There are 123 users in the forums

Remember
Not a member? Register Now!

if calvin johnson and crabs were in the same draft ...

  • fan49
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,167
Originally posted by 49ersMyLife:
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by TheBlueHell:
Calvin Johnson is the best collegiate receiver I've ever seen, especially considering he had Reggie Ball for a QB.

Megatron>>>>>>anybody in college

really while getting 1100 yards less. by far crabs out did him in college. no way i can agree with you with the numbers slanted heavy one way.

Again, production is just one thing. There is a reason why Calvin went no. 2 (even though, if Al Davis wasn't senile, he would have gone no.1) and Crabtree went no. 10 (again, Al Davis) - but the point is, there were couple of concerns about Crabtree coming into the draft by the GMs:

1. Is he healthy?
2. Speed?
3. The offense he played in jacked up his numbers
4. Getting off the scrimmage

I can't recall one concern about Calvin Johnson. Not one.

I'm not hating on Crabtree. He was my favorite player in college football for last two years. If we had a top 5 pick, I would have wanted him. I really do expect him to do great things for us, and make multiple Pro-bowls. But, CJ is going to be the best WR in NFL for the next 10 years if Staffords turns out a half-way decent QB.

Crabtree may get there, but as of right now, he has more holes in his game than CJ did in his rookie year when it comes to playing in NFL.

1. yes he will be healthy. kris carter answered that. He said i had the same exact injury, same exact surgery early in his career. and look at carter.
4. sullivan will fix that.
[ Edited by fan49 on Jul 8, 2009 at 3:45 PM ]
  • 4ML
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 28,429
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by 49ersMyLife:
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by TheBlueHell:
Calvin Johnson is the best collegiate receiver I've ever seen, especially considering he had Reggie Ball for a QB.

Megatron>>>>>>anybody in college

really while getting 1100 yards less. by far crabs out did him in college. no way i can agree with you with the numbers slanted heavy one way.

Again, production is just one thing. There is a reason why Calvin went no. 2 (even though, if Al Davis wasn't senile, he would have gone no.1) and Crabtree went no. 10 (again, Al Davis) - but the point is, there were couple of concerns about Crabtree coming into the draft by the GMs:

1. Is he healthy?
2. Speed?
3. The offense he played in jacked up his numbers
4. Getting off the scrimmage

I can't recall one concern about Calvin Johnson. Not one.

I'm not hating on Crabtree. He was my favorite player in college football for last two years. If we had a top 5 pick, I would have wanted him. I really do expect him to do great things for us, and make multiple Pro-bowls. But, CJ is going to be the best WR in NFL for the next 10 years if Staffords turns out a half-way decent QB.

Crabtree may get there, but as of right now, he has more holes in his game than CJ did in his rookie year when it comes to playing in NFL.

1. yes he will be healthy. kris carter answered that. He said i had the same exact injury, same exact surgery early in his career. and look at carter.
4. sullivan will fix that.

Exactly, I feel the same way, but that's what I'm saying. He had some concerns, whereas CJ didn't. Potential has a lot to do with draft status, and as draft was getting close, many felt Crabtree's attitude was also a concern, though I never understood that. Teams may be floating those rumors, who knows, but again, CJ didn't have any of these concerns, which IMO, makes him more attractive to several GMs if not all.
Depends on where the Raiders are picking... and even then, they'd take the fastest WR in the combine.

- 98
Doesn't matter, Crabtree is ours now and all who picked ahead of us will have regrets for years to come.
  • fan49
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,167
Originally posted by 49ersMyLife:
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by 49ersMyLife:
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by TheBlueHell:
Calvin Johnson is the best collegiate receiver I've ever seen, especially considering he had Reggie Ball for a QB.

Megatron>>>>>>anybody in college

really while getting 1100 yards less. by far crabs out did him in college. no way i can agree with you with the numbers slanted heavy one way.

Again, production is just one thing. There is a reason why Calvin went no. 2 (even though, if Al Davis wasn't senile, he would have gone no.1) and Crabtree went no. 10 (again, Al Davis) - but the point is, there were couple of concerns about Crabtree coming into the draft by the GMs:

1. Is he healthy?
2. Speed?
3. The offense he played in jacked up his numbers
4. Getting off the scrimmage

I can't recall one concern about Calvin Johnson. Not one.

I'm not hating on Crabtree. He was my favorite player in college football for last two years. If we had a top 5 pick, I would have wanted him. I really do expect him to do great things for us, and make multiple Pro-bowls. But, CJ is going to be the best WR in NFL for the next 10 years if Staffords turns out a half-way decent QB.

Crabtree may get there, but as of right now, he has more holes in his game than CJ did in his rookie year when it comes to playing in NFL.

1. yes he will be healthy. kris carter answered that. He said i had the same exact injury, same exact surgery early in his career. and look at carter.
4. sullivan will fix that.

Exactly, I feel the same way, but that's what I'm saying. He had some concerns, whereas CJ didn't. Potential has a lot to do with draft status, and as draft was getting close, many felt Crabtree's attitude was also a concern, though I never understood that. Teams may be floating those rumors, who knows, but again, CJ didn't have any of these concerns, which IMO, makes him more attractive to several GMs if not all.

i personnally do not see any reason for taken a reciever who got 1100 less yards in 1 season than the other. but maybe thats why im not a gm.....
  • fan49
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,167
Originally posted by manzano16:
Doesn't matter, Crabtree is ours now and all who picked ahead of us will have regrets for years to come.

Originally posted by manzano16:
Doesn't matter, Crabtree is ours now and all who picked ahead of us will have regrets for years to come.

Optimus Prime
  • 4ML
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 28,429
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by 49ersMyLife:
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by 49ersMyLife:
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by TheBlueHell:
Calvin Johnson is the best collegiate receiver I've ever seen, especially considering he had Reggie Ball for a QB.

Megatron>>>>>>anybody in college

really while getting 1100 yards less. by far crabs out did him in college. no way i can agree with you with the numbers slanted heavy one way.

Again, production is just one thing. There is a reason why Calvin went no. 2 (even though, if Al Davis wasn't senile, he would have gone no.1) and Crabtree went no. 10 (again, Al Davis) - but the point is, there were couple of concerns about Crabtree coming into the draft by the GMs:

1. Is he healthy?
2. Speed?
3. The offense he played in jacked up his numbers
4. Getting off the scrimmage

I can't recall one concern about Calvin Johnson. Not one.

I'm not hating on Crabtree. He was my favorite player in college football for last two years. If we had a top 5 pick, I would have wanted him. I really do expect him to do great things for us, and make multiple Pro-bowls. But, CJ is going to be the best WR in NFL for the next 10 years if Staffords turns out a half-way decent QB.

Crabtree may get there, but as of right now, he has more holes in his game than CJ did in his rookie year when it comes to playing in NFL.

1. yes he will be healthy. kris carter answered that. He said i had the same exact injury, same exact surgery early in his career. and look at carter.
4. sullivan will fix that.

Exactly, I feel the same way, but that's what I'm saying. He had some concerns, whereas CJ didn't. Potential has a lot to do with draft status, and as draft was getting close, many felt Crabtree's attitude was also a concern, though I never understood that. Teams may be floating those rumors, who knows, but again, CJ didn't have any of these concerns, which IMO, makes him more attractive to several GMs if not all.

i personnally do not see any reason for taken a reciever who got 1100 less yards in 1 season than the other. but maybe thats why im not a gm.....

I'm not a GM either.

But, I follow the draft closely, which I'm sure you do too, since you are posting in Draft Room in June and July, but GM's overlook the production for potential all the time. Take this for example, Peerless Price was 1000+ yard WR in Buffalo but when Atlanta signed him to play WR for them, he tanked. Why? He was a no.2 WR in Buffalo and that's the reason for all those stats and numbers. He got 1-on-1 coverage, and capitalized. When Atlanta singed him to be their no.1 WR, he flopped. So, production is great, but you have to analyze and study the tape and see what are the reasons for great numbers or not to great numbers.

Production is just one aspect, and should never be the only aspect.
  • fan49
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,167
Originally posted by 49ersMyLife:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
Originally posted by fan49:
Calvin Johnson


YEAR REC YDS AVG LNG TD ATT YDS AVG LNG TD FUM LST
2004 48 837 17.4 51 7 3 10 3.3 7 1 0 0
2005 54 888 16.4 59 6 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0
2006 76

Micheal Crabtree
2007 134 1962 14.6 75 22 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0
2008 97 1165 12.0 82 19 2 1 0.5 3 0 0 0

Yeah I would easily pick calvin over crabs..... please with out knowledge of cj's career in nfl how could I not pick crabs

i think CJ still goes first because NFL teams love size/speed ratio. and CJ is a freak in that department. hes huge, fast, sure handed, has hops. hes dope. Crabs should be pretty damn good himself, those numbers dont lie. crabtree was a YAC machine in college, they knock his speed but i didnt see him get caught very many times from behind. i was so excited when the raiders passed on him. we'll see in a couple years where our guy is at compared to CJ who already is one of the top receivers in the league. crabs should be up there soon.

i dont know crabs had 1100 more yards fresh year. and while injured he still beat him by around 300 y. yeah i know stats don't, and different comp. either way 1100 yards more..... come on. thats serious. 1900 vs 800 yards.

very true, i would take crabs too because i say production is the only thing i would look at in selecting someone, obviously theyre doing something right if they put up good numbers. im just saying that most scouts see guys with freakish measurables like CJ and VD and they take them over people with better numbers. like Al davis for instance, he takes bey who isnt half the receiver crabtree is just because he's really fast. stuff like that.

You guys are not looking at the system both guys were in. And, look at their QBs. And of course size and speed matters. It's very important how the players game and skill translate to the next level. This is where CJ separates not just Crabtree, but every Wr that has ever been drafted.

Stats in college are just one of the parameters. If you look at just the production, you will end up drafting great college players who can't play in the NFL and there are plenty of those guys. Some college greats don't even make it to the NFL.

i have looked at those. but 1100 yards is a huge seperation no matter what system.
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by 49ersMyLife:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
Originally posted by fan49:
Calvin Johnson


YEAR REC YDS AVG LNG TD ATT YDS AVG LNG TD FUM LST
2004 48 837 17.4 51 7 3 10 3.3 7 1 0 0
2005 54 888 16.4 59 6 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0
2006 76

Micheal Crabtree
2007 134 1962 14.6 75 22 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0
2008 97 1165 12.0 82 19 2 1 0.5 3 0 0 0

Yeah I would easily pick calvin over crabs..... please with out knowledge of cj's career in nfl how could I not pick crabs

i think CJ still goes first because NFL teams love size/speed ratio. and CJ is a freak in that department. hes huge, fast, sure handed, has hops. hes dope. Crabs should be pretty damn good himself, those numbers dont lie. crabtree was a YAC machine in college, they knock his speed but i didnt see him get caught very many times from behind. i was so excited when the raiders passed on him. we'll see in a couple years where our guy is at compared to CJ who already is one of the top receivers in the league. crabs should be up there soon.

i dont know crabs had 1100 more yards fresh year. and while injured he still beat him by around 300 y. yeah i know stats don't, and different comp. either way 1100 yards more..... come on. thats serious. 1900 vs 800 yards.

very true, i would take crabs too because i say production is the only thing i would look at in selecting someone, obviously theyre doing something right if they put up good numbers. im just saying that most scouts see guys with freakish measurables like CJ and VD and they take them over people with better numbers. like Al davis for instance, he takes bey who isnt half the receiver crabtree is just because he's really fast. stuff like that.

You guys are not looking at the system both guys were in. And, look at their QBs. And of course size and speed matters. It's very important how the players game and skill translate to the next level. This is where CJ separates not just Crabtree, but every Wr that has ever been drafted.

Stats in college are just one of the parameters. If you look at just the production, you will end up drafting great college players who can't play in the NFL and there are plenty of those guys. Some college greats don't even make it to the NFL.

i have looked at those. but 1100 yards is a huge seperation no matter what system.

I think stats are important but in a spread system these guys are right. numbers highly inflated. Im reminded of Timmy Chang, broke NCAA record for most career passing yards. barely got drafted or undrafted. hes in the CFL right now.

Besides that I think CJ's yards avg is way superior to Crabtree which I think is somthing overlooked. with double sometimes triple coverage to both one got more yards per catch.

All that being said itts very very very hard to overlook one key stat.Crabtree had 94% passes thrown his way caught. now BECAUSE hes in a spread system that number is even more impressive. non stop passes come his way. and hes snagging 94% of passes? That is the definition of hands. We havent had potential safe mits like that since Jerry.
[ Edited by ruthless49er on Jul 11, 2009 at 6:33 AM ]
Originally posted by ruthless49er:
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by 49ersMyLife:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
Originally posted by fan49:
Calvin Johnson


YEAR REC YDS AVG LNG TD ATT YDS AVG LNG TD FUM LST
2004 48 837 17.4 51 7 3 10 3.3 7 1 0 0
2005 54 888 16.4 59 6 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0
2006 76

Micheal Crabtree
2007 134 1962 14.6 75 22 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0
2008 97 1165 12.0 82 19 2 1 0.5 3 0 0 0

Yeah I would easily pick calvin over crabs..... please with out knowledge of cj's career in nfl how could I not pick crabs

i think CJ still goes first because NFL teams love size/speed ratio. and CJ is a freak in that department. hes huge, fast, sure handed, has hops. hes dope. Crabs should be pretty damn good himself, those numbers dont lie. crabtree was a YAC machine in college, they knock his speed but i didnt see him get caught very many times from behind. i was so excited when the raiders passed on him. we'll see in a couple years where our guy is at compared to CJ who already is one of the top receivers in the league. crabs should be up there soon.

i dont know crabs had 1100 more yards fresh year. and while injured he still beat him by around 300 y. yeah i know stats don't, and different comp. either way 1100 yards more..... come on. thats serious. 1900 vs 800 yards.

very true, i would take crabs too because i say production is the only thing i would look at in selecting someone, obviously theyre doing something right if they put up good numbers. im just saying that most scouts see guys with freakish measurables like CJ and VD and they take them over people with better numbers. like Al davis for instance, he takes bey who isnt half the receiver crabtree is just because he's really fast. stuff like that.

You guys are not looking at the system both guys were in. And, look at their QBs. And of course size and speed matters. It's very important how the players game and skill translate to the next level. This is where CJ separates not just Crabtree, but every Wr that has ever been drafted.

Stats in college are just one of the parameters. If you look at just the production, you will end up drafting great college players who can't play in the NFL and there are plenty of those guys. Some college greats don't even make it to the NFL.

i have looked at those. but 1100 yards is a huge seperation no matter what system.

I think stats are important but in a spread system these guys are right. numbers highly inflated. Im reminded of Timmy Chang, broke NCAA record for most career passing yards. barely got drafted or undrafted. hes in the CFL right now.

Besides that I think CJ's yards avg is way superior to Crabtree which I think is somthing overlooked. with double sometimes triple coverage to both one got more yards per catch.

All that being said itts very very very hard to overlook one key stat.Crabtree had 94% passes thrown his way caught. now BECAUSE hes in a spread system that number is even more impressive. non stop passes come his way. and hes snagging 94% of passes? That is the definition of hands. We havent had potential safe mits like that since Jerry.
  • fan49
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,167
Originally posted by manzano16:
Doesn't matter, Crabtree is ours now and all who picked ahead of us will have regrets for years to come.

  • rob28
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 561
Originally posted by mike9er:
if calvin and michael were in the same draft who would be taken first. what are the chances that mc is gonna be a stud. i hope that we don't have a bust. im a big believer of karma and i have been rubbing it in my raider loving friend's face since the draft. i hope karma doesn't bite me in the arse.
calvin johnson by far.
  • fan49
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,167
Originally posted by ruthless49er:
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by 49ersMyLife:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
Originally posted by fan49:
Calvin Johnson


YEAR REC YDS AVG LNG TD ATT YDS AVG LNG TD FUM LST
2004 48 837 17.4 51 7 3 10 3.3 7 1 0 0
2005 54 888 16.4 59 6 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0
2006 76

Micheal Crabtree
2007 134 1962 14.6 75 22 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0
2008 97 1165 12.0 82 19 2 1 0.5 3 0 0 0

Yeah I would easily pick calvin over crabs..... please with out knowledge of cj's career in nfl how could I not pick crabs

i think CJ still goes first because NFL teams love size/speed ratio. and CJ is a freak in that department. hes huge, fast, sure handed, has hops. hes dope. Crabs should be pretty damn good himself, those numbers dont lie. crabtree was a YAC machine in college, they knock his speed but i didnt see him get caught very many times from behind. i was so excited when the raiders passed on him. we'll see in a couple years where our guy is at compared to CJ who already is one of the top receivers in the league. crabs should be up there soon.

i dont know crabs had 1100 more yards fresh year. and while injured he still beat him by around 300 y. yeah i know stats don't, and different comp. either way 1100 yards more..... come on. thats serious. 1900 vs 800 yards.

very true, i would take crabs too because i say production is the only thing i would look at in selecting someone, obviously theyre doing something right if they put up good numbers. im just saying that most scouts see guys with freakish measurables like CJ and VD and they take them over people with better numbers. like Al davis for instance, he takes bey who isnt half the receiver crabtree is just because he's really fast. stuff like that.

You guys are not looking at the system both guys were in. And, look at their QBs. And of course size and speed matters. It's very important how the players game and skill translate to the next level. This is where CJ separates not just Crabtree, but every Wr that has ever been drafted.

Stats in college are just one of the parameters. If you look at just the production, you will end up drafting great college players who can't play in the NFL and there are plenty of those guys. Some college greats don't even make it to the NFL.

i have looked at those. but 1100 yards is a huge seperation no matter what system.

I think stats are important but in a spread system these guys are right. numbers highly inflated. Im reminded of Timmy Chang, broke NCAA record for most career passing yards. barely got drafted or undrafted. hes in the CFL right now.

Besides that I think CJ's yards avg is way superior to Crabtree which I think is somthing overlooked. with double sometimes triple coverage to both one got more yards per catch.

All that being said itts very very very hard to overlook one key stat.Crabtree had 94% passes thrown his way caught. now BECAUSE hes in a spread system that number is even more impressive. non stop passes come his way. and hes snagging 94% of passes? That is the definition of hands. We havent had potential safe mits like that since Jerry.

a few more yards 3-4, i couldnt tell you if johnson was double teamed, but crabs sure was doubled and trippled
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by ruthless49er:
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by 49ersMyLife:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
Originally posted by fan49:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
Originally posted by fan49:
Calvin Johnson


YEAR REC YDS AVG LNG TD ATT YDS AVG LNG TD FUM LST
2004 48 837 17.4 51 7 3 10 3.3 7 1 0 0
2005 54 888 16.4 59 6 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0
2006 76

Micheal Crabtree
2007 134 1962 14.6 75 22 0 0 0.0 0 0 0 0
2008 97 1165 12.0 82 19 2 1 0.5 3 0 0 0

Yeah I would easily pick calvin over crabs..... please with out knowledge of cj's career in nfl how could I not pick crabs

i think CJ still goes first because NFL teams love size/speed ratio. and CJ is a freak in that department. hes huge, fast, sure handed, has hops. hes dope. Crabs should be pretty damn good himself, those numbers dont lie. crabtree was a YAC machine in college, they knock his speed but i didnt see him get caught very many times from behind. i was so excited when the raiders passed on him. we'll see in a couple years where our guy is at compared to CJ who already is one of the top receivers in the league. crabs should be up there soon.

i dont know crabs had 1100 more yards fresh year. and while injured he still beat him by around 300 y. yeah i know stats don't, and different comp. either way 1100 yards more..... come on. thats serious. 1900 vs 800 yards.

very true, i would take crabs too because i say production is the only thing i would look at in selecting someone, obviously theyre doing something right if they put up good numbers. im just saying that most scouts see guys with freakish measurables like CJ and VD and they take them over people with better numbers. like Al davis for instance, he takes bey who isnt half the receiver crabtree is just because he's really fast. stuff like that.

You guys are not looking at the system both guys were in. And, look at their QBs. And of course size and speed matters. It's very important how the players game and skill translate to the next level. This is where CJ separates not just Crabtree, but every Wr that has ever been drafted.

Stats in college are just one of the parameters. If you look at just the production, you will end up drafting great college players who can't play in the NFL and there are plenty of those guys. Some college greats don't even make it to the NFL.

i have looked at those. but 1100 yards is a huge seperation no matter what system.

I think stats are important but in a spread system these guys are right. numbers highly inflated. Im reminded of Timmy Chang, broke NCAA record for most career passing yards. barely got drafted or undrafted. hes in the CFL right now.

Besides that I think CJ's yards avg is way superior to Crabtree which I think is somthing overlooked. with double sometimes triple coverage to both one got more yards per catch.

All that being said itts very very very hard to overlook one key stat.Crabtree had 94% passes thrown his way caught. now BECAUSE hes in a spread system that number is even more impressive. non stop passes come his way. and hes snagging 94% of passes? That is the definition of hands. We havent had potential safe mits like that since Jerry.

a few more yards 3-4, i couldnt tell you if johnson was double teamed, but crabs sure was doubled and trippled

3-4 yards on average. per catch that adds up and Johnson was definetly facing double and triple coverages per game. that i can atest to.