underneath OT's all day long.

Thanks for the analysis.

Iupati is great but I think we need to understand that he is a guard and not a tackle, center etc.

I don't think one should automatically assume that he can play anywhere on the line simply because he is such a great athlete.

I think it is better to understand that he is a guard and if we draft him he will play guard. I would much rather draft Trent Williams as our RT, then hope that Iupati can play better then Trent Williams at RT.

With that understanding in mind, I think our most glaring need is RT, not guard. Therefore, it should be our primary concern at the draft. Therefore, we should only draft Iupati if we have already drafted our RT before.

Williams at 13 and Iupati at 16/17 could work. And then we can get our return man in the second.

If we draft Iupati at 13, Trent Williams and all the top OT prospects could easily be gone by pick 16/17. I don't think a Pro-Bowl guard is worth the risk.

MadDog, thanks for the analysis, too. I appreciate it as always and agree wholeheartedly on your position on Iupati.

And B, you would pigeon-toe Iupati just as an OG therefore not deserving of a mid-first round grade?

I am just as excited as MadDog about Iupati...again like so many others, he has that "IT" factor. If, and a big if, he was need to play OT on the RT, I am sure Mr. Solari can help him out. For now, stick him at LOG from day one and have Baas and Rachal battle for the next spot. Then, stick a nice ROT prospect in like Calloway, for example, who impressed me at the Shrine game. Great value, IMO.

To dovetail into the thread's essence, I just saw the North practice. I came away impressed with Iupati even more because he had never played LOT and was willing to try. For the first time in practice, give the guy a break. He can be coached, you could see the eagerness to do what it takes...man, I can see Solari lickin' his chops...I know I would...sorry for the digression, but he just is "IT" in OL. Would you spend #13 for Larry Allen? You know you would.

Heck, he may be taken by Carroll at #14, but I really think they would take a solid LOT prospect at that spot instead.

Because of that wonderful extra first round pick, we have the ability to do some great things for this team.

OL, IMO, must be two of the top four picks in this draft, two. One of the other two picks will be a RS with value at either WR/RB, both or a CB, IMO. The other will be either secondary or pass rusher.

At least, that is what I hope for now a days.


If I knew Iupati was the next Larry Allen, I would draft him with the #1 OVERALL pick in the draft. Larry Allen is the best OLman to ever play the game, and one of the top 5 football players of all time.
Larry Allen had a kind of raw strength and leverage that few human beings on the planet Earth possess. Does Iupati have that kind of strength?

Don't get me wrong, Iupati is great, I just think he's a LITTLE overrated on this board. About 3 or 4 slots overrated.

If we miss out on Williams or Bulaga, who are we going to draft at RT? Ciron "fat ass" Black? Is Tony Pashos going to give Alex Smith time? Time is the thing that many on this board suggest is the one thing holding Alex Smith back...
"Smith doesn't have enough time."
"Our line gives Smith only 2.5 milliseconds to throw a pass."
"Our line sucks."
"If Smith had time he would be great." etc...

The level of RT talent drops dramatically after Bulaga and Williams. So we're going to miss out on those players so we can draft a guard at 13 who most scouts put at around 20+?

If we miss out on this chance at drafting a RT, when are we going to get another chance? Free agency? Next year?

This draft is a PERFECT draft for RT in the first round with Bulaga and Williams, especially Williams.

Would you rather have an All-Pro RT or an All-Pro LG? Williams will be a great RT, Iupati MIGHT be a great RT.

We have needed a RT SO badly for SO many years, and we're going to risk it because we don't want to lose a guard who most believe will be available at the 17/16 slot anyway?

Is David Baas so bad (did he even allow a sack last season?) that we have to risk losing our PRIME opportunity to draft a quality, perhaps Pro-Bowl RT, which we have been in DESPERATE need of for almost an entire DECADE?

Williams at 13, Iupati at 16/17 sounds good to me. And in the epic disaster where Iupati is picked at 15, we can get Spiller at 16/17 and draft a darn good guard in the second round.

BrianGo, you get a big, fat...
+1
Originally posted by SF69ers:
Originally posted by YuNGaCE:
when is it ?

Senior Bowl is on Saturday.

good looking out bro. this is going to be one hell of a game.
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by blizzuntz:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by blizzuntz:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by blizzuntz:
Tebow

Whoever saw him taking snaps from under center and still wants to draft him with a 1st is

Really? One practice, the first day of practice no less, and you're ready to draw conclusions about his ability to take a snap from center?

I agree that Tebow isn't 1st round material, but dude, that's pretty lame.

You are agreeing with me yet I am lame

regardless, Tebow is going to be a project at the QB position. Our team can't afford a project 1st round pick for a while.

He is better suited to be groomed on the sidelines on a team that can afford to wait, a team with few holes

I'll break it down for you, since two things can be equally true.

1.) I agree that Tebow isn't 1st round material.

AND

2.) Nobody in their right mind makes a draft status assessment based on one all-star practice, much less what happens on the 1st day of that practice.

So my point was, I agreed that Tebow isn't a 1st round QB, but not because of what happened during the first session at the Senior Bowl practices. That's literally meaningless.

OK

Tim Tebow wasnt 1st round material before or after the practice

You don't get it, do you? I can only explain things, I can't make you understand.

IMO, in your opinion and in the opinion of many, Tebow was not a 1st round pick before or after the senior bowl practices. His performance on the first day has/had nothing to do with his overall evaluation...that is my point. For you to bring that up as some type of "proof" or "example" or "reason" or whatever is and was lame, since it has/had nothing to do with his draft status. He could've handled each and every snap perfectly, and it wouldn't have changed his status one bit. That literally means nothing, which is what I'm trying to explain to you.

Btw, anybody coming into the senior bowl practices this year who thought Tebow was 1st round material was delusional in the first place. The entire year, he's regressed on many fronts, and his weaknesses have really been exposed without many of the weapons he had in prior years. I still think he can play QB in the NFL eventually, but it won't be anytime soon, and it won't be as a 1st round pick.

Yeah, OK

Everything that happened at the practice proved many people's reasoning as to why he is not a 1st round pick. But it is pretty cute how you are trying to twist my words into something else that is pretty "clear" and so "clear" that you agree.
Can Alex Carrington play end in our 3-4? He's listed at 6'5" 284lbs. He seems to be impressing many at the senior Bowl.

How far has Jacoby Ford jumped up draft boards? I know its early but he says he will run a 4.2 forty at the combine. He reportedly ran a 4.126 in high school I think he may go in the 3rd round now.
Originally posted by miked1978:
Can Alex Carrington play end in our 3-4? He's listed at 6'5" 284lbs. He seems to be impressing many at the senior Bowl.

How far has Jacoby Ford jumped up draft boards? I know its early but he says he will run a 4.2 forty at the combine. He reportedly ran a 4.126 in high school I think he may go in the 3rd round now.

Ford should be gone in the 2nd.
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by miked1978:
Can Alex Carrington play end in our 3-4? He's listed at 6'5" 284lbs. He seems to be impressing many at the senior Bowl.

How far has Jacoby Ford jumped up draft boards? I know its early but he says he will run a 4.2 forty at the combine. He reportedly ran a 4.126 in high school I think he may go in the 3rd round now.

Ford should be gone in the 2nd.

In February 2009, at the Virginia Tech Elite Meet, Ford ran a 6.52-second 60-meter dash, which was one-hundredth of a second shy of an NCAA record.
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by miked1978:
Can Alex Carrington play end in our 3-4? He's listed at 6'5" 284lbs. He seems to be impressing many at the senior Bowl.

How far has Jacoby Ford jumped up draft boards? I know its early but he says he will run a 4.2 forty at the combine. He reportedly ran a 4.126 in high school I think he may go in the 3rd round now.

Ford should be gone in the 2nd.

Yeah, I thought Ford was a third rounder going into the offseason, but he seems to be turning a lot of heads in Mobile. He absolutely has a great chance to get in the 4.2 range at the combine. The Packers are apparently looking at him very seriously, and other teams are starting to take note. Here's some stuff on him from yesterday:

Sporting News: Clemson WR Jacoby Ford clearly has established himself as the most polished receiver on the North roster. He runs precise routes and shows the acceleration to separate out of cuts. We also were impressed with his ability to escape jams, using his quickness to get cornerbacks to open their hips early.

Detroit Press: Clemson wide receiver Jacoby Ford: The quarterbacks seem most comfortable going to Ford, who has caught more passes than anyone else in practice. He’s a slot receiver who also returns kicks and punts – all needs for the Lions. He’s speedy, though Jefferson said he needs to show it more.


Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel: Thanks to the success of undersized players like DeSean Jackson of the Philadelphia Eagles and Ray Rice of the Baltimore Ravens, players like Dexter McCluster and Jacoby Ford are being looked at hard by several teams, including the Green Bay Packers.
"Definitely they've helped us," said McCluster, the 5-foot-8, 165-pound running back from Ole Miss. "They're having great success in the league, especially (Jackson). He's just showing his vision, his speed, and he's a playmaker. If you're a playmaker, they'll find a spot for you."

It's that ability to make plays with just a touch of the ball that makes McCluster and Ford, the 5-8, 181-pound receiver from Clemson, so wanted by NFL teams.

"Well, they're super fast," said Detroit Lions coach Jim Schwartz, a former defensive coordinator. "There's a lot of things that you can do scheme-wise. Speed is not one of them.

"Touchdowns in the NFL are hard to come by. When you have players that can score, you're going to find a way to get the ball in their hands."

Smaller players who are also threats on special teams are big assets, according to Miami Dolphins coach Tony Sparano.

"Finding a returner in this league, is a major, major plus, it really is," Sparano said. "When you find a player like that, he turns a game around like that.

"For a smaller player, the returnability, the amount of jobs he can do, maybe as a receiver in the Wildcat package, some flexibility that way, you can start to count touches in your head and say, 'I can get this guy X amount of plays and X amount of touches per game.'"

The Packers have been watching the running backs closely this week, especially guys like McCluster and Ford because they are looking to upgrade their return game.


If we don't get Spiller in the first, I really hope we take a run at one of these guys quickly thereafter.
Originally posted by blizzuntz:
Originally posted by jreff22:
Originally posted by miked1978:
Can Alex Carrington play end in our 3-4? He's listed at 6'5" 284lbs. He seems to be impressing many at the senior Bowl.

How far has Jacoby Ford jumped up draft boards? I know its early but he says he will run a 4.2 forty at the combine. He reportedly ran a 4.126 in high school I think he may go in the 3rd round now.

Ford should be gone in the 2nd.

In February 2009, at the Virginia Tech Elite Meet, Ford ran a 6.52-second 60-meter dash, which was one-hundredth of a second shy of an NCAA record.

The kid is fast but has shown pretty good route running so far. I could see him slide into the late first but he shouldn't fall out of the 2nd. Ford and Spiller should have fun running at the combine.
[ Edited by jreff22 on Jan 28, 2010 at 6:08 AM ]